The Left In America

**Aianawa** · 9th June 2022, 00:52

Originally posted by Fred Steeves

I don't recall all that much leniency concerning him, I've seen the Trump hate every bit as dominant as the Trump hero worship is over at The Project, making it seem as though if it weren't for him, everything would be just rosy.

I don't recall any credit given for Trump facilitating the fast tracking of the vaccines (Operation Warp Speed), or criticism of major democrats who publicly cast doubt over them just because of his roll in it.

The problem of starving and homeless people is as acute in the ultra liberal San Francisco Bay area (Nancy Pelosi's district), as anywhere in the country, so can we wag the finger of guilt as her as well?

Glad we can agree on those two!

Blind loyalty is certainly true with the current Trump faction, but there's a civil war going on inside the republican party, I've even seen you tout ultra conservative Liz Cheney daughter of "Darth Vader" Dick Cheney), as being on the front lines against Trump, so I'm not seeing the blind loyalty. There's also the big split between Trump and his former VP Mike Pence.

I've been yelling what Cenk said from the mountain tops here for some time now, that we only have two right wing parties here, one is just much more extreme to the right than the other.

The dominant establishment wing of the democratic party knows that in the end, progressives will vote for them no matter what, the progressives may not support them but they sure do wind up voting for them.

Yet you save all your ire for the republicans, and lefties who point out how culpable the dems are as well for our current state of affairs. The Young Turks don't count, because anyone who's watched them for long enough knows that they're really bitches for the establishment wing of the party, despite the occasional rhetoric to the contrary just to try and keep up rebellious appearances.

Like I've said many times before DT, the dems could just swat off that far right culture war bullshit and win every big time election in landslides, if they could just demonstrate how much they're doing for "The Forgotten Man" out there, yet they steadfastly refuse to do so. About the only strategy to get votes these days is catering to the upper middle class in the suburbs, and vote for us because "Trump bad".

This old Clinton acolyte just lost another major race in Virginia, because his "Trump bad so vote for me" campaign ad was all he had to offer.

His job is to throw red meat bullshit out to the hard core republican base, just as Rachel Maddow's job at MSNBC is to throw red meat bullshit out to the hard core democratic base. They're both paid extremely well to fan the flames of division with their destructive commentary.

Holy fn moly, a nueatral poster on politics, what the F is our forum coming to ???.

**Fred Steeves** · 9th June 2022, 02:49

Originally posted by Aianawa

Holy fn moly, a nueatral poster on politics, what the F is our forum coming to ???.

Not neutral, objective. It's a fine but important distinction.

**Aianawa** · 9th June 2022, 08:33

Mmmm point of view, can we agree on both ???.

**Emil El Zapato** · 9th June 2022, 12:03

Originally posted by Aianawa

Mmmm point of view, can we agree on both ???.

I would go with objective but a viewpoint still missing vital elements.

**Fred Steeves** · 9th June 2022, 12:45

Originally posted by Fred Steeves

Not neutral, objective. It's a fine but important distinction.

Originally posted by Aianawa

Mmmm point of view, can we agree on both ???.

Chuckling.

No, we can't Vern, this is not another one of those "my truth/your truth" things. Neutral and objective mean (slightly) different things, and one can't be both neutral and objective at the same time. A jury is both, but not at the same time, they're supposed to begin proceedings from a position of neutrality, then becoming objective when all the evidence is in.

Objective:

Based on real facts and not influenced by personal beliefs or feelings:

Example: I can't really be objective when I'm judging my daughter's work.

Neutral:

Not expressing an opinion or taking actions that support either side in a disagreement or war:

Example: Switzerland remained neutral during the war.

Clearly I wasn't neutral because there's a disagreement, and I was voicing my opinion one way or the other *based on the facts as I see them*.

The only way I could have been neutral would have been if the disagreement were between other people, and I took no position on the matter what so ever.

And of course to round things out there's "subjective.

Subjective

Influenced by or based on personal beliefs or feelings, rather than based on facts:

Example: I think my husband is the most handsome man in the world, but I realize my judgment is rather subjective.

Cable tv talking heads are generally subjective in their commentary. Politicians are almost by definition subjective. I'm subjective when watching my home town NFL football team play.

All three have skin in the game for one side or the other.

**Dreamtimer** · 9th June 2022, 14:15

For the record, no one here has ever seen me unleash on anyone. I have never really full-throatedly expressed my opinions about Trump. If anyone thinks I have, they've misestimated where I'm coming from.

I would like people to see for themselves. Being strident and stentorian doesn't get anywhere.

The amount of F%^&$ry coming from Trump has barely been touched here. I think folks are afraid to look that deep in the water. We're at the brink now and people are still playing pretend about both sides. All over the place they're playing pretend.

And that same crap happened almost a century ago. My leniency isn't even an issue in the face of current dynamics. We have a whole propaganda network that won't even air the Hearings. We're flirting with right wing autocracy while pretending left wing totalitarianism is a problem. We collectively have our heads in the craphole.

**Wind** · 13th June 2022, 02:10

Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zz0FzNHLo1k

**Dreamtimer** · 13th June 2022, 13:11

I watched the interview and thought it was good. I didn't find anything 'shocking'.

**Aragorn** · 13th June 2022, 13:35

Originally posted by Dreamtimer

I watched the interview and thought it was good. I didn't find anything 'shocking'.

The video has to have the word "shock" or "shocking" in its title, because that's what attracts more viewers and thus more YouTube ad revenue.

I'm not kidding, by the way. There are loads of people who now make their living off of posting videos — with ads, of course — on YouTube, and for those with many subscribers, it's quite a royal living too. That's why they keep on telling you to like, subscribe, share and hit that notification bell in every video they upload.

**Dreamtimer** · 13th June 2022, 13:37

The video titles get pretty ridiculous. There's a lot of 'owning' and 'slam-dunking' and 'crushing' and 'lashing'. It's a bit WWE.

**modwiz** · 13th June 2022, 20:32

Originally posted by Dreamtimer

The video titles get pretty ridiculous. There's a lot of 'owning' and 'slam-dunking' and 'crushing' and 'lashing'. It's a bit WWE.

It's a clown show all around. Serious voices are not entertaining enough or do not push the emotional triggers many people need to get their adrenaline rush.

The world has a critical shortage of 'adults'.

**Fred Steeves** · 13th June 2022, 23:28

Eh, I'm a succor for good content, not the headline. Some of the ones I personally like are the afore mentioned Kyle Kulinski, Jimmy Dore, The Duran, Breaking Points with Krystal and Saager, and top notch journalism channels such as The Grayzone and Empire Files. Shows that don't have any skin in the game so far as carrying water for any team, that have a knack for digging up information that mainstream media wouldn't dare touch, and put thought into giving a good objective commentary to boot.

I'm well aware this is how they make their living, similar to an AM talk show host, so if I have to hear "be sure and smash that like button and subscribe if you haven't already" at some point during every clip, well, it's not the end of the world.

**Wind** · 14th June 2022, 00:04

I don't subscribe to news channels because they put out too much content so it would take over my feed and I only subscribe to certain kind of channels, both entertainment and info. I think it's understandable that some people need to make a living and there's nothing wrong with that, of course it's a a bit annoying always to hear them begging to subscribe and like their videos, but that's just part of the game. Also it sucks that Youtube has basically forced many people to put even more ads in the middle of their videos or have them sell some products, on top of that they have to put those clickbait titles so they could get more hits, because it's a competition for views. Personally I look at many news sources and then form my opinion although often I don't want to look at the news, because it's just all the same negative garbage. The older I get the more I realize how tribalistic idiots people still are, that's just basic psychology.

**Dreamtimer** · 18th June 2022, 21:29

This guy was a conservative. He's not now, which by default puts him in the left as no-one talks about middle ground these days...

He hits the nail on the head in terms of many things which have been discussed here in the shire, from American Exceptionalism to Soros to false scarcity and on.