Page 4 of 11 FirstFirst 1234567 ... LastLast
Results 46 to 60 of 160

Thread: Official Admissions of Unidentified Aerial Phenomena in the sky

  1. #46
    Administrator Aragorn's Avatar
    Join Date
    17th March 2015
    Location
    Middle-Earth
    Posts
    20,239
    Thanks
    88,435
    Thanked 80,968 Times in 20,254 Posts
    Quote Originally posted by Chris View Post
    The impression I got, and it all happened really fast, is that these craft are artificial, they are manufactured in some way by an advanced civilisation, but that they are also given life in some manner. I can only speculate, but my guess would be, that perhaps biological life-forms who can no longer exist in a biological body, due to the vagaries of time, can transfer their consciousness and soul into a machine like this giving it life so to speak. Another possibility, is that a long time ago, this civilisation started merging with machines and in time essentially became entirely machine-like, but still possess the essence of a living being, which is a soul.
    Those would be my two trains of thought as well. Either they became transhuman ─ with the word "human" being the great unknown ─ and over time they evolved into a purely artificial and inorganic lifeform, or they might have uploaded their consciousness into a computer. The latter, by the way, is also a technology known to the Vineans in the Yoko Tsuno comics I spoke of higher up.

    The third possibility would be that an advanced enough civilization might eventually discover how to truly create artificial and non-biological life. And if life itself is something that exists at a much higher-dimensional level from our reality, then I don't see this as impossible to achieve. After all, organic life also started off out of inorganic elements and eventually gave rise to very complex beings such as ourselves.

    But such a feat would of course be an eternity away from what we today call artificial intelligence. Artificial intelligence is not life. It's just a very cleverly built machine.
    = DEATH BEFORE DISHONOR =

  2. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Aragorn For This Useful Post:

    Chris (24th May 2021), Dreamtimer (24th May 2021), Emil El Zapato (24th May 2021), Wind (24th May 2021)

  3. #47
    Super Moderator Wind's Avatar
    Join Date
    16th January 2015
    Location
    Just here
    Posts
    7,206
    Thanks
    33,712
    Thanked 27,303 Times in 7,219 Posts
    I find the idea of transhumanism off putting. I wouldn't like the idea of uploading my consciousness to some machine or replacing my body parts eternally to something inorganic, it creeps me out. We are here incarnated in flesh for a reason, through our nerves and senses we get to experience the seemingly physical world with it's pleasures and pains. I think it's certainly possible that there are conscious machine-beings.

  4. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Wind For This Useful Post:

    Aragorn (24th May 2021), Chris (24th May 2021), Dreamtimer (24th May 2021), Emil El Zapato (24th May 2021)

  5. #48
    Senior Member Emil El Zapato's Avatar
    Join Date
    3rd April 2017
    Location
    Earth I
    Posts
    12,191
    Thanks
    36,640
    Thanked 43,100 Times in 11,915 Posts
    If you've ever wished you could be someone else, Bio-technology is the door. It's still you, you would just 'look' different. Cat-People, Dog-People, Fish-People, Bird-People, Machine-People, Superhuman-people, genius-people, exotic-people, beautiful-people, evil-people, in light of the ability to transform oneself, would likely mean over time very few people-people, but one always has a choice.
    “El revolucionario: te meteré la bota en el culo"

  6. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Emil El Zapato For This Useful Post:

    Aragorn (24th May 2021), Chris (24th May 2021), Dreamtimer (24th May 2021), Wind (24th May 2021)

  7. #49
    Super Moderator Wind's Avatar
    Join Date
    16th January 2015
    Location
    Just here
    Posts
    7,206
    Thanks
    33,712
    Thanked 27,303 Times in 7,219 Posts
    That's not the first time something like that has been done, chimeras existed during the times of Atlantis and genetic "speciments" got out of hand. You think the likes of mermaids were just mythical creatures?

  8. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Wind For This Useful Post:

    Aragorn (24th May 2021), Chris (24th May 2021), Dreamtimer (24th May 2021), Emil El Zapato (24th May 2021)

  9. #50
    Administrator Aragorn's Avatar
    Join Date
    17th March 2015
    Location
    Middle-Earth
    Posts
    20,239
    Thanks
    88,435
    Thanked 80,968 Times in 20,254 Posts
    Quote Originally posted by Wind View Post
    I find the idea of transhumanism off putting. I wouldn't like the idea of uploading my consciousness to some machine or replacing my body parts eternally to something inorganic, it creeps me out. We are here incarnated in flesh for a reason, through our nerves and senses we get to experience the seemingly physical world with it's pleasures and pains.
    Personally, I have my own considerations as well with regard to transhumanism ─ one very important consideration being that, if anything, information technology has already long proven itself very vulnerable to malicious intervention. And yes, having one's natural senses replaced by artificial ones is also a tricky thing ─ will it be better, or will it be worse? But at the same time, I do think that being able to walk again if you are paralyzed from the waist down ─ as my father was after an explosion that broke his back and nearly killed him ─ or being able to see when you are blind, or being able to hear when you are deaf, is not to be dismissed.

    Back when I was a young boy, there was a sci-fi series on TV called "The Six Million Dollar Man" with Lee Majors in the titular role as Steve Austin, an astronaut and test pilot who gets badly injured in a crash with an experimental rocket plane. Not only is he barely alive anymore, but he's missing both of his legs, his right arm and his left eye. But with funding from the US government, they decide to "rebuild" Steve with a pair of bionic legs, a bionic arm and a bionic eye. And when my dad had had his accident and it became clear that he'd remain a paraplegic for the rest of his life, we were all hoping that the kind of bionic technology from that TV series would become a reality, so that he'd be able to walk again.

    All of the above said, your statement that "we have incarnated into flesh for a reason" has a ─ for myself ─ dangerously conservative and religious-sounding connotation to it. Yes, we have incarnated as biological beings, but that in and of itself should not create any ethical objections with regard to helping physically disabled people find their quality of life again. But at the same time, what I do personally have my objections to is the use of cybernetic implants in order to gain an unfair advantage over other people for military or criminal reasons, or just "because we can", or for recreational purposes ─ e.g. connecting your mind to the internet (which would also be very dangerous) ─ or, lastly, so as to prolong one's natural life, similar to how the rich elites are currently paying for rejuvenating transfusions with teenage blood. That sort of thing is unethical and disgusting, and I feel the same way about eugenics and the concept of designer babies.

    As with everything, we should not be looking at the "what", but at the "why". On the one hand, there's the being scientifically and technically capable of doing any particular thing, and on the other hand, there's are the ethical and moral considerations with regard to our reasons for doing said particular thing, as well as any known and unknown potential ramifications thereof ─ e.g. as a wild (but technologically not so far-fetched) example, connecting your brain to the internet by way of a WiFi implant and then getting your brain hacked into by cybercriminals.

    Just my two Eurocents, at today's exchange rates.





    Quote Originally posted by Wind View Post
    You think the likes of mermaids were just mythical creatures?
    I can't speak for BoB, but I do.
    = DEATH BEFORE DISHONOR =

  10. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Aragorn For This Useful Post:

    Chris (24th May 2021), Dreamtimer (24th May 2021), Emil El Zapato (24th May 2021), Wind (24th May 2021)

  11. #51
    Retired Member Hungary
    Join Date
    10th July 2018
    Posts
    1,862
    Thanks
    4,696
    Thanked 8,908 Times in 1,858 Posts
    This 3-hour Joe Rogan podcast with George Knapp and Jeremy Corbell is almost a year old, but worth watching in its entirety, as it goes into real depth concerning the exact topics we are discussing here. In case you didn't know, George Knapp is the reporter that originally broke the Bob Lazar story back in 1988 and has been a serious investigative reporter ever since, Jeremy Corbell is his protege and has been instrumental in breaking some crucial UFO stories in the past few years and has also worked closely with Bob Lazar, making a number of documentaries on the topic.

    One thing of note, is the remark I made a few posts ago, about there probably being a religious element to why we can't have full disclosure. Sure enough, at around 1:31 in this video, George Knapp speaks about that very fact, in connection with a congressional UFO investigation that has been mothballed by the Senate majority leader at the time, because when the fundamentalist Christian congressional aide that was sent to investigate, returned to report his findings, on what may be going on at Skinwalker ranch, the Senate committee was worried that they were dealing with demonic forces and would be invoking Satan himself, by looking into this, so they decided to quash the investigation and bury it.

    George Knapp also mentions Whitley Strieber, who was famous for bringing the idea of alien abductions and grey aliens into the public consciousness. Apparently, he's had a complete change of heart since that time and now believes that these beings he has been investigating and who have been tampering with him, aren't aliens at all, rather they are the gods we have always believed in.


    Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hc6pbG4wICA


    Quote Originally posted by Aragorn View Post
    Those would be my two trains of thought as well. Either they became transhuman ─ with the word "human" being the great unknown ─ and over time they evolved into a purely artificial and inorganic lifeform, or they might have uploaded their consciousness into a computer. The latter, by the way, is also a technology known to the Vineans in the Yoko Tsuno comics I spoke of higher up.

    The third possibility would be that an advanced enough civilization might eventually discover how to truly create artificial and non-biological life. And if life itself is something that exists at a much higher-dimensional level from our reality, then I don't see this as impossible to achieve. After all, organic life also started off out of inorganic elements and eventually gave rise to very complex beings such as ourselves.

    But such a feat would of course be an eternity away from what we today call artificial intelligence. Artificial intelligence is not life. It's just a very cleverly built machine.
    Yes, I would also differentiate between artificial intelligence, which clearly isn't a living being and what was referred to earlier as an "ensouled machine", that would in effect be simply a different form of life, but also one that can have spiritual significance, not just a material one.

  12. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Chris For This Useful Post:

    Aragorn (24th May 2021), Dreamtimer (1st June 2021), Emil El Zapato (24th May 2021), Wind (24th May 2021)

  13. #52
    Super Moderator Wind's Avatar
    Join Date
    16th January 2015
    Location
    Just here
    Posts
    7,206
    Thanks
    33,712
    Thanked 27,303 Times in 7,219 Posts
    Quote Originally posted by Aragorn View Post
    But at the same time, I do think that being able to walk again if you are paralyzed from the waist down ─ as my father was after an explosion that broke his back and nearly killed him ─ or being able to see when you are blind, or being able to hear when you are deaf, is not to be dismissed.

    All of the above said, your statement that "we have incarnated into flesh for a reason" has a ─ for myself ─ dangerously conservative and religious-sounding connotation to it. Yes, we have incarnated as biological beings, but that in and of itself should not create any ethical objections with regard to helping physically disabled people find their quality of life again.
    Oh, well I certainly never meant that or have I had anything against prosthetics really, especially for disabled people, in fact I think it's only great if people like that can be helped more with technology. In fact I always thought that mechanical hand Luke got in Star Wars was kinda cool and I was wondering if there actually ever would be good enough technology to replace lost limbs like that. Also certain kind of exoskeletons might come in handy with physical labour. I'm just wary about things like microchips in the brain and becoming almost fully robotic beings. There's plenty of movies and games like Cyberpunk and Deus Ex which cover this topic. Never seen Spielberg's movie A.I., but it seems to cover the topic about A.I's and their possible humanity.

    I think the topic of transhumanity and robotics indeed poses many questions when it comes to ethics. How much tampering genes is fine and how much isn't? Where does man end and where does the robot begin? Do androids dream of electric sheep?


    Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S6-llUSPwaY


    Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GgTwa3CPrIE


    I can't speak for BoB, but I do.
    I used to think so too, but I'm not so sure anymore. I've realized that mythology is based on reality.

  14. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Wind For This Useful Post:

    Aragorn (24th May 2021), Dreamtimer (1st June 2021), Emil El Zapato (24th May 2021)

  15. #53
    Retired Member United States
    Join Date
    7th April 2015
    Location
    Patapsco Valley
    Posts
    14,610
    Thanks
    70,673
    Thanked 62,025 Times in 14,520 Posts
    Here's a piece from Las Vegas.


  16. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Dreamtimer For This Useful Post:

    Aragorn (1st June 2021), Chris (1st June 2021), Emil El Zapato (1st June 2021), Wind (1st June 2021)

  17. #54
    Senior Member Emil El Zapato's Avatar
    Join Date
    3rd April 2017
    Location
    Earth I
    Posts
    12,191
    Thanks
    36,640
    Thanked 43,100 Times in 11,915 Posts
    Quote Originally posted by Dreamtimer View Post
    Here's a piece from Las Vegas.
    This is getting exciting, almost like a sci-fi alien invasion OR First Contact. Be takin' yo' pick.
    “El revolucionario: te meteré la bota en el culo"

  18. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Emil El Zapato For This Useful Post:

    Aragorn (1st June 2021), Chris (1st June 2021), Dreamtimer (2nd June 2021), Wind (1st June 2021)

  19. #55
    Retired Member Hungary
    Join Date
    10th July 2018
    Posts
    1,862
    Thanks
    4,696
    Thanked 8,908 Times in 1,858 Posts
    Quote Originally posted by BeastOfBologna View Post
    This is getting exciting, almost like a sci-fi alien invasion OR First Contact. Be takin' yo' pick.
    So what do you reckon? What are we actually witnessing here? Aliens from another planet or something else?

  20. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Chris For This Useful Post:

    Aragorn (1st June 2021), Dreamtimer (2nd June 2021), Emil El Zapato (1st June 2021), Wind (1st June 2021)

  21. #56
    Senior Member Emil El Zapato's Avatar
    Join Date
    3rd April 2017
    Location
    Earth I
    Posts
    12,191
    Thanks
    36,640
    Thanked 43,100 Times in 11,915 Posts
    Quote Originally posted by Chris View Post
    So what do you reckon? What are we actually witnessing here? Aliens from another planet or something else?
    jeez, who really knows. Here's my analogy: Wakanda painted in any color.
    “El revolucionario: te meteré la bota en el culo"

  22. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Emil El Zapato For This Useful Post:

    Aragorn (1st June 2021), Chris (1st June 2021), Dreamtimer (2nd June 2021), Wind (1st June 2021)

  23. #57
    Administrator Aragorn's Avatar
    Join Date
    17th March 2015
    Location
    Middle-Earth
    Posts
    20,239
    Thanks
    88,435
    Thanked 80,968 Times in 20,254 Posts
    Quote Originally posted by Chris View Post
    So what do you reckon? What are we actually witnessing here? Aliens from another planet or something else?
    Well, let's be pragmatic...



    What we know about them so far

    • They are physical, tangible objects that obviously exist within our 4-dimensional reality, but that are capable of maneuvers and speeds that would violate the laws of physics as we understand them ─ not to mention that these maneuvers would kill any biological entities within them with 100% certainty ─ unless their propulsion and buoyancy operate outside of the relativistic realm. In other words, they most likely use a warp drive and anti-gravity, both of which by definition bend the fabric of spacetime.

    • Nobody on Earth ─ that we know of ─ possesses that kind of technology, and if anyone did, then it'd be the Americans. But even the Americans don't know what these things are, or what we're dealing with.

    • They appear to be taking a special interest in our defensive capabilities and our military installations.

    • They don't even bother hiding themselves when investigating the aforementioned military capabilities. It's happening in broad daylight and under clear skies.



    What logic dictates

    • Given that their technology is obviously hundreds if not thousands or even millions of years ahead of anything we know and are capable of today, they must be coming here from another solar system than ours.

    • Given the effects of deep space travel on biological entities, they are most likely unmanned vehicles, controlled by an artificial intelligence.

    • Given their unbridled and rather defiant interest in our military capabilities, they are most likely not afraid of us, but they may be assessing both our strengths and our weaknesses. This suggests that their reconnaissance could ─ emphasis ─ be a prelude to a potentially imminent hostile open contact, cfr. the ancient legends of how humanity was created as a slave species by purported "gods".
    = DEATH BEFORE DISHONOR =

  24. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Aragorn For This Useful Post:

    Chris (1st June 2021), Dreamtimer (2nd June 2021), Emil El Zapato (1st June 2021), Wind (1st June 2021)

  25. #58
    Senior Member Emil El Zapato's Avatar
    Join Date
    3rd April 2017
    Location
    Earth I
    Posts
    12,191
    Thanks
    36,640
    Thanked 43,100 Times in 11,915 Posts
    Quote Originally posted by Aragorn View Post
    Well, let's be pragmatic...



    What we know about them so far

    • They are physical, tangible objects that obviously exist within our 4-dimensional reality, but that are capable of maneuvers and speeds that would violate the laws of physics as we understand them ─ not to mention that these maneuvers would kill any biological entities within them with 100% certainty ─ unless their propulsion and buoyancy operate outside of the relativistic realm. In other words, they most likely use a warp drive and anti-gravity, both of which by definition bend the fabric of spacetime.

    • Nobody on Earth ─ that we know of ─ possesses that kind of technology, and if anyone did, then it'd be the Americans. But even the Americans don't know what these things are, or what we're dealing with.

    • They appear to be taking a special interest in our defensive capabilities and our military installations.

    • They don't even bother hiding themselves when investigating the aforementioned military capabilities. It's happening in broad daylight and under clear skies.



    What logic dictates

    • Given that their technology is obviously hundreds if not thousands or even millions of years ahead of anything we know and are capable of today, they must be coming here from another solar system than ours.

    • Given the effects of deep space travel on biological entities, they are most likely unmanned vehicles, controlled by an artificial intelligence.

    • Given their unbridled and rather defiant interest in our military capabilities, they are most likely not afraid of us, but they may be assessing both our strengths and our weaknesses. This suggests that their reconnaissance could ─ emphasis ─ be a prelude to a potentially imminent hostile open contact, cfr. the ancient legends of how humanity was created as a slave species by purported "gods".
    It's kind of unbelievable to me that it is moving out in the open ... that really surprises me. Here's one thing to think about though, over the past 7 or 8 decades, the technology of the UAPs has 'ostensibly' changed from balloonlike devices to cigar shapes, to saucers, to triangles. From a purely physical perspective, those changes don't make sense considering that a highly advanced civilization/s is visiting from interstellar distances. I certainly don't discount it, that would be a downer for me, but it seems unlikely. This is why when looking only from that perspective I settle on Wakanda.

    Of course, we know that it isn't that simple. Perhaps, we will actually find out.
    “El revolucionario: te meteré la bota en el culo"

  26. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Emil El Zapato For This Useful Post:

    Aragorn (1st June 2021), Dreamtimer (2nd June 2021)

  27. #59
    Retired Member Hungary
    Join Date
    10th July 2018
    Posts
    1,862
    Thanks
    4,696
    Thanked 8,908 Times in 1,858 Posts
    Quote Originally posted by Aragorn View Post
    Well, let's be pragmatic...



    What we know about them so far

    • They are physical, tangible objects that obviously exist within our 4-dimensional reality, but that are capable of maneuvers and speeds that would violate the laws of physics as we understand them ─ not to mention that these maneuvers would kill any biological entities within them with 100% certainty ─ unless their propulsion and buoyancy operate outside of the relativistic realm. In other words, they most likely use a warp drive and anti-gravity, both of which by definition bend the fabric of spacetime.

    • Nobody on Earth ─ that we know of ─ possesses that kind of technology, and if anyone did, then it'd be the Americans. But even the Americans don't know what these things are, or what we're dealing with.

    • They appear to be taking a special interest in our defensive capabilities and our military installations.

    • They don't even bother hiding themselves when investigating the aforementioned military capabilities. It's happening in broad daylight and under clear skies.



    What logic dictates

    • Given that their technology is obviously hundreds if not thousands or even millions of years ahead of anything we know and are capable of today, they must be coming here from another solar system than ours.

    • Given the effects of deep space travel on biological entities, they are most likely unmanned vehicles, controlled by an artificial intelligence.

    • Given their unbridled and rather defiant interest in our military capabilities, they are most likely not afraid of us, but they may be assessing both our strengths and our weaknesses. This suggests that their reconnaissance could ─ emphasis ─ be a prelude to a potentially imminent hostile open contact, cfr. the ancient legends of how humanity was created as a slave species by purported "gods".
    Sounds reasonable.

    My own interpretation differs slightly.

    I think the chances of these being hostile are extremely low. Given their technological sophistication, they would obviously have no trouble annihilating us, but they have shown no sign of wanting to do that. On the other hand, they seem to be particularly concerned with military installations, ships, planes and other equipment. They have a habit of disabling nuclear weapons, even though those clearly don't pose a threat to them, but they would pose a threat to other humans and the biosphere on this planet. To me, this would indicate that they wish to preserve life, including human life and aren't aggressive. So far, they have never fired a weapon in anger, as far as I can tell and have only used nonlethal, disabling methods to neutralise human weapon systems. Any aggressive species would just fire a couple of anti-matter warheads or some sort of directed energy weapon and be done with it.

    However, their behaviour in terms of abductions and supposedly, cattle mutilations, is disturbing to say the least. It may indicate that they see us as a lower order of life and do not accord us the same consideration, that they would to their own species, perhaps they see us laboratory specimens to be experimented on, or a source of biological matter for their experiments. This, of course, is assuming the abductions are real, but there is no actual proof for them, unlike for UAPs.

    If we stick strictly to what we can observe about UAPs, the picture is considerably more promising as we can see a clear ability to do us harm, but this ability is never used and at most, they might play with us a bit, presumably for their own amusement.

  28. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Chris For This Useful Post:

    Aragorn (1st June 2021), Dreamtimer (2nd June 2021), Emil El Zapato (1st June 2021), Wind (1st June 2021)

  29. #60
    Administrator Aragorn's Avatar
    Join Date
    17th March 2015
    Location
    Middle-Earth
    Posts
    20,239
    Thanks
    88,435
    Thanked 80,968 Times in 20,254 Posts
    Quote Originally posted by BeastOfBologna View Post
    It's kind of unbelievable to me that it is moving out in the open ... that really surprises me. Here's one thing to think about though, over the past 7 or 8 decades, the technology of the UAPs has 'ostensibly' changed from balloonlike devices to cigar shapes, to saucers, to triangles. From a purely physical perspective, those changes don't make sense considering that a highly advanced civilization/s is visiting from interstellar distances. I certainly don't discount it, that would be a downer for me, but it seems unlikely. This is why when looking only from that perspective I settle on Wakanda.

    Of course, we know that it isn't that simple. Perhaps, we will actually find out.
    Well, first of all, it would be silly to assume that we're dealing with only one specific extraterrestrial civilization, and that all of their craft would be similar in design. Secondly, a lot of the reported craft are of course the products of the imagination of clever pranksters and hoaxers, or of delusional minds, such as schizophrenics.
    = DEATH BEFORE DISHONOR =

  30. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Aragorn For This Useful Post:

    Chris (1st June 2021), Dreamtimer (2nd June 2021), Emil El Zapato (1st June 2021), Wind (1st June 2021)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •