The Fred/Gracy Affair, and the Inter-Forum Aftermath Thereof

[Aragorn]

I just find it disappointing that it went this way for the pair of you.

All I can say to that — and they're not even my words — is that I do not blame people for making mistakes, but that I do expect people to take responsibility for them.

[Gio]

Well, given that Project Avalon's Fearless Leader™ only allows communication between Project Avalon and The One Truth when it's a one-sided (and unequivocally false) allegation toward us while hush-hushing away any serious attempts at inter-forum communication and reconciliation, I will be replying to some of Malisa/Mashika's statements here, so that she will be able to read them, as well as the other two idiots who replied to her thread. Because we are transparent, we are honest and sincere, and we still have a sense of honor and dignity.

And yes, I count Fearless Leader™ among those idiots, since he still doesn't understand first thing about autism, and yet he likes to prostrate himself before his faithful flock as an expert in psychology and neurology. So let me address that little bit first, before I get into replying to Malisa.

The belief that autistic people are devoid of empathy is completely false, and based purely upon the superficial observation of an autistic person's physical reactions — and even then still, it usually pertains to a low-functioning autistic person. It has nothing to do with what an autistic person — and especially not a high-functioning autistic person — is actually feeling.

Auties have a far greater quantity of mirror neurons and are generally far more empathetic than non-autistic people, unless they are afflicted with one of the well-known cluster personality disorders such as narcissism and/or psychopathy. The well-respected and longstanding Project Avalon member Simon "they will never ban me from PA" Parkes is a textbook example of an autistic psychopath. He has no empathy whatsoever, and by consequence, also no sense of ethics, no sense of guilt, no remorse, no compassion, and no mercy.

Instead of reading alt-right pseudoscience inside of an echo chamber, you — i.e. Project Avalon's Fearless Leader™ — may actually want to delve into some truly scientific studies regarding autism. And I will give you a very important hint too: make sure those studies do not come from US American psychiatrists/neurologists, because they're still lagging about 50 years behind on their European colleagues.

And there's a reason for that too, namely that Hans Asperger's research was banned in the USA after World War II because it was in German. It was only in the 1970s that someone in the USA had the courage of revisiting Asperger's work, but the American prejudices and misunderstandings regarding autism have remained, and are still being perpetrated by the pseudoscientific nonsense merchants of the ultra-conservative alt-right community that you — i.e. the Bwana from Ghana (© Gio) — have now so comfortably settled yourself into.

---

And now onto Malisa. I do have to say that she does have quite a sense of drama, and I can also see how her sense of drama would be perfectly in tune with the general hypocrisy ruling Project Avalon. So here goes.



Very Shakespearean. Bravo. If I were a typical Project Avalon member, I'd fall for it, hook-line-sinker. Well done. You're a good actress, but not good enough yet. Maybe you ought to study Meryl Streep instead of Kim Kardashian. Or for that matter, ita.

I do not hate you. Seriously, I do not hate you. But after what you have done, I also cannot respect you anymore, and I loathe your duplicity and your backstabbing. And I do tend to make fun of people (and concepts) that I loathe. It's called sarcasm.

Also, nothing of what I said was a lie, because as I said in the post of mine that you are responding to, we've got all of that stuff on record in the mod room. I could copy and paste it here, even, but that would be unethical, because it's all stuff from private messages between yourself and myself — which I did report to the mod room whenever it concerned something that I felt was important enough to share with the management here, although I did not report each and every conversation we've ever had.

The PMs that you sent me while pretending to be your younger sister, ranting about how Project Avalon had so badly mistreated you — "you" in this sentence referring to yourself, Malisa, not to your sister, who was supposedly using your account, both here and at Project Avalon — were among the ones I reported to the mod room. As the matter of fact, I synchronistically happened to come upon that report thread again in our archives only a few days ago while I was looking for an old report thread on something completely unrelated.



You also had my private email address, and you had an active account here, and you could have asked me that question of why I retired Christian when he sabotaged his email address so that his notification emails would bounce, while I did not do the same thing with your account when your own notification emails bounced. I already gave you that answer earlier, but I'll reiterate: you were still connecting here, while Christian had made it abundantly clear in literal wording that he was not coming back.

It's that simple. And you could have asked me that over here, or by way of an email. But instead of asking me, you went into that members-only witch-hunting thread at Project Avalon and rhetorically asked that very same question there, with the clear intent of casting suspicion on myself after I had already been banned from Project Avalon for no reason by Fearless Leader™ himself, and without even having been notified of such, and thus, without that I would even have known about your question if someone else had not brought it to my attention. That's not just stupid, Masha; that's malevolence.

I'm not a liar, Masha. You are. You're playing games with people. You're telling people conflicting stories, and you're incredibly capricious. You'll go away on a long journey and you won't be back in a long time, and then two days later you're back as if nothing happened. You were the Captain of a Russian guerrilla team of teenagers in the trenches in Ukraine and you didn't know how to set up a proxy server, but you're also a programmer in artificial intelligence development. Right.

Project Avalon might believe you — in fact, I'm pretty certain that they will — but someone with my life's experience isn't going to fall for that anymore, nor for your crocodile tears. And believe me, I usually do fall for that stuff, because I'm a big softie — much more so than your new buddy, Fearless Leader™, whose empathy is only feigned. But then again, he's a good actor too, and he too had me fooled for a while. The two of you will probably make a good tag team, and history has already abundantly shown that Project Avalon loves tag teams.



Nope, I don't hate you. I actually feel sorry for you, because you must have a badly fucked-up ego to be putting on such a display and to be playing those games the way you have been doing all along.

I don't hate you at all. But I will never trust you again after what you did. That's a given. And I'm not the only one here who feels this way.



You are completely misrepresenting things — again, because you did it before at Project Avalon, in that members-only thread where you were talking behind my back.

First of all, I did not ask you to accept Fred as a friend. What I did tell you was that Fred's friendship for you and his attempts to listen to you and counsel you while he was still pretending to be Gracy May, were genuine, and that he truly did care for you. But because he had painted himself into a corner by pretending to be somebody else, he could not tell you the truth about that, as much as he wanted to.

After you found out the truth of his false identity, you went ballistic — we've got all of that on record in the mod room too — and you hated his guts. Now, I can perfectly relate to how you were really feeling about that beneath the hyperbole, because I have been in a similar situation myself once, and I did tell you that story. But you continued going ballistic and you absolutely hated Fred, and I just couldn't talk any sense into you.

All I was asking you to do was to consider Fred's vantage, and how all of that had evolved beyond his control due to him having painted himself into a corner. And I believe I may have asked you to forgive him, and to consider that his friendship was genuine.

But due to your hyperbolic reaction and the pressure you were putting on myself at the time, I realize now that I may not have worded things as well as I should have. Because that is one of my autism-related shortcomings: when I am experiencing stress, then my communication skills start failing and then my dyslexia kicks into overdrive, and I then choose the wrong words, even at the risk of sounding blunt, even though I must say that I don't believe I was being blunt with you.

And here's another thing for you to ponder... How is Fred's impersonation of Gracy May over at Project Avalon any worse than the games you have been playing with people, and that you're still playing now over at Project Avalon? Fred lied about his identity. You lied about almost everything else.

---

The above is all that I'm responding to from your Project Avalon post, Masha, because the rest of it is merely a dramatic repetition of what you had already said higher up in said post. I am also not going to be monitoring that Project Avalon thread, because that place just makes me nauseous. This was a one-time response to your opening post on said PA thread, and this is where the communication ends for me.

Again, I do not hate you. But you've lost my respect. I was also not singling you out in my previous post on this thread here, but you were being brought up by someone else regarding your earlier behavior, and so I simply responded to that. With a more than fair dose of sarcasm, I'll admit that, but then again, when someone causes me to lose my respect for them, then they are fair game for such a treatment.

After all, I have feelings too, notwithstanding Fearless Leader™'s feeble attempts at making Project Avalon believe that he's an expert psychologist — who cannot even see the beam in his own eye and should therefore not be commenting on the splinter in the eyes of other people — and you did betray not just myself, but even this very forum, where you had always been welcomed with respect, honesty and genuine friendship. And you did it while surrounding yourself with sycophants, hypocrites, overinflated egos and emotional manipulators.

Of course, you are not the only one to have betrayed us and lied to us, but then let it be your consolation that those others, too, are fair game for sarcasm from my end — Fearless Leader™ up front.

Frank ...


"I'm not a liar, Masha. You are."

^
Masha

[Gio]

Comrades it appears were in the mist of a "Special Operation."

[Aragorn]

Comrades it appears were in the mist of a "Special Operation."

I believe you could be right about that, Brother. I really do. I'll PM you in a few minutes about what I mean.

[sourcetruth]

And yet, we have in our mod room here several reported private conversations between myself and her, in which she was ranting and fuming about Project Avalon, and — check this out — while pretending to be her younger sister. It makes for a very interesting read.

So she's not just a backstabber, but she's also a two-faced opportunist and a compulsive liar.

That is quite interesting, and definitely strange.
I’m not surprised that she made an Avalon post about your last comment. She is playing the victim again by acting like she is being hated when she is just being criticized, refusing to admit doing anything wrong. People who act like she does should be called out and criticized for their behavior, because we should make it clear to others that we don’t tolerate this kind of behavior.
Malisa, I do not hate you, but I have lost respect for you, similar to Aragorn. This is not about hating you, this is about how you have treated me and others in the past and present. You should be respectful to people, even those you disagree with, and if you aren’t, you won’t be respected in return.
All of these behaviors you have been called out on have the same root, the disrespect of others.

Yes, and that is textbook cult mentality, including the figurehead of the Fearless Leader™, who in reality is like the emperor without clothes

Indeed. As long as their leader lets them free to explore right wing propaganda and misinformation, they will be loyal to him, jumping on the bandwagon that he leads.

I believe you could be right about that, Brother. I really do. I'll PM you in a few minutes about what I mean.

What do you mean about this? I’m curious.

[Aragorn]

I believe you could be right about that, Brother. I really do. I'll PM you in a few minutes about what I mean.

What do you mean about this? I’m curious.

I'll PM you about it too.

[Gio]

For Bill/Malisa ...

♪ In the night you hide from the madman
You're longing to be
But it all comes out on the inside
Eventually ♪

Here at the Western World

We got our own skinny girls

Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t7jKChQZZnU

[Gio]

Re: Oh Frank, how low have you got, it hurts my heart

Quote Posted by Justplain (here)
Also, I don't consider myself woke or brainwashed, and to me nothing rational could justify the Russian invasion of Ukraine, despite having seen and empathizing with Oliver Stone's Ukraine on fire.

Quote Posted by Mashika (here)
Is there something rational that justifies USA/UK/Canada/Etc fake wars? Are you planning to open a 'hate disguised as an opinion' thread about Yemen/Palestine and other places soon?

Important Question: How do you feel about your country following the US lead into helping kill innocents in Ukraine just to blame Russia? How do you feel about your country sending arms to kill kids and elderly in Donbass?

Would it be a good war if Canada/Uk/Us would have gone to war with Ukraine over the rape/killing of hundres/thousands of kids over the last 8 years, plus the killing of their parents and anyone else they could find over there, just because ethnicity?

Would you be clamoring for victory of the west over Ukraine? Or nah

Also this thread had nothing to do with Ukraine, it's like you just had to find a reason to bring that topic up somehow, no matter what This is almost like Bible-Thumping lol

--

By the way, 9 of May! That date the nazi people hate with their hearts, and want to erase from history

Victory Day is ours!

Ah didn't take too long for the N word to come out of her mouth ...

[Gio]

Oops he did it again ...

Bill what was determining your decision process allowing for Malisa/Mashika to open this gem of a thread on the forums 'General Discussion' column - for the world to see your wort's and all close up ...

Just another fine example of your overall poor judgement and leadership skills ...

Can anyone really wonder why you've gone through so many moderators over the years ...

Re: Oh Frank, how low have you got, it hurts my heart

Mod note from Bill:

Other moderators have suggested (and I agree) that this thread should soon be moved to a members only section, as (a) it seems now to be close to running its course, and (b) it was purposefully placed by Mashika in 'General Discussion' specifically because she wanted it to serve as a visible open letter to Frank, a former Avalon member (Aragorn) who has now been unsubscribed following his uncritical support for Fred Steeves' manipulative and unethical deception (masquerading as 'Gracy') on several different levels. There's no way that anyone who cares, and who understands what happened, can be blind to that.

The Avalon mods fully support Mashika in her justifiable anger (probably now well expressed, we think!) , but yes, compared to very major world events swirling around us every day, all this is indeed a personal issue which will be of little interest to Avalon's many guests who now regularly number 35x-40x as many members at any one time.

That's not to trivialize the hurt and injustice experienced by someone we care about, but all these things need to be held in broad perspective as best we can. We're not closing the thread, and we're not removing it from view just yet. But we'll probably move it aside pretty soon.

(And I should add, in response to Kryztian's reminder about my earlier thinking-aloud thread about an amnesty for some unsubscribed Avalon members, there's absolutely no way any member of Frank's forum who is currently unsubscribed would ever be welcome here again. My earlier thoughts were naive and way too trusting. One only has to read their public comments to understand that's not now ever going to happen on my watch.)



And — inasmuch as I refer to the far more important issues surrounding and potentially impacting every one of us right now.

[sourcetruth]

Bill Ryan said the following:

(And I should add, in response to Kryztian's reminder about my earlier thinking-aloud thread about an amnesty for some unsubscribed Avalon members, there's absolutely no way any member of Frank's forum who is currently unsubscribed would ever be welcome here again. My earlier thoughts were naive and way too trusting. One only has to read their public comments to understand that's not now ever going to happen on my watch.)

And that is the final wedge to be driven between Project Avalon and TOT.

[Gio]

Perhaps, but there's nothing Bill Ryan can ever do to sever the conscious bonds of the original Project Avalon's - The Ground Crew

[Lord Sidious]

Boy oh boy

[Aragorn]

Oops he did it again ...

Bill what was determining your decision process allowing for Malisa/Mashika to open this gem of a thread on the forums 'General Discussion' column - for the world to see your wort's and all close up ...

Populism — i.e. catering to what sells well in terms of thread views and traffic among his sect — in combination with the arrogance of living in that ivory tower on that parochial island called Project Avalon.

He's leading a cult — one that provides him with the financial means for survival — and he and his flock are the chosen ones, the enlightened, the awake & aware, the new Übermenschen.

Just another fine example of your overall poor judgement and leadership skills ...

And yet he's obsessed with the concept of leadership, from his (true or false) past-life recollections, over the movies that he likes watching, all the way up to how often he uses and/or refers to the term and the concept. He desperately wants to be a leader, albeit that it does not matter to him whether he'd be a good leader or a bad leader. Leaders have followers and worshipers, and to a clinical narcissist like him, that's all that matters.

Well, and those donations, of course. Not that he's materialistic, but even he has to pay his bills, and the donations do make that possible. And there's certainly enough donation money in his piggy bank to allow for some squandering — like the couple of hundreds of USD wasted on that vBulletin 5 license that he threw out the window in a single day because he didn't like the look of it.

And then there was that USD $1'000+ fundraising for Hervé — which I myself also donated a small amount of money in — when Hervé had gone missing and turned out to have been admitted to a hospital with some mysterious affliction, of which it was later conveniently claimed that it must have been an early affliction with Covid-19 while it was most likely rather just a consequence of severe alcohol abuse, only to have Hervé then connect to the forum again by way of his Gwin Ru sock puppet — his earlier test account, which had been renamed by Fearless Leader™ as per Hervé's request without anyone knowing about it, staff included — and continue posting his usual stuff.

No qualm there for Fearless Leader™. There was a need for money, and said money had been provided for through the fundraising campaign. Case closed. How the money was really spent, nobody will ever really know, and by now everyone has already long forgotten about that incident. The normal donations are also still coming in anyway, and they will keep on coming in for a long time still. After all, people will do a lot for the privilege of belonging to an elite of chosen awake & aware ones, with such an eloquent and charming Fearless Leader™ making them feel special — at least for a while, and possibly a bit longer still if they are of the female persuasion.

Can anyone really wonder why you've gone through so many moderators over the years ...

I for one certainly won't, having been a member of his staff for little under a year (and having worked with him behind the scenes on technical matters for several months more before that). Not only did I see them all come and go, but eventually I myself had also had enough of the way he ran his forum, his double standards, his populism, his ego, and the way he treats his staff members like dirt if they don't cater to his obsessive whims.


The following is an excerpt from their mods chat on the Discord platform, dating back to April 2020. I was suffering from my first infection with Covid-19 at that point in time.

	Bill: Forum has been down for minutes on end. I wasn't timing it, but it felt like a good 10 mins or more. @Aragorn. @Tommy, Please — WE HAVE TO FIX THIS. Aragorn: @Bill : I know ─ I was thinking the same thing ─ but unfortunately my hands are tied. Bill: Just get onto SingleHop and give them a really hard time. I'm not technically qualified to do that. Be very assertive and clear. Tell them this is unacceptable for us. This is what we pay them for, to help us with our technical issues. Tell them to make this work for us. Or else we'll move to another host. Bill: This is why we brought you to the team here — not as a mod, but as an admin to help us with our many problems. Aragorn: I'm afraid it's not that simple, Bill. Not only am I not good at being a hardass, but this doesn't really have anything to do with SingleHop. The problem is that the current server is dying. It's underpowered and its hard disks are beginning to fail, which means that it will regularly get the hiccups when it needs to access data from the disks ─ or even write to it, and that in itself causes a second and very serious problem, i.e. we're currently running a very real risk that the database is getting corrupted by disk errors. And meanwhile, members keep on asking to add stuff to the library or embed videos that aren't embeddable unless we add them to the server first. Aragorn: In addition to that, if I were to even attempt to shove the responsibility off on SingleHop ─ which they cannot help us with ─ they will be adamant to point out that what's going on right now is our problem and our responsibility to solve. Just look at the reply we got when I was complaining to them about the new version of CentOS they put on the new server not being compatible with our current forum software. They simply bounced the ball back to us. Bill: (They simply bounced the ball back to us.) — well, raise hell and elevate it to the guy's supervisor. Of course, they can fix anything, if they care enough. Just be assertive. I don't care if you're not good at that. Become good at that. Bill: I could do that myself, but I just don't understand the language. I just want this fixed. Enough is enough. Quit being a nice guy and become a real problem customer to them. I'll even PAY more. I don't care. We have to fix this. Bill: Get on the phone (and I'll pay for that, too) — if you think your spoken English is good enough. That way, you can just grab the guy and not let go. Note: Discord is an interactive chat. You can see when someone is typing, because it will say so, with three blinking dots. And so he saw that I was typing, and then he wrote this here below. Bill: You're writing a lot there. I don't want a long reply. I want a short one. "Yes, I'll do whatever it takes to fix this."

He's quite demanding and he can be quite intimidating, and so his kindhearted and level-headed staff members will all either simply hold their tongue and take a backseat, or they will request a sabbatical from which they then never return, while the sycophants and the bigger egos will unconditionally keep standing by his side without ever questioning his judgment, still blinded by his fake charm and the spin he puts on everything.

[Lord Sidious]

Having interacted with him in skype, I can say that he isn't easy to deal with.
Especially when you're outta hand grenades.

[Fred Steeves]

Having interacted with him in skype, I can say that he isn't easy to deal with.
Especially when you're outta hand grenades.

This would be a question for modwiz as well (from back in 2011 for those who weren't around then): I seem to recall a recorded conversation circulating around where Bill fully acknowledges that there's a new group of Avalonians Charles (Stephen Hodges) has hand picked known as "The 18", had no problem with it at that time, but then later on proceeded to throw a public shit fit as though he had been betrayed and had just now learned of it.

Am I remembering that correctly?