The Fred/Gracy Affair, and the Inter-Forum Aftermath Thereof

[Aragorn]

Wouldn't you need to translate all that first?

I do try...

[Malisa]

I do try...

*gremmar

[donk]

Dude, that would be brilliant! Do you still have both of them?

Man, I am fired up to get one going, now.

Reading through highlights on the PA thread about it a friend sent…I would LOVE to know who ulli thought it was

So much damage Fred has done, poor Bill mentions…not sure how they will ever recover. The tyranny of Gracy providing a counter perspective to the ultra-right narrative they’re hooked on there is over though, now the healing and rebuilding can begin

[Octopus Garden]

*gremmar

Grammoire--a manual of black magic (for invoking inflections, syntax, and word formation)

[Aragorn]

*gremmar

Grammoire--a manual of black magic (for invoking inflections, syntax, and word formation)

And then of course there's the Vernacular, for learning Aianawese™.

In Belgium, there's also a bit of a standing joke ─ well, not so standing anymore these days ─ about the word "grammaire" (grammar), which is a French word, but which was somewhat adopted into Flemish as well due to the past domination by the francophone elite here. This elite also insisted that Flemish schools would teach French and force children to speak French at school until well into the 20th century.

The joke is that the word "grand-mère" (grandmother) had also become incorporated in Flemish. And then when a French teacher at school asked you about or commented on your (lack of) knowledge of "grammaire", you would reply "Oh, she's been dead for years."

[Chris]

Reading through highlights on the PA thread about it a friend sent…I would LOVE to know who ulli thought it was

So much damage Fred has done, poor Bill mentions…not sure how they will ever recover. The tyranny of Gracy providing a counter perspective to the ultra-right narrative they’re hooked on there is over though, now the healing and rebuilding can begin

Ha, bloody brilliant!

[Aragorn]

Reading through highlights on the PA thread about it a friend sent…I would LOVE to know who ulli thought it was

Well, you could always ask her that, but it would appear that her two Rhosgobel rabbits had already long lost their way back by the time they reached the end of the bridge across the pond.

Maybe the bouquet of the wine served in ye olde borough is more pleasing to her, although I must say that the 1950s vintage of gwin ru over there comes with a peculiarly purple color nowadays...

Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gQK9k42ongU

I am so naughty. Now I'm going to have to punish myself and hit my hand with a hammer again. Damn, I hate that!

[Emil El Zapato]

Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RqJVa0fl01w

[donk]

As one of those nasty people, I'm afraid I'll have to be a bit unkind(er).

I really, really don't like confrontation and calling people out, but I'll have to give a general bollocking to the whole alternative space, at least to the part of it which is now alt-right, conspiratorial, or just outright fascist.

This so-called alternative community has degenerated into something truly bizarre, a spectacle probably not seen since the 1930s, where all sorts of paranoid fantasies have taken hold of people's minds and made them believe patently untrue stuff.

That in itself would be relatively harmless, but when coupled with far-right, nationalistic, fascist, etc... views, well, it becomes dangerous. A number of these "alternative" forums have become eco-chambers of alt-right hate and they have a pernicious effect in inflating the egos of the participants in these discussions, where they imagine themselves to be privy to some special insight or secret that others are apparently too dumb to see.

I'm not singling out anyone, just pointing out the mechanism at work. I too was once somewhat affected by it, so I'm pointing the finger first at myself, by admitting that I have often fallen for such disreputable characters and charlatans in the past. The "alternative" space is chock full of raging narcissists, psychotics, psychopaths, conmen and other assorted unpleasant characters. I think we can all think of a few, even some who were once active participants on this very forum.

The challenge here is to grow up, admit that you were wrong, or conned, then start again and seek the truth out for yourself, with better discernment and enhanced critical thinking skills. We will never truly know what's actually going on in this world, because most of it is hidden and the really important stuff takes place behind the scenes. But, we can never give up on seeking out the truth and listening to others who may be wiser than ourselves, whichever platform hosts these discussions.

I think we should all try to avoid engaging in "forum wars", however tempting it might be to diss others who we may have fundamental disagreements with. This is probably the last post I'm going to make on this issue, I plan to ignore the whole us vs them debate from now on. We have more important stuff to deal with right now and I personally think all this back-and-forth between forums is rather childish.

Some of them are trying to make “us” out to be an enemy (“vs them”), but reality what started as Fred just wanting to keep to keep an eye on the cult so many of us grew emotionally attached and invested so much energy in to (myself included) spiraled into him enjoying a place back into the community with a different identity. Correct me if I’m wrong Fred, but I never took you for they type to get off on manipulating or hurting people, when i’d pop over to see how extreme the right wing psychos over there was getting, Gracy was responses were so hated not because they were impolite (or untrue) or whatever else they project…they just really really think that anyone who could suggest the vaccine is not poison and Biden is some Stalin or something are truly mistaken and/or evil. It’s madness

I’m not advocating deception, I’m sure I would have seen someone “pulling a Gracy” 7 or 8 years ago as extremely upsetting, and of course I haven’t seen all “her” interactions (and very few of new BR chippy iota—wonder if they married yet?)…but I see a lot of projection. Their reaction shows a lot, and if an even MORE evil intending person than Fred were inclined to make a move, I’m sure they are loving the insights the aggrieved are giving them.

Anyways, I learned I gotta be careful moving any socks over there, with super sleuth Marcus/DNA on the case, sure was nice of him to let his master take all the credit, but we all know he never would have gotten to the bottom of this caper if it wasn’t for that pesky DNA.

Fun fact: my tagline here was taken from an old DNA post on PA circa 2012

[Chris]

Some of them are trying to make “us” out to be an enemy (“vs them”), but reality what started as Fred just wanting to keep to keep an eye on the cult so many of us grew emotionally attached and invested so much energy in to (myself included) spiraled into him enjoying a place back into the community with a different identity. Correct me if I’m wrong Fred, but I never took you for they type to get off on manipulating or hurting people, when i’d pop over to see how extreme the right wing psychos over there was getting, Gracy was responses were so hated not because they were impolite (or untrue) or whatever else they project…they just really really think that anyone who could suggest the vaccine is not poison and Biden is some Stalin or something are truly mistaken and/or evil. It’s madness

I’m not advocating deception, I’m sure I would have seen someone “pulling a Gracy” 7 or 8 years ago as extremely upsetting, and of course I haven’t seen all “her” interactions (and very few of new BR chippy iota—wonder if they married yet?)…but I see a lot of projection. Their reaction shows a lot, and if an even MORE evil intending person than Fred were inclined to make a move, I’m sure they are loving the insights the aggrieved are giving them.

Anyways, I learned I gotta be careful moving any socks over there, with super sleuth Marcus/DNA on the case, sure was nice of him to let his master take all the credit, but we all know he never would have gotten to the bottom of this caper if it wasn’t for that pesky DNA.

Fun fact: my tagline here was taken from an old DNA post on PA circa 2012

The best policy, I feel is to completely ignore them.

Sure, this thread may suggest otherwise and I do have some friends over there, but as for the general vibe of the forum, no thank you.

I don't even know what purpose that forum serves any more, except as an echo-chamber for paranoid conspiracy theories, far-right hate and a bit of ego-fluffing. There are a thousand other places where you can engage with other like-minded "brethren" if that is your thing.

[Fred Steeves]

Correct me if I’m wrong Fred, but I never took you for they type to get off on manipulating or hurting people,

That would be correct Phil.

when i’d pop over to see how extreme the right wing psychos over there was getting, Gracy was responses were so hated not because they were impolite (or untrue) or whatever else they project…they just really really think that anyone who could suggest the vaccine is not poison and Biden is some Stalin or something are truly mistaken and/or evil. It’s madness

It's actually a bit of a misnomer that "Gracy" was universally despised there. Yes the majority who assumed "she" was just a freedom hating Commie for questioning Orange Jesus and not piling on enough on Biden, got most of the spotlight because of the hard Right turn the place has taken. One look at the grief Dennis Leahy takes for his nuanced stances pretty much say it all, and he's a long time respected member. But they have a silent minority that chooses not to have rotten tomatoes thrown their way by speaking their differences to the prevailing narratives, but they appreciated "Gracy" doing so, and at times would tell "her" as much via PM.

Sock puppets are not a new thing there, they've even been proudly displayed like "Gwin Ru" and "La Tigra", so deception is not really as big of a problem as was being presented. Not at all. The heart of the problem here was that "Gracy" tended to stray the wrong way around a one way circle, and "she" wasn't sanctioned by upper management. And that, is a big big problem.

I’m not advocating deception, I’m sure I would have seen someone “pulling a Gracy” 7 or 8 years ago as extremely upsetting, and of course I haven’t seen all “her” interactions (and very few of new BR chippy iota—wonder if they married yet?)…but I see a lot of projection.

Ah yes, the one I refer to as "crazy lady". The new pet. I'm thinking her "7' long antennae" might get in the way of up close personal relations. It seems that membership didn't appreciate "iota" being shoved down their throats, and I'm proud of them for standing up and speaking truth to power on that front, they finally broke the log jam in dealing with that problem. The mods there god bless 'em have long known she's a big problem and a liability, there was a long running 14+ page mods report thread titled "iota vs. Gracy" detailing the lunacy, but nothing can be done when #1 dictates that a chosen member is untouchable and good as gold.

Anyways, I learned I gotta be careful moving any socks over there, with super sleuth Marcus/DNA on the case, sure was nice of him to let his master take all the credit, but we all know he never would have gotten to the bottom of this caper if it wasn’t for that pesky DNA.

Oh yeah, we all gotta be careful for a while. But it was interesting seeing that DNA is so loyal to his master, that he let master take all the credit for the detective work.

[Aragorn]

Anyways, I learned I gotta be careful moving any socks over there, with super sleuth Marcus/DNA on the case, sure was nice of him to let his master take all the credit, but we all know he never would have gotten to the bottom of this caper if it wasn’t for that pesky DNA.

But it was interesting seeing that DNA is so loyal to his master, that he let master take all the credit for the detective work.

[Malisa]

It's easy to walk on two legs when the long tail supports you with no effort :P


Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HdOWqQbdOR0

Oh yeah, we all gotta be careful for a while. But it was interesting seeing that DNA is so loyal to his master, that he let master take all the credit for the detective work.

That would be correct Phil.

It's actually a bit of a misnomer that "Gracy" was universally despised there. Yes the majority who assumed "she" was just a freedom hating Commie for questioning Orange Jesus and not piling on enough on Biden, got most of the spotlight because of the hard Right turn the place has taken. One look at the grief Dennis Leahy takes for his nuanced stances pretty much say it all, and he's a long time respected member. But they have a silent minority that chooses not to have rotten tomatoes thrown their way by speaking their differences to the prevailing narratives, but they appreciated "Gracy" doing so, and at times would tell "her" as much via PM.

Sock puppets are not a new thing there, they've even been proudly displayed like "Gwin Ru" and "La Tigra", so deception is not really as big of a problem as was being presented. Not at all. The heart of the problem here was that "Gracy" tended to stray the wrong way around a one way circle, and "she" wasn't sanctioned by upper management. And that, is a big big problem.



Ah yes, the one I refer to as "crazy lady". The new pet. I'm thinking her "7' long antennae" might get in the way of up close personal relations. It seems that membership didn't appreciate "iota" being shoved down their throats, and I'm proud of them for standing up and speaking truth to power on that front, they finally broke the log jam in dealing with that problem. The mods there god bless 'em have long known she's a big problem and a liability, there was a long running 14+ page mods report thread titled "iota vs. Gracy" detailing the lunacy, but nothing can be done when #1 dictates that a chosen member is untouchable and good as gold.



Oh yeah, we all gotta be careful for a while. But it was interesting seeing that DNA is so loyal to his master, that he let master take all the credit for the detective work.

[Aragorn]

I'd like to dedicate this song to the two idiots at Project Avalon who accuse me of being Fred Steeves in disguise, notwithstanding the fact that I can be seen and heard in three video conferences that were posted here at the forum in 2017, the latter two of which I was actually co-hosting together with modwiz.

Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OINSjfTJukQ

Go and write your own names on your Wall of Shame, losers!

[Dreamtimer]

Don't ever let anyone tell you you aren't funny, Aragorn.

But they have a silent minority that chooses not to have rotten tomatoes thrown their way by speaking their differences to the prevailing narratives, but they appreciated "Gracy" doing so, and at times would tell "her" as much via PM.

Another parallel to the larger cosmos here in the US. Their voices should be used, not silent. You can't bring forth the things stated in the forum mission or banner being silent. If they have no voice they can use in the open, why remain there?

It appears that voices are louder at PA when there's $$$. Another familiar dynamic. Money is speech here and boy are some voices really loud.

The consistent dynamic?

Narcissists gonna stare into the water...