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Thread: The Fred/Gracy Affair, and the Inter-Forum Aftermath Thereof

  1. #91
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    Hilarious...

    Do these people really have nothing better to do with their time than to make up paranoid conspiracy theories and engage in petty inter-forum mud-slinging?


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    It's part of moving into a higher vibration....

    Perhaps, if that vibration gets high enough, the energy will spread forth...into dissolution.

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    Senior Member Emil El Zapato's Avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by Dreamtimer View Post
    Don't ever let anyone tell you you aren't funny, Aragorn.



    Another parallel to the larger cosmos here in the US. They're voices should be used, not silent. You can't bring forth the things stated in the forum mission or banner being silent. If they have no voice they can use in the open, why remain there?

    It appears that voices are louder at PA when there's $$$. Another familiar dynamic. Money is speech here and boy are some voices really loud.

    The consistent dynamic?

    Narcissists gonna stare into the water...
    ahh, I have been illuminated ...

    What is the deal on Exomatrix ... Is he the designated resident "I'm fucked up in the head" dude. That guy is ostentatiously the most disgusting person on the site (In my terribly humble opinion).
    “El revolucionario: te meteré la bota en el culo"

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    Quote Originally posted by Dreamtimer View Post
    It's part of moving into a higher vibration....

    Perhaps, if that vibration gets high enough, the energy will spread forth...into dissolution.
    Yeah, higher-vibrational stupidity. There's stupid and then there's powerful stupid, the higher vibrational variety.

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    Senior Member Emil El Zapato's Avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by Chris View Post
    Yeah, higher-vibrational stupidity. There's stupid and then there's powerful stupid, the higher vibrational variety.
    good one Chris, Super dynamo style.
    “El revolucionario: te meteré la bota en el culo"

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    Quote Originally posted by BeastOfBologna View Post
    What is the deal on Exomatrix ... Is he the designated resident "I'm fucked up in the head" dude. That guy is ostentatiously the most disgusting person on the site (In my terribly humble opinion).
    He's a man on a mission, and he has some very strong (and equally wrong) beliefs, but he's not such a bad guy. There are far more hideous characters over there, and the events of the past couple of weeks have certainly caused a number of them to crawl out from underneath their rocks.

    I am not a violent man, and everyone who knows me will confirm that, but the arrogantly disdainful way by which that Vangelo character over there tried to gaslight the others into believing that I am Fred in disguise would have caused me to punch his lights out on the spot if he had been standing before me. Luckily for him, he had a forum to hide behind.

    I've worked long and hard at building a bridge between us and Project Avalon. But right now, I'm genuinely asking myself why I've ever even bothered wasting all that energy. It has never been a two-way bridge anyway, and it didn't even take them too long before they were suggesting that we over here were all complicit in Fred's role-playing game, as well as that they were also quick at labeling Fred a sociopath and comparing what he did to rape, no less. I kid you not.

    They wanted blood, and some of them still do. They can't get enough of the taste. They want to see Fred's head on a pike ─ hell, maybe mine too ─ and it's not because he lied about his identity. That's just the excuse they're hiding behind. Because they actually wanted to see Gracy's head on that pike, but Gracy was a moderator and so they couldn't touch "her". And now that Gracy turns out to have been Fred, with as a result that Fred/Gracy was kicked off of the mods team, now they can give into their hatred and feed their inner demons.

    And their alleged compassion for Malisa over there is just as fake as their cited outrage over the deception that Fred laid upon them. They don't even care about her or how she feels. It's all just one more charge to throw on the pile for demanding that Fred's head be put on that pike.

    That said, there are some good people over there too. Some really good people. But somehow they choose to remain silent, lest the lynch mob would turn on them too. Very few of them dare to speak up ─ Dennis Leahy is one of them, and he does still enjoy at least some respect over there because he's a multi-time veteran moderator and a friend of Bill's. On the other hand, even that is apparently not enough to stop some people over there from attacking and mocking Dennis.

    Fortunately, Dennis has the strength to shrug it off, and the courage to keep on trying to talk sense into those Trumpified skulls ─ hey look, I've just invented another new word ─ whereas I myself have already long given up on people like that. By the time I had become an administrator over there after first having dwelt there again as a regular member for the sake of continuing to build that bridge, I simply couldn't bare to engage those people in discussions anymore, and I so I avoided the confrontation. I had already been made to run the gauntlet during those first couple of months there, and it wasn't exactly what I would call a heartwarming experience.

    Anyway, I've built a bridge, but I never said that it was to be used as a latrine, nor have I ever said that I'd be the one who was going to clean up the shit being dumped onto it. It is up to those who've soiled it to clean up their own mess, and if they don't, then that's on them. But I for one am not going to be crossing that bridge anymore for as long as there's Avalon Poo on it.

    Take note, Project Avalon, because you may be looking down on us over here, and you may consider yourselves an elite of chosen ones, but you're no better than us over here, and in the end, Project Avalon is only but a forum, a social media site, just like ours. No more, no less, and just because you are looking down on us doesn't mean that we would have any obligation whatsoever to look up to you.

    We've made amends. We've paid our dues. We've built the bridge. And at every occasion you get, you spit in our faces. We don't owe you anything.



    Ingrate (n.):

    Someone who bites the hand that feeds them and then complains of indigestion.
    = DEATH BEFORE DISHONOR =

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    Senior Member Lord Sidious's Avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by Aragorn View Post
    He's a man on a mission, and he has some very strong (and equally wrong) beliefs, but he's not such a bad guy. There are far more hideous characters over there, and the events of the past couple of weeks have certainly caused a number of them to crawl out from underneath their rocks.

    I am not a violent man, and everyone who knows me will confirm that, but the arrogantly disdainful way by which that Vangelo character over there tried to gaslight the others into believing that I am Fred in disguise would have caused me to punch his lights out on the spot if he had been standing before me. Luckily for him, he had a forum to hide behind.

    I've worked long and hard at building a bridge between us and Project Avalon. But right now, I'm genuinely asking myself why I've ever even bothered wasting all that energy. It has never been a two-way bridge anyway, and it didn't even take them too long before they were suggesting that we over here were all complicit in Fred's role-playing game, as well as that they were also quick at labeling Fred a sociopath and comparing what he did to rape, no less. I kid you not.

    They wanted blood, and some of them still do. They can't get enough of the taste. They want to see Fred's head on a pike ─ hell, maybe mine too ─ and it's not because he lied about his identity. That's just the excuse they're hiding behind. Because they actually wanted to see Gracy's head on that pike, but Gracy was a moderator and so they couldn't touch "her". And now that Gracy turns out to have been Fred, with as a result that Fred/Gracy was kicked off of the mods team, now they can give into their hatred and feed their inner demons.

    And their alleged compassion for Malisa over there is just as fake as their cited outrage over the deception that Fred laid upon them. They don't even care about her or how she feels. It's all just one more charge to throw on the pile for demanding that Fred's head be put on that pike.

    That said, there are some good people over there too. Some really good people. But somehow they choose to remain silent, lest the lynch mob would turn on them too. Very few of them dare to speak up ─ Dennis Leahy is one of them, and he does still enjoy at least some respect over there because he's a multi-time veteran moderator and a friend of Bill's. On the other hand, even that is apparently not enough to stop some people over there from attacking and mocking Dennis.

    Fortunately, Dennis has the strength to shrug it off, and the courage to keep on trying to talk sense into those Trumpified skulls ─ hey look, I've just invented another new word ─ whereas I myself have already long given up on people like that. By the time I had become an administrator over there after first having dwelt there again as a regular member for the sake of continuing to build that bridge, I simply couldn't bare to engage those people in discussions anymore, and I so I avoided the confrontation. I had already been made to run the gauntlet during those first couple of months there, and it wasn't exactly what I would call a heartwarming experience.

    Anyway, I've built a bridge, but I never said that it was to be used as a latrine, nor have I ever said that I'd be the one who was going to clean up the shit being dumped onto it. It is up to those who've soiled it to clean up their own mess, and if they don't, then that's on them. But I for one am not going to be crossing that bridge anymore for as long as there's Avalon Poo on it.

    Take note, Project Avalon, because you may be looking down on us over here, and you may consider yourselves an elite of chosen ones, but you're no better than us over here, and in the end, Project Avalon is only but a forum, a social media site, just like ours. No more, no less, and just because you are looking down on us doesn't mean that we would have any obligation whatsoever to look up to you.

    We've made amends. We've paid our dues. We've built the bridge. And at every occasion you get, you spit in our faces. We don't owe you anything.



    Ingrate (n.):

    Someone who bites the hand that feeds them and then complains of indigestion.
    I always found Dennis was a good guy.............
    Ní siocháin go saoirse

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    Quote Originally posted by Lord Sidious View Post
    I always found Dennis was a good guy.............
    He is. He's one of the brave voices of reason over there.
    = DEATH BEFORE DISHONOR =

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    Senior Member Emil El Zapato's Avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by Lord Sidious View Post
    I always found Dennis was a good guy.............
    My feelings also, I never corresponded with him...but I always got the feeling that he was unwilling to go that next step to state the plain truth, but yes, he seemed like a gentle soul.

    I am familiar with that Vangelo character but never paid much attention as whatever he said never phased me much.
    “El revolucionario: te meteré la bota en el culo"

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    Quote Originally posted by BeastOfBologna View Post
    My feelings also, I never corresponded with him...but I always got the feeling that he was unwilling to go that next step to state the plain truth, but yes, he seemed like a gentle soul.

    I am familiar with that Vangelo character but never paid much attention as whatever he said never phased me much.
    All this excitement has got me looking closer over at PA. Nothing new, whenever I do that I leave with either a migraine headache or indigestion.
    “El revolucionario: te meteré la bota en el culo"

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    Senior Monk Gio's Avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by Chris View Post
    Hilarious...

    Do these people really have nothing better to do with their time than to make up paranoid conspiracy theories and engage in petty inter-forum mud-slinging?

    Yeah I'd say they do, but perhaps it takes the sting out of their real life matters .. Pretty much the same as children find the playground for escape/socializing.





    Sometimes we echo it here as well, though there is no worshiping required ...
    Last edited by Gio, 2nd February 2022 at 19:32. Reason: Worship Bill!
    Presenting an alternative to the alternative community.

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    Quote Originally posted by Aragorn View Post
    The only thing we censor here is misinformation that could potentially lead to people dying ─ as with the Covid-19-related junk that Vern has been spamming across multiple threads lately, and that has already gotten people killed ─ or that is otherwise nefarious in some way, like hate speech, political propaganda, etc. And of course, when there is mudslinging going on between two members here, then we'll clean that up too,. But that's not really censorship; that's just forum hygiene.
    And that is exactly the reason why I have been a "lurking" member here for the last two and a half years. If you can not have an open and honest debate about every single intellectual idea that sincerely concerns people, then you can't claim that the space you provide is part of an open and free society. To automatically define information that is critical of vaccines as "info that leads to people dying" is foolish and simplistic. If there is a problem with information you don't like, it should be countered with more information and ideas, not silenced. It's one thing when members counter ideas with insults, threats and personal attacks, but it is totally unacceptable when moderators do it.

    Yes, there are some obnoxious and deluded people on Proj. Avalon (as there may be a few here too, not that I've spent as much time here) and Bill Ryan has allowed some clearly abusive people to remain on the forum much too long before pushing them out the door (while others get booted quite swiftly) but I will take that over a forum that does not tolerate free speech and the exchange of ideas. For that reason, I will take PA over TOT any day. To automatically define the speech of others as "anti-science", "fake news" or "unhygenic" is grandiose and arrogant. For moderators to silence or ban people for such ideas is unacceptable. As long as these policies are in effect, as long as I know there are issues that I can be censored on, I will have little to contribute to this forum and I know there are a lot of other PA members who also admire the forum but feel that way too.

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    Quote Originally posted by Aragorn View Post
    And then of course there's the Vernacular, for learning Aianawese™.

    In Belgium, there's also a bit of a standing joke ─ well, not so standing anymore these days ─ about the word "grammaire" (grammar), which is a French word, but which was somewhat adopted into Flemish as well due to the past domination by the francophone elite here. This elite also insisted that Flemish schools would teach French and force children to speak French at school until well into the 20th century.

    The joke is that the word "grand-mère" (grandmother) had also become incorporated in Flemish. And then when a French teacher at school asked you about or commented on your (lack of) knowledge of "grammaire", you would reply "Oh, she's been dead for years."

    That's hilarious! Something I have never told anybody because it is so stupid--When I was a little kid, I would go through my parent's book about the Louvre. Was fascinated by the paintings. The paintings that had me really puzzled were those that came from the 'Flemish' school. I wondered what they put in the paint and was too weirded out to ask anybody. As it turns out, Flem is not the same as Phlegm!

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    Quote Originally posted by Christian View Post
    And that is exactly the reason why I have been a "lurking" member here for the last two and a half years. If you can not have an open and honest debate about every single intellectual idea that sincerely concerns people, then you can't claim that the space you provide is part of an open and free society. To automatically define information that is critical of vaccines as "info that leads to people dying" is foolish and simplistic. If there is a problem with information you don't like, it should be countered with more information and ideas, not silenced. It's one thing when members counter ideas with insults, threats and personal attacks, but it is totally unacceptable when moderators do it.

    Yes, there are some obnoxious and deluded people on Proj. Avalon (as there may be a few here too, not that I've spent as much time here) and Bill Ryan has allowed some clearly abusive people to remain on the forum much too long before pushing them out the door (while others get booted quite swiftly) but I will take that over a forum that does not tolerate free speech and the exchange of ideas. For that reason, I will take PA over TOT any day. To automatically define the speech of others as "anti-science", "fake news" or "unhygenic" is grandiose and arrogant. For moderators to silence or ban people for such ideas is unacceptable. As long as these policies are in effect, as long as I know there are issues that I can be censored on, I will have little to contribute to this forum and I know there are a lot of other PA members who also admire the forum but feel that way too.
    Can you give an example where free speech is or was not tolerated here, Christian? When I detect someone has a strong bias that isn't necessarily warranted, except by emotional priors, I dismiss their point of view on that topic. I will dismiss them entirely, if they meet my criteria for a complete and utter lack of credibiity, on all topics.

    Just as an example, Dr.Robert Malone is not legit. He has an axe to grind. A big one--and conflicts of interest, as has Geert Van den Bush. I am well acquainted with his ideas and with the ivermectin material. Spent a year researching it, reading from a wide spectrum.

    The problem with letting ideological priors set the tone for your investigations of a matter, is you can easily get stuck in echo chambers.

    I was a bit more inclined to be anti-covid-vaccine, and pro-ivermectin, at first. But after reading a LOT of material, I was persuaded otherwise. But...here's the thing. I am not so thoroughly persuaded, by my current point of view, that I will ignore the best most highly qualified contrary information, when it comes along. Nobody should have that degree of certainty about anything, imo.

    If I was to state my ideas on Avalon, I would be dog-piled. Not banned, just harassed and treated with contempt. How is that better than being banned? Have people been banned from being pro-vax here?
    Last edited by Octopus Garden, 2nd February 2022 at 22:18.

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    Quote Originally posted by Christian View Post
    And that is exactly the reason why I have been a "lurking" member here for the last two and a half years. If you can not have an open and honest debate about every single intellectual idea that sincerely concerns people, then you can't claim that the space you provide is part of an open and free society. To automatically define information that is critical of vaccines as "info that leads to people dying" is foolish and simplistic. If there is a problem with information you don't like, it should be countered with more information and ideas, not silenced. It's one thing when members counter ideas with insults, threats and personal attacks, but it is totally unacceptable when moderators do it.

    Yes, there are some obnoxious and deluded people on Proj. Avalon (as there may be a few here too, not that I've spent as much time here) and Bill Ryan has allowed some clearly abusive people to remain on the forum much too long before pushing them out the door (while others get booted quite swiftly) but I will take that over a forum that does not tolerate free speech and the exchange of ideas. For that reason, I will take PA over TOT any day. To automatically define the speech of others as "anti-science", "fake news" or "unhygenic" is grandiose and arrogant. For moderators to silence or ban people for such ideas is unacceptable. As long as these policies are in effect, as long as I know there are issues that I can be censored on, I will have little to contribute to this forum and I know there are a lot of other PA members who also admire the forum but feel that way too.
    Hi Christian,

    I'll have to correct you there, you simply haven't been a member long enough to make that judgement call.

    Vern has been sent on a little holiday for spreading right-wing propaganda and not listening to reason, despite repeated warnings and not for the first time either.

    For the record, no topic is off-limits on TOT, including ivermectin, the origins of covid or the risks and dangers associated with the vaccines. If you peek into the Covid thread, we've had extensive discussions on all these topics and arguments were made pro and contra without censorship. I for one am not a huge fan of the vaccines and have posted Robert Malone's interviews with Brett Weinstein and Joe Rogan, which should still be up.

    I understand that perhaps you feel we are ganging up on TOT members who may also be members over on PA.

    Not at all, like all of us have said repeatedly, plenty of good people over there and some of the finest ones are also members over here. What many (but not all) of us object to are some of the underhanded tactics, the forum politics and the fact that what can only be called far-right propaganda is allowed to flourish without any checks and balances.

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