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Thread: Native American Mounds & Giants

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    [This thread was split off from the thread Space Archaeologist Wants Your Help To Find Ancient Sites , which is about a project requesting public help to help find new archaeological sites using satellite imagery.]

    "Even if we all just dig around in our own "back yards," who knows what we might find." More mounds maybe.
    Last edited by bsbray, 22nd March 2016 at 20:30. Reason: Explained split thread

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    Yes, there are tens of thousands of ancient mounds in the US alone, also some in Canada and of course a ton of them in Mexico where they are more well-known.

    For those that live in the US, there are ancient mounds in most states, maybe even all of them, east of the Mississippi River in the US, and a lot of crazy stuff west of it too. If you live in or near Ohio there are thousands of mounds in that state alone, not even counting ancient earthen walls, stone forts and other archaeological sites. There are lots of pre-historic constructions in all of the states surrounding Ohio and along the Mississippi River and its tributaries. The Smithsonian took and hid a lot of bizarre things out of some them, from giant skeletons to tablets with undeciphered scripts (Native Americans aren't supposed to have had any written language), and some mounds have probably never been excavated at all. The biggest known mound in the US is on the other side of the Mississippi from St. Louis, Missouri (Cahokia Mound), and it looks almost like a Mayan construction.

    Here are some pictures to give an idea of what you might be able to find in the US:


    Grave Creek Mound, West Virginia




    Fort Ancient Earthworks, Ohio




    Great Serpent Mound, Ohio (at the site of an ancient meteor impact that would have caused catastrophic damage)




    Cahokia Mounds, Illinois




    An artist's depiction of what the city at Cahokia would have looked like at its peak (~1200 AD), with an estimated 40,000 inhabitants (a very large city in its time, twice the population of Rome in 1200 AD):




    Another artist's rendering of Cahokia:




    Artist's depiction of a lunar alignment at the Newark Earthworks, Ohio (many of these sites were astronomical clocks of sorts, almost like Stonehenge and other pre-historic sites in Europe):




    An artist's depiction of the Kincaid Site in Illinois:




    A cross-section of what may be found in some of the mounds:




    There's tons about these ancient sites, and especially the cultures that built them, that we still do not understand at all. Why so many cultures built mounds isn't understood. These mounds, especially the larger ones, require an enormous amount of work from a community of thousands of people. Early estimates were that it would take a community of thousands of people a period of years to construct even one of some of these mounds.

    Interestingly, a team of researchers working in a 72-foot-high, 538,000-square-foot mound in Louisana dated back to around 1200 BC (~3200 years ago) concluded after excavating the site that it was built within 90 days. The layers of dirt they excavated actually showed no signs of having been rained on during construction, so they are talking about the massive mound having been built so fast that it was built between rains in Louisiana. It seems likely that it would have been constructed in an even shorter time than 3 months. This is not a dry area of the US; this is swampland by the coast, at the mouth of the Mississippi River. They estimate at least 3,000 people working steadily, carrying 55-pound buckets of dirt all day for three months, might have been able to do the job, but I would personally not be surprised if some other kind of technology or technique was used that we haven't thought of.

    As you can see above at the Kincaid site, some houses were built on top of large, steep mounds. Imagine the work it would require just to make that mound. A lot damn more than it would take to build the hut on top of it, that's for sure. So something is "off" about this. It's possible that one culture built the mounds and a later culture came along and built the more primitive hut on top of it.

    Some early researchers even suggested that maybe pre-historic Native Americans had tamed the mastodon and got it to plough the earth as a domesticated animal, the same way that Europeans tamed elephants and used them in warfare until they made them go extinct in that part of the world.

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    Tamed mastodons. Wow. I'm thinking of Oliphants. How about giants? Aren't some of those artifacts that the Smithsonian took away very large humanoid bones? There are certainly many American Indian legends of giants.

    I'm fascinated by this and very annoyed at those who hide this stuff. Thanks very much for sharing these images.

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    Fascinating, Bsbray. That is certainly a lot of work, just to put little huts on top.

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    Quote Originally posted by Dreamtimer View Post
    How about giants? Aren't some of those artifacts that the Smithsonian took away very large humanoid bones? There are certainly many American Indian legends of giants.
    Yes:

    Giant Skeletons & The Smithsonian

    A host of researchers, including Vieira, Fritz Zimmerman, and Ross Hamilton, have publicized approximately 1,500 newspaper articles from the 1800s through the mid-1900s reporting on huge skeletons found at sites scattered across America. These articles mention skeletons ranging in height from seven to eighteen feet. In response, a 2012 reissued Smithsonian Magazine article related, “There was no prehistoric race of giants” (Science News (3/23/2012) “Measure your giant carefully and his size will shrink”). The statement only deepened the controversy.

    One fact cited as evidence for the conspiracy theory is that the Smithsonian has never displayed the giant skeletons. That’s true, but few of the large skeletons were sent to them. The main purpose of their investigation into mounds was to determine who built the mounds and to gather skulls as specimens. The other reason is that today the Smithsonian has less than 300 skeletal remains in storage, and those are from Central and South America. All other burial remains they held were repatriated and reburied starting in 1989 (Path of Souls).

    [...]

    The Smithsonian’s Mound Survey Project

    The Smithsonian’s Division of Mound Exploration (and the resulting Mound Survey Project) was established by an act of Congress in 1881. Cyrus Thomas was the project director and author of the annual reports’ sections on mounds. It is known that he often used the written reports from his field agents verbatim. The main project ran from 1882 to 1891. Three field agents were employed at a monthly pay of $125, which had to pay for travel, lodging, meals, and the hire of local laborers. Thomas related that the project opened “2,000 mounds” and recovered “40,000 specimens” (Path of Souls). The total number of skeletons found by the project isn’t known, because many mounds had jumbled skeletal remains, partial remains, cremations, and because many skeletons had simply disintegrated.

    Our analysis of the Bureau of Ethnology Annual Reports (1887; 1894) revealed that 17 “large” skeletons were excavated from mounds by the field agents. They ranged in length from 6’ 7” to 7’ 6”. At least 14 of them were seven feet or more in length. The mounds the large skeletons were recovered from were from Adena, Hopewell, and Mississippian sites. However, half of the seven footers were found in Adena Era mounds in West Virginia, primarily along the Kanawha River Valley (Path of Souls).

    It is important to note that the Bureau’s reports mentioned numerous other “large” skeletons that were found, but many were so disintegrated that accurate measuring was impossible. In essence, the Smithsonian didn’t cover up the discovery of these tall people; it simply didn’t call them “giants.” But this led us to look at other reports made by mainstream archaeologists.

    “Modern” Archaeological Discoveries of Giant Skeletons from Mounds

    In May 1950 William Webb and Charles Snow of the University of Kentucky began an excavation of a large Dover, Kentucky, burial mound. In the report on the six-month-long excavation (Webb, W. & Snow, C. (1959) The Dover Mound, U. of KY.), it was explained that the mound had been erected over several smaller mounds. Several log-lined tombs were found at the mound’s base. Carbon dating placed the mound in the Adena Era (220–300 BC).

    They found 55 burials, most of which had almost completely disintegrated. However, several log tombs at the base had survived fairly intact. Several skeletons of six-foot tall, robust men were found, but in one tomb the remains of four individuals were found lying. One skeleton was, “one of the largest known to Adena: the skull-foot field measurement is 84 inches.” Copper artifacts were found with this 7-foot-tall man along with mica, beads, flint, and shell artifacts (The Dover Mound)

    In 1958, archaeologist Don Dragoo of the Carnegie Museum excavated the Cresap Mound located south of Moundsville, WV. Dragoo found 54 burials in the mound. One skeleton was found in a prominent log-covered tomb under the mound base floor with a tablet, shell artifacts, red ochre, flint, blades, and beads. The skeleton found inside this tomb was a “tall adult male” with “flexed knees” … “When measured in the tomb his length was approximately 7.04 feet” [7 feet one inch] (Dragoo, D. (1963) “Mounds for the dead,” Annals of the Carnegie Museum, V. 57.).

    There are numerous other examples of mainstream archaeologists excavating large skeletons from Adena mounds. The Welcome Mound in West Virginia was excavated in 1957 by Frank Setzler of the Smithsonian. Inside a log tomb he found the badly deteriorated skeleton of a “large” man. Because of the artifacts found with him, the man was determined to have been a shaman. Setzler also mentioned that the 7-foot-tall skeleton found at the Dover Mound was also a shaman and that a similar shaman burial had been found at the Ayres Mound in Kentucky (Dragoo). Excavation of the Beech Bottom Mound near Wheeling, West Virginia also revealed a shaman buried in a prominent tomb (Webb, W. & Snow, C.). A 1940 excavation of the Half Moon Mound site along the Ohio River in West Virginia revealed another elite burial of a shaman (Webb, W. & Snow, C.). Unfortunately, in many of these cases the skeletal remains had almost completely disintegrated making measurements impossible. In summary, it is clear that many Adena Era mound burials were of elite individuals. These individuals were exceedingly tall, and many of them were probably shamans involved with the Native American death journey.

    Skeptical Claims & Adena Population Height: A Statistical View

    Virtually all of the claims made by skeptics about the large skeletons have been shown to be false (Little, G., 2014, “The truth about giant skeletons in American Indian Mounds- 1,2.” http://www.apmagazine.info). There is no doubt that many tall individuals were interred in prominent tombs in America’s ancient mounds. Many of them were shamans and others were no doubt chiefs. But the important question is: could this simply be due to chance? Many people point to tall basketball players as a way of implying that tall people are found everywhere. But statistically speaking, in the modern world, the actual percentage of people who reach 7 feet in height is 0.000007%—or one in every 146,000 people. Applying this number to the Smithsonian’s discoveries, they would have had to excavate 2.5 million skeletons to find 17 individuals of that height (Path of Souls). But the Hopewell and Adena were much shorter: Adena men averaged 5’ 4” while Hopewell men averaged 5’ 6”. Applying the relevant statistical tool to the Adena height shows that only 0.0000002% of them would reach 7 feet (one of every 1.4 million people). Clearly, something unexplained is at work.
    http://atlantisrisingmagazine.com/20...rs-in-america/


    Not all of the skeletons found in these mounds were giants, and apparently most of them were rather short by modern standards. That make the ones that are "giant" by today's standards stick out even more. And the idea as presented above (by Gregory Little, who authored The Illustrated Encyclopedia of Native American Mounds & Earthworks) is that the tall guys held important positions in the tribe.

    A lot of comparisons have been drawn between Native Americans and civilizations in the ancient Middle East, even a genetic "halpoid group X" connection between some old Cherokee lines and the ancient inhabitants of the area around the Sea of Galilee. There were giants in the Middle East too, as recorded in the Bible, Arab stories and elsewhere, and who were these giants in the Middle East? They were kings and leaders of their tribes. Why? Because the people of great stature were "sons of God," as the Bible puts it. The Book of Enoch puts it even more plainly, that they were the offpspring between "fallen angels" and mankind. Just as a very angry Jehovah later ordered the Jews to exterminate all of their tribes after the Exodus from Egypt, Native Americans also say that they made war on giant tribes of cannabalistic, "evil" giants, until they were annihilated.

    Maybe we could split a separate topic off for this?

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    I'll vote for a thread on the question of giants. I've already heard so many interesting stories. And this thread can remain focused on the satellite research.

    One interview I listened to was of Tom Horne and Chris Putnam. They were discussing their research which involved Mt. Graham and the Vatican telescope. They were talking to an apache man about some ancient stuff such as the Anasazi, and he told them a story his grandfather would have told back in the day.

    A 'snake priest' came and taught the ancient shamans some rituals and spells which they mastered. When they were performed in the kivas they caused portals to open in the ground through which came savage cannibalistic giants and the people had to flee or were eaten. The giants ended up cannibalizing each other and the remainder were killed off.

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    Here is an interesting story regarding the Lockett Ranch, in Taylor Mississippi. Ed recounts what his family went through when he was ten years old. The ranch came under siege when they contracted a logging company to log a remote, never before explored portion of their vast property. It turns out that portion of the land was actually the territory of a large group of Dogmen. The Dogmen retaliated the encroachment by attacking the Lockett ranch home.

    The backstory behind this property is that it was once part of the Chickasaw lands. They also had experienced problems with the Dogmen. They could not deal with them alone so they decided to bring in some bigger muscle to hopefully take care of the problem. To do so, they tried to instigate a war between the Dogmen and the giants (Lofa - (possibly?) Bigfoot) by venturing onto the lands of the giants, stealing some bones from their burial grounds, taking them onto the Dogmen territory, and burying them in the ground. The burial grounds of the giants are described as large mounds, surrounded by stones, with branch structures in the middle.

    The story has been broken up into three parts. Part two (below) is where the burial mounds are discussed. Part three has yet to be released.

    Part 1
    Last edited by Aragorn, 23rd March 2016 at 19:32. Reason: fixed your video links ;)

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    I think it is important to not lump all Bigfoot into being evil Giants. IMHO there are different types of bigfoot, some being malevolent while others are benign.

    The articles below says the Lofa are a bigfoot-like ogre.

    http://www.native-languages.org/chickasaw-legends.htm
    http://www.native-languages.org/morelegends/lofa.htm

    Lofa are: A foul-smelling, bigfoot-like ogre.

    Lofa is a malevolent, ogre-like monster of Chickasaw folklore. His name literally means "flayer" or "skinner," a reference to his gruesome habit of flaying the skin from his victims. In some legends he attempts to abduct Chickasaw women. He is sometimes described as a giant and other times as a large, hairy, smelly man, leading some people to associate him with the Bigfoot legend.
    Last edited by lift the veil, 23rd March 2016 at 15:56.

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    Quote Originally posted by lift the veil View Post
    I think it is important to not lump all Bigfoot into being evil Giants. IMHO there are different types of bigfoot, some being malevolent while others are benign.
    And also not to lump all giants into the bigfoot category, either. The remains of giants taken out of these mounds, commonly about 7 feet tall (out of those attested to in Smithsonian literature from the digs anyway -- if there was a 15 footer found, I think it's a legitimate question if they would even want to report that and open that can of worms or not) mostly appeared to be normal humans aside from their great height. I know there are at least a couple of additional anomalies, with 6 fingers and toes per limb, and double rows of teeth, and at least in one case there's a report of very tall skeletons dug up in Pennsylvania that appeared to have horn-like bone growths on their heads (I have this report in a Reader's Digest compilation called Mysteries of the Unexplained).

    It's interesting to bring up the "bigfoot" and "dogman" type of legends though (our modern names and ideas for them, not those of the natives of course). It's hard to imagine how much has taken place on this continent before we had written records of it.

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    MK Davis is hot on a trail that may link these mounds, glyphs, artifacts and giants to our ancient ancestors.

    While he's keeping it all close to his vest, it appears that he see a connection that began off the coast of california: the first civilization.

    more to follow...

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    Quote Originally posted by bsbray View Post
    And also not to lump all giants into the bigfoot category, either. The remains of giants taken out of these mounds, commonly about 7 feet tall (out of those attested to in Smithsonian literature from the digs anyway -- if there was a 15 footer found, I think it's a legitimate question if they would even want to report that and open that can of worms or not) mostly appeared to be normal humans aside from their great height. I know there are at least a couple of additional anomalies, with 6 fingers and toes per limb, and double rows of teeth, and at least in one case there's a report of very tall skeletons dug up in Pennsylvania that appeared to have horn-like bone growths on their heads (I have this report in a Reader's Digest compilation called Mysteries of the Unexplained).

    It's interesting to bring up the "bigfoot" and "dogman" type of legends though (our modern names and ideas for them, not those of the natives of course). It's hard to imagine how much has taken place on this continent before we had written records of it.
    Yes, I agree 100%. In reading many comments on Bigfoot videos I am shocked at how many people equate the Bigfoot with the Nephilim. I point out to them that the Nephilim in the bible were described as being giant, mighty men of renown. Goliath was a giant man, not a giant Sasquatch. But that usually just goes over their heads, and the Sasquatch = Nephilim comments continue on.

    I think there are a vast numbers of hybrid type beings or chimeras that were once populous on the Earth, and they have been relegated to being just myth, imaginative "stories" or tales, rather than being real.

    It makes one wonder if the rampant hybrid creations of unscrupulous Watchers (or even men) by mating with any variety of animals, were later shut down by some governing force, by modifying the DNA combination rules to prevent such abominations. Some DNA mechanism must have been changed, turned off.

    Our history has been stolen from us, and I for one am highly ****ed. I have heard of many stories where the Smithsonian has confiscated giant skeletons and then went on to deny that they had anything to do with it. I can only imagine what they are hiding down in the bowels of that "museum." Just like the Vatican and the history horde they have amassed.
    Last edited by lift the veil, 23rd March 2016 at 20:39.

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    I wish there was a way I could publish an article and pictures I have of 1931-32 from a dig east of Chicago into Wisconsin by the University of Illinois as well as other schools. The article is dated from then written by archaeologists and is in the Illinois State Blue Book. Among other things it accounts for all monies spent and documents the finds! The article authors refer to the 'original occupants of North America" as the "LONG HEADS" and the current race as in the ones here now and that were here then as being the "ROUND HEADS" and also they state it is quite plain that the long heads were older! The new comers replaced them.

    These were buried as royals and in a different soil than the round heads, deeper also and even below the original ground level from before the mound was built! Anyway, the articles are many from several schools all up and down the Mississippi River valley documenting county by county just how many they actually dug up and hauled off! This is just one river! It doesn't account for the other states and other rivers in parts of southern Illinois which today is mostly swamp! They found a lot there too but its in another year book!

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    Quote Originally posted by Jengelen View Post
    I wish there was a way I could publish an article and pictures I have of 1931-32 from a dig east of Chicago into Wisconsin by the University of Illinois as well as other schools. The article is dated from then written by archaeologists and is in the Illinois State Blue Book. Among other things it accounts for all monies spent and documents the finds! The article authors refer to the 'original occupants of North America" as the "LONG HEADS" and the current race as in the ones here now and that were here then as being the "ROUND HEADS" and also they state it is quite plain that the long heads were older! The new comers replaced them.
    If you can give me the name of the article, the authors and where it was published I can try to find a copy of it. If you have a physical copy maybe you can find someone or a library with a scanner and get digital images. This would be a really interesting document to have.

    There is a museum either in West Virginia or Ohio that has some skulls taken from some of these mounds, and at least one of them on display is elongated. I saw it in a YouTube video showing the inside of one of these museums (there are many of them in towns near excavated mounds) but the quality wasn't good enough for me to tell if there were three plates across the front of the skull like modern humans or just one single plate as in the truly anomalous Paracas skulls from Peru. Either way the cultural connection is obvious.

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