Rhosgobel Tent At TOT

[modwiz]

I am interested if Lucifer is a being separate from humans- im all for "knowing myself" but this is a separate issue/topic. As the "tent" is a place of conversation and learning i am hoping that i am considered worthy of a few words

Your language indicates a certain pique stemming from your own lack of self worth. You would not have brought up the subject of your worth otherwise. (Neuro-linguistics 101) Lucifer is not separate from knowing oneself. It is that being's job to show what we do not know about ourselves.

A few words? They were given in response to your first question. Is quantity an issue?

As I said in my post to you. This subject will unfold. Trying to force it, for your own personal needs, is not the way I wish to proceed. And will not.

It is my wish that your answers are addressed. I do not take it upon my self to view that as my responsibility. (Boundaries)

Philos and agape to you.

[donk]

Does it even matter?

Absolutely! If he's some demonic embodiment of pure evil, it'd really matter. If he's a teacher and/or light bringer, it matters a lot. If you ever see him that it is (assuming he exists)

And if he does not (& only exists as your ego), it matters to know why you would think he does, don't ya think?

It always matters to me-to obtain accurate--or at least useful--information.

[Eelco]

I am interested if Lucifer is a being separate from humans- im all for "knowing myself" but this is a separate issue/topic. As the "tent" is a place of conversation and learning i am hoping that i am considered worthy of a few words

Yes You are.
All we can do is share what we know, feel , think or have deemed truth for ourselves.
So please share what Lucifer brings up for you as a concept. How do you view this being and how do you feel he impacts human existence?

From there a converstation grows and we get to explore options, ideas from which a pattern may occur.

With Love
Eelco
(who doesn´t believe anyone is exluded from word worthyness in this place, but then I am only a guest)

[Melidae]

He will beat you (challenge) with your own sticks (stuck places) until they unstick. (Unstuck)

No sticks, no beating.

Or are we the ones beating ourselves with our own sticks? Creating our own challenges...

[ronin]

Lucifer was god,s favorite angel.
his son.

like all children they question and think they know better.

as a parent would you destroy your children or hope one day of their return,learning the lessons they have endured.
their is no evil only what we create!
their is a love that we choose to ignore.

that balance of the two,knowing, maybe the key to return home.

equilibrium comes to mind.

[modwiz]

I think there are as many Lucifers as there are thoughts about him, and I believe these thought forms are based on an actual seperate/external entity (some people may even know some stuff about him)...how he (and they) relate to you is what you gotta go within about.

(I totally sympathize with extreme frustration from being told to "go within" in answer to every question)

Really? It is how I came upon my answers. Information and reflection. Information useless without the latter.

Frustration is born from not accepting the responsibility to attend to ones own consciousness unfoldment. The reality of another's words can be more hindrance than help. I see my words mangled by misunderstanding all the time. I seek to show as straight a line as possible. Some like the scenic tour with a lot of meandering and discussion.

I hope an informed, strong typist, feels moved to satisfy what I am not providing for some.

[Melidae]

Absolutely! If he's some demonic embodiment of pure evil, it'd really matter. If he's a teacher and/or light bringer, it matters a lot. If you ever see him that it is (assuming he exists)

And if he does not (& only exists as your ego), it matters to know why you would think he does, don't ya think?

It always matters to me-to obtain accurate--or at least useful--information.

It is our response to 'evil' or 'light' that matters, in whatever form it may take.


***edited to add....

Ego is a trickster, fighting to protect itself, hiding the shadows that need to come to light.

[PurpleLama]

Modwiz's suggestion of knowing self is a good one, I would expand on it to say that knowing self is central to knowing anything. It is worth exploring, for in analyzing anything perceived there is always the interference of the device making the perception with the perceived object. Therefore, any idea about Lucifer may alternately be true or false according to an individuals core beliefs. It is only by ruthless self examination that one can be familiar enough or flexibe enough with this core belief, with the assumptions we make about our experience, to get at what's behind what ever objective reality there is out there. The devil as an archtype can be seen as the stone against which we sharpen the sword of our spirit, our truth. Satan means adversary, and it is not some ancient being so much as a function of normal consciousness, as much as there is such a thing. Earlier we were talking about YHVH as opposed to Enki and Enlil, how the two are mixed together as one. The same hold true for the devil.

It is my musing of the moment, if it is not the case, that the consciousness of the western mind, so separated, so cut off from its environment, is not actually the mode of consciousness that the devil even represents, perhaps what is seen as mind today as a possession and an identity is not indeed the very one tempting the christ within each of us.

[modwiz]

Yes You are.
All we can do is share what we know, feel , think or have deemed truth for ourselves.
So please share what Lucifer brings up for you as a concept. How do you view this being and how do you feel he impacts human existence?

From there a converstation grows and we get to explore options, ideas from which a pattern may occur.

With Love
Eelco
(who doesn´t believe anyone is exluded from word worthyness in this place, but then I am only a guest)

Well done, Eelco. Excellent response. Better than mine. In one fashion.

[modwiz]

Or are we the ones beating ourselves with our own sticks? Creating our own challenges...

Depends on the context one inserts it into.

[donk]

On that level NOTHING matters...IMO.

On a practical, getting through life, dealing with others, negotiating the three dee five sense world, listening to other's experience is useful (to me). Including the ideas you and mod are projecting (which I agree with)

I also relate to LBs level. And anticipate others trying to integrate the two--or more accurately: explain why there's no difference (or "it doesn't matter), while others draw lines and see them as seperate--and reveal their "lower" level understanding of the concept. And does it matter? Robbins says it best:

"...I believe in everything, nothing is sacred. I believe in nothing, everything is sacred. Ha ha ho ho hee hee"

[modwiz]

On that level NOTHING matters...IMO.

On a practical, getting through life, dealing with others, negotiating the three dee five sense world, listening to other's experience is useful (to me). Including the ideas you and mod are projecting (which I agree with)

I also relate to LBs level. And anticipate others trying to integrate the two--or more accurately: explain why there's no difference (or "it doesn't matter), while others draw lines and see them as seperate--and reveal their "lower" level understanding of the concept. And does it matter? Robbins says it best:

"...I believe in everything, nothing is sacred. I believe in nothing, everything is sacred. Ha ha ho ho hee hee"

There you go.

[PurpleLama]

Lucifer was god,s favorite angel.
his son.

like all children they question and think they know better.

as a parent would you destroy your children or hope one day of their return,learning the lessons they have endured.
their is no evil only what we create!
their is a love that we choose to ignore.

that balance of the two,knowing, maybe the key to return home.

equilibrium comes to mind.

This is my favorite post of yours, so far.

[modwiz]

This is my favorite post of yours, so far.

Agreed.

[PurpleLama]

It is my musing of the moment, if it is not the case, that the consciousness of the western mind, so separated, so cut off from its environment, is not actually the mode of consciousness that the devil even represents, perhaps what is seen as mind today as a possession and an identity is not indeed the very one tempting the christ within each of us.

This has some bells ringing. I just read over it, this has been slow cooking below the surface for a while now, I think. The top of my head is tingling, reading what I wrote. Interesting.