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Thread: You Are Not Your Thoughts

  1. #151
    Senior Member Aianawa's Avatar
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    Great questions, guided lots of feelings within me, thankyou.

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  3. #152
    Senior Member Aianawa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by lcam88 View Post
    ... is certainly introduced into the mind... You need to have faith that it may exist.



    Or maybe the mind is your mind, and the thoughts are your thoughts. It depends on who you know yourself to be, I suppose.

    Knowing thyself, it seems, is a requisite to all knowing in general.

    Are you one who would shy away from responsibility, who would externalize it and surrender control to forces you accept to be beyond your reach? If so, then indeed your mind is, perhaps, not your mind.

    Or are you one who conspires to dominate the forces about you that are just beyond your reach? Do you seek to push the envelope of your mind to include more and more? To know what you do not yet know, to perfect performance in a domain where you may only train, to perceive and recognize what you now may only glimpse? If so, then perhaps your mind is more than merely your mind, your thoughts are more than just your thoughts.

    Is the cup is half full, or half empty, and you have more to do with that than god, just you.
    Yes, hell exists upon my decisions.

    Well the thoughts are coming from me, sure, but not mine, at least in the beginning.

    Now for your xlent questions, thanks again. I say xlent because I had to ponder, as my feelings reading them were getting me to go through some experiences of late, was I indeed in control as such or being controlled by myself externalizing or not decision making or not allowing, was I still using my knowing, my feelings. Which led to am I balanced at present which led to no. Got a massage and acupuncture session today and gave myself a good zap also, now feel a massive deal better and doing a 3 to 5 day faste next week.

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  5. #153
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    Aianawa, sometime our perspective (and decisions) is/are the only difference between a good and a bad day. I'm happy to know of your ponderings.

    Being in control may not mean having actual control (same analogy as the thought not being your thoughts or the thoughts not being just your thoughts).

    Maybe releasing control is an interesting experience to have too?

    Deciding may not mean actually making a real decision. This is a long and drawn out pondering of mine; I think as human beings, we actually make very very few real decisions.

    If you have a habit or predispositions for certain preferences and behaviors, acts that arise from those origins are not actual decisions, are they? They have been programmed as part of your why (your way that is already defined or affixed). You will likely never choose to do something you do not "like" when faced with a better alternative. Right?

    That would mean: the only time we really make a decision is when we are faced with options and don't know which is more aligned with our preferences. Right?

    I contend those moments are few and far between. Incidentally, I've decided this aspect that I found within me, is the reason perspective is so important. Is it not the case that the way we interpret our sensory inputs and the way we choose to rationalize our interpretations define the "input parameters" from which habit, behavior and preference then work as routines?

    Control is just being able to predict the effects of causes we perceive and act upon (whether out of habit, behavior or some heuristic we have refined over time).

    Deciding mostly involves determining aspects of what we perceive with what we know to calculate which "branch" we prefer and then acting in accordance. But that is not really deciding, it is an application of predefined values (acquired from childhood till now) and calculation and application of logic or illogic to some conclusion that is known to lead to pleasure and is not too painful. Can it be reasoned that this type of "decision" making is actually pre-defined? That our current state [of being], including our preferences, inherently define probability trees (destiny) where our way/path is already clear?

    The only thing that is unclear is what the environment around us may present to our experience. But modern society has already established a lot of control over this environment with social norms and routines and social order. Right?

    Can it indeed be, that the only moments our probability tree offers a real decision, is when we find ourselves undecided about options we face [and our preferences and values do not interfere with our choice, no pain or pleasure associations...], and where those options are not already routine or habit? To me, that indeed is perspective as to how and why our mind is not just our mind, and our thoughts are not merely our thoughts...

    Deciding to tweak my views perspectives is a very interesting decision to me. But I can never truly know if it will make any real difference; to merely make a change is really not a good enough reason... or is it? Hell is not knowing that you can even decide.

    ADDENDUM

    Perhaps we have bad days because a part of us, that part which is more connected to the universe and that we are not consciously aware of, is trying to shake us of our habits, behaviors and preferences.

    It then is fitting to see mood swings as an opportunity, rather than an inconvenience.
    Last edited by lcam88, 15th October 2015 at 22:34. Reason: addendum

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  7. #154
    Senior Member Aianawa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by lcam88 View Post


    Aianawa, sometime our perspective (and decisions) is/are the only difference between a good and a bad day. I'm happy to know of your ponderings.

    If one is having a bad day, imo it has been a thought or thoughts that bought this about, so it comes down to knowing one can change their thoughts once they know what bought about the thought/s, hence meditation, reflecting, knowing and intuition being important.

    Being in control may not mean having actual control (same analogy as the thought not being your thoughts or the thoughts not being just your thoughts).

    Maybe releasing control is an interesting experience to have too?

    The control being the fear aspect of not being in control, not knowing ?.

    Deciding may not mean actually making a real decision. This is a long and drawn out pondering of mine; I think as human beings, we actually make very very few real decisions.

    If you have a habit or predispositions for certain preferences and behaviors, acts that arise from those origins are not actual decisions, are they? They have been programmed as part of your why (your way that is already defined or affixed). You will likely never choose to do something you do not "like" when faced with a better alternative. Right?

    Hence the importance being of what we do not know as to what we know.

    That would mean: the only time we really make a decision is when we are faced with options and don't know which is more aligned with our preferences. Right?

    Yes, feelings, knowing, intuition or even asking for outside help, or lol like getting gifted it by yourself on a forum, ta again.

    I contend those moments are few and far between. Incidentally, I've decided this aspect that I found within me, is the reason perspective is so important. Is it not the case that the way we interpret our sensory inputs and the way we choose to rationalize our interpretations define the "input parameters" from which habit, behavior and preference then work as routines?

    Yes and if one has had shamanistic and/or sychronicity training, especially experiencial training, little but being is needed.

    Control is just being able to predict the effects of causes we perceive and act upon (whether out of habit, behavior or some heuristic we have refined over time).

    Feel it is more than just prediction, the fear, fear of, fear for, the fear or love energy for myself as the root of all feelings is and has been strong for me, probably through my first spiritual book being book 1, Conversations With God.

    Deciding mostly involves determining aspects of what we perceive with what we know to calculate which "branch" we prefer and then acting in accordance. But that is not really deciding, it is an application of predefined values (acquired from childhood till now) and calculation and application of logic or illogic to some conclusion that is known to lead to pleasure and is not too painful. Can it be reasoned that this type of "decision" making is actually pre-defined? That our current state [of being], including our preferences, inherently define probability trees (destiny) where our way/path is already clear?

    Yes. Already clear ?.

    The only thing that is unclear is what the environment around us may present to our experience. But modern society has already established a lot of control over this environment with social norms and routines and social order. Right?

    Very much so.

    Can it indeed be, that the only moments our probability tree offers a real decision, is when we find ourselves undecided about options we face [and our preferences and values do not interfere with our choice, no pain or pleasure associations...], and where those options are not already routine or habit? To me, that indeed is perspective as to how and why our mind is not just our mind, and our thoughts are not merely our thoughts...

    This imo totally revolves around where one's mind is at, not known, known or in between somewhere and there is so so many nowadays that have their minds known to a high degree and the amount in between at present is huge huge imo.

    Deciding to tweak my views perspectives is a very interesting decision to me. But I can never truly know if it will make any real difference; to merely make a change is really not a good enough reason... or is it? Hell is not knowing that you can even decide.

    Agree, a positive mind is a great start and very difficult.

    ADDENDUM

    Perhaps we have bad days because a part of us, that part which is more connected to the universe and that we are not consciously aware of, is trying to shake us of our habits, behaviors and preferences.

    It then is fitting to see mood swings as an opportunity, rather than an inconvenience.
    Totally agree, it is a shocker when you think those days are over though, i forgot there is always the next thing as such.

    Ooopps, stuffed the quote thingy up.

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  9. #155
    Senior Member Aianawa's Avatar
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    Sorry about the quote reply being done incorrectly Icam88.

    As I observe the macro-micro the best I am able, and see and often feel these happening along differing now earth timelines, I am interested in your replies, one thing that came to me on rereading the above post was this > Yes and if one has had shamanistic and/or sychronicity training, especially experiencial training, little but being is needed. < this in hindsight now, feels different, because once one has lived synchronistically, one then knows when they are not in sinc as such.

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  11. #156
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    Thanks for your replies and interesting thoughts Aianawa. No problem with the quoting issues. I don't understand what you meant with the following

    Quote Originally posted by Aianawa
    ...it is a shocker when you think those days are over though...
    I'm also trying to grasp what you meant in your later reply. Do you mean to say that once you are shown the way, or aimed, you simply need only be? I could wholeheartedly agree with that.

    Quote Originally posted by Aianawa
    ...once one has lived synchronistically, one then knows when they are not in sinc as such.


    The other half of the coin once you realize your "programming" has covered most "choices", is recognizing when a choice is before you. Ignoring and overlooking are always the options taken when opportunities are missed. And there are a few things you can do to open up choices.

    If you understand god to exist (that word is terrible since it has so much of a loaded meaning, perhaps to clear up misunderstandings consider my reference when using the term, to be referencing a pure act, or action, reference to a verb that does not require a subject matter associated with it). Anyway, if you understand god and it is clear he/she/it is pure action, energy and perhaps knowledge in a sense that information is being experienced, acts of god is everything that happens when we are not paying attention or willfully putting things into motion. Acts of god would be everything that coincides with our experience.

    Coincidence is not random any more than we are random.

    And even if you do not find yourself with new choices (as per being guided by your preference and level of excitement etc.) Perhaps at least recognizing and surfing waves of coincidence helps us insofar as short-sightedness may be helped. Our views and perceptions need not share rational or rhyme with the mundane; living in the moment cannot be surpassed by any amount of contemplation on the past in that endless quest of dwelling on the future.

    In that sense at least I understand intuition to be superior to rational and logic insofar as I can allow the coincident to fill my experience. That is something more difficult to do if we grasp and adhere strongly to the idea that we actually control our lives, that we actually make choices. It is easier to let things go of things if we already recognize the level of control we have is limited. This very notion has strong parallels with meditation; it is meditation while living life moment to moment.

    Does that fit your idea of sychronicity?

    Of course we recognize that we are responsible for things we agree to and engage in... I'm not advocating breaking social contract or degenerating into an inert being that permits chaos in ones midst. Perhaps that is being _out_of_sinc_ (as you put it above). I'm only referring to how a moment can be experienced.

    Is this letting "Jesus take the wheel"? Yes and no. No because these choices are not made with the idea of something external saving you from your predicament. It is you accepting your predicament as something that does not require saving. Right?

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  13. #157
    Senior Member Aianawa's Avatar
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    Many yes's Icam88 and well laid out by you imo with the only ingrediant missing being knowing and the a wee bit unsure of how you define or mean >

    In that sense at least I understand intuition to be superior to rational and logic insofar as I can allow the coincident to fill my experience. That is something more difficult to do if we grasp and adhere strongly to the idea that we actually control our lives, that we actually make choices. It is easier to let things go of things if we already recognize the level of control we have is limited. This very notion has strong parallels with meditation; it is meditation while living life moment to moment.


    Once we know we are in control of the/our/micro, we then have the creation skills within the macro, creating and being are standard, some may say then blessed by the universe/god or your higher fractuals. Yes one's life being a meditation as such, informed by both the micro and macro.

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    Quote Originally posted by "Aianawa
    Once we know we are in control of the/our/micro, we then have the creation skills within the macro, creating and being are standard, some may say then blessed by the universe/god or your higher fractuals. Yes one's life being a meditation as such, informed by both the micro and macro.
    Control, is a complete illusion. I like the Star-Wars "The Force idea" as a metaphor about what control is. "It guides you, but it also obeys your command." Command, in that phrase being a weak word, better substituted by will. And indeed in our attempts to be in control of thing around us, we are guided by norms and heuristics so that we may be ready when then application of our energies can set thing to the desired path.

    The fact of life is that it is always spontaneous, even when we apply our force of will and try to control it. Some people are more in "control" of their instances than others.

    Here is why I'm of the position that intuition is superior to logic and rational.

    Logic and rational are important for survival, we learn to survive and we have the tools in our grasp to apply our intelligence to improve our chances of continuing life beyond what instinct alone may offer.

    But once you see that life is more than just survival, why use the same tools we are quipped with for survival, for everything else? Insofar as I'm saying, in the above postings, that logic and rational are part of the apparatus that [pre]defines many choices (by way of preferences, habits and behavior), I'm also saying that intuition is a way by which we may find the freedom not to be required to apply our [predefined] choice. (as by way of the logic and rational)

    That it is closer to the nature of pure spontaneous action, it is also closer to a moment of pure creation, without being impeded by the baggage that is only there for survival purposes. Trying to control creation is indeed the biggest obstacle to learning the creative skills, it would seem. Control, is a complete illusion...

    Does that help?

    And please let me know where I am wrong. You see, I'm an amateur at all of this.

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    As you said it yourself > desired path <, the desired path is not ones own but, the what is, to then be in accordance with, hence knowing the micro then macro, outside of this, is an/the illusion imo.

    Do you see/feel, spontaneous as synchronicity or being with/in synchronicty ?.

    Imo intuition has levels as ones own mind becomes known, in time as levels progress, logic tunes with intuition.

    I feel you may be incorrect only in an experiencial way, seeing everything happening around you as spontaneous creation and perfect, for one to then know the universe/god/way etc is for you.

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    I like your input. Especially about intuition having levels. We all tend to view our own knowledge and experience in terms of levels as well.

    Perhaps it is worth considering that experiential ways can be quite diverse as individuals are diverse. <shrug/>

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    Senior Member Aianawa's Avatar
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    Lol Icam88, perhaps, I have a saying for myself, it is not what I know about myself that is important, it is what I do not know about myself that is important, the inherited traits etc, the unknown or forgotten trauma's etc, to know these sincerely, only my feelings can sometimes let me know.

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    A wee pondering > I/you/we are not our feelings <, feelings inform us, make us aware unless not heeded of course, feelings may come from past experience but one person may react totally different to another, musings.

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    All effort of the mind is to protect something that is not there, damn lol

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    Quote Originally posted by Aianawa
    Lol Icam88, perhaps, I have a saying for myself, it is not what I know about myself that is important, it is what I do not know about myself that is important, the inherited traits etc, the unknown or forgotten trauma's etc, to know these sincerely, only my feelings can sometimes let me know.
    Traumas, dear Aianawa, are never forgotten. Knowing how and when they surface is part of knowing who you are.

    Quote Originally posted by Aianawa
    wee pondering > I/you/we are not our feelings <, feelings inform us, make us aware unless not heeded of course, feelings may come from past experience but one person may react totally different to another, musings.
    half full or half empty?

    In my pondering of not being my feeling, I've never let the idea that our view of being separate from the universe requires equal consideration. Feelings seem to be a nice interface with everything that "we are not". Heeding the course is about trusting yourself (that part that is not you).

    Quote Originally posted by Aianawa
    All effort of the mind is to protect something that is not there, damn lol
    The micro, ego and the requirement to keep functioning or survive. Queue traumas and how that effects you especially on this level.

    Letting go of that baggage and learning the macro is partially about unlearning to survive.

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  29. #165
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    Quote Originally posted by lcam88 View Post
    Traumas, dear Aianawa, are never forgotten. Knowing how and when they surface is part of knowing who you are.

    Agreed and who you are not lol.


    half full or half empty?

    Yes, perception, mind known, full and overflowing ( to others ) glass.

    In my pondering of not being my feeling, I've never let the idea that our view of being separate from the universe requires equal consideration. Feelings seem to be a nice interface with everything that "we are not". Heeding the course is about trusting yourself (that part that is not you).

    One's inate ?, one's connection with the way/devine/synchronicity ?.



    The micro, ego and the requirement to keep functioning or survive. Queue traumas and how that effects you especially on this level.

    Letting go of that baggage and learning the macro is partially about unlearning to survive.
    Yes and maybe understanding if one is existing or living as such.

    The last twenty - thirty mins of this vid imo shows dual macro and micro plus male and female.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C6Y2-clTEcI

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