Near-death experiences

[Aragorn]

Aragorn, I'm sorry to hear that you would want to stop existing. Yet that's not how it works as consciousness is fundamental and there's not a point where you would really cease to be. Perhaps life here on Earth has just been way too harsh for you and I must assume that for some souls it can be even too harsh. It's not easy here for sure.

There was a point somewhere in the spacetime continuum ─ or perhaps even in the quantum field ─ where I did not exist, and where the consciousness that dwells within me was still part of the singularity. So it must be possible to return there.

They can have my memories and the knowledge I've gained from existing if they want those, but I myself do not want to exist anymore when I leave these mortal realms, except for a brief time span in which I will gladly be the delivery boy of karma unto the sadistic freaks that threw me into this life and then made sure that it was going to be all fucked up from the first day onto the last.

As above, so below, and as below, so above.

[Emil El Zapato]

hmm ...

[Octopus Garden]

Aragorn, Perhaps it is possible to melt back into the singularity. I think that is the ultimate goal of Zen buddhism. I wonder if you are meant to experience joy and peace the next time around? You have learned enough through suffering. That sounds kind of like the Catholic version of heaven, and so be it. Whatever works.

As far as surveillance goes, I hear what you are saying about AI and governments and corporations and you don't want to participate in something that seems like an extension of, or rough approximation of the same thing.

When I come back, I want to help restore the planet, somehow, and dismantle that machinery of oppression. (Plus overcome some personality glitches)

I myself do not want to exist anymore when I leave these mortal realms, except for a brief time span in which I will gladly be the delivery boy of karma unto the sadistic freaks that threw me into this life and then made sure that it was going to be all fucked up from the first day onto the last.

I understand completely.

Aragorn, What if you could come back, have some measure of peace and happiness and help those who have suffered so much, like Kelly and yourself?

Would you opt for that? You could kick sadist's butts at the same time? It would be a worthy pursuit!

[Aragorn]

I myself do not want to exist anymore when I leave these mortal realms, except for a brief time span in which I will gladly be the delivery boy of karma unto the sadistic freaks that threw me into this life and then made sure that it was going to be all fucked up from the first day onto the last.

I understand completely.

Aragorn, What if you could come back, have some measure of peace and happiness and help those who have suffered so much, like Kelly and yourself?

Would you opt for that? You could kick sadist's butts at the same time? It would be a worthy pursuit!

Nope, no way. I've done my share of all that while I was here, and I also know that it doesn't work that way. Things are the way they are because somebody somewhere ordained them to be as such, and so there's no point in trying to help anyone if their fate was already sealed. Your help would be futile, because the powers that be wouldn't allow deviation from their plan.

Besides ─ and please don't see me as selfish ─ it's not worth my suffering. It's not like the weight of the world was meant to rest on my shoulders only. So let others do their part too in making this world a better place. I've done mine.

[Chris]

Hi Aragorn,

I am a bit puzzled by your negative view of the afterlife and the process of reincarnation. You never actually explained why you have this view, I'm curious.

BTW, I think that the Michael Newton material, which Wind quoted from earlier, is probably accurate. I think you should read some of his work. It isn't based on any pre-conceived notion or religious view, but it purely a result of past-life regression hypnotherapy. In my view, this kind of work, where you look at things as they are, rather than as you were taught they are or as you would like them to be, is the most likely to be a reliable guide to the process of reincarnation and the afterlife.

I also have to tell you, that if you still harbour resentment and revenge fantasies about those that may have wronged you in the past, you are unlikely to be able to return to source after this incarnation. Resentment acts like a rope, tying you down into this reality. If you want to escape Samsara, you have to let go of it and forgive those that have wronged you.

I personally harbour no resentment towards anyone. Not Satan, Not Yahweh, not any of the archangels, fallen angels, etc...

Ultimately, none of them matter, they are all small and limited creatures, that imagine themselves to be all-powerful creator or destroyer gods, but really, they have no idea about the vastness of infinity that exists beyond their limited purview.

If you can move beyond your preoccupation with angels, demons, gods, etc... and take a unitive, non-dual view of the universe, you will experience realms that you couldn't even have conceived of before.

[Dreamtimer]

Speaking for myself, I have believed in reincarnation since I first heard of it. It just made sense to me. I've also read that when Jesus talked about being reborn he was actually referring to reincarnation.

I believe that idea was bastardized because it's much easier to control people with ideas of eternal reward/punishment. The churches wanted/needed to control.

The little boy whose story I related fascinates me. And the bottom line is to love each other.

Regardless of whether you want to come back or not, Aragorn, you have shown that you love, are capable of love and do love others. Not only that, you have shown honor in the face of some epic assholes.

That's the way to go. You don't blame anyone else for your life that I can see. If you did go before the council they'd probably be pleased in many ways.

If all is predetermined, that's alright, imo. There are so many possibilities and permutations in life that I believe it's possible to come back and live a life in a different way, because that way was also written.

I say this because of having dreamt of infinite possibilities and exploring them in order to help navigate this life. It's impossible to recall them all simply because my human brain cannot.

I imagine we are much more vastly aware in spirit/soul form. Perhaps we can recall all of our lives, those we've lived and those yet to come.

Octopus Garden, I don't think you shared too much. I would easily feel the same way about anyone who hurt my child. They would be on my list for annihilation for sure.

Chris, I really like your take on the Gods. Don't worry too much about them. They need the fear and awe and whatever else. It's probably like food to them.

I've had to learn the hard way that I can't work to please others because I cannot control others' feelings or actions. But I can be the person that I want to be. I can make the choices that feel right and good and that I can take pride in.

Pleasing others or being popular are dead ends, imo.

[Aragorn]

Hi Aragorn,

I am a bit puzzled by your negative view of the afterlife and the process of reincarnation. You never actually explained why you have this view, I'm curious.

It's very easy, though. I simply don't like it, and I have no intention whatsoever to reincarnate. I experience my physical body as a burden, and for that matter, a high-maintenance one.

BTW, I think that the Michael Newton material, which Wind quoted from earlier, is probably accurate. I think you should read some of his work. It isn't based on any pre-conceived notion or religious view, but it purely a result of past-life regression hypnotherapy. In my view, this kind of work, where you look at things as they are, rather than as you were taught they are or as you would like them to be, is the most likely to be a reliable guide to the process of reincarnation and the afterlife.

I never said that the material wouldn't be legitimate, albeit that, as with every hypnotic regression, one has to practise caution on account of where the information comes from. Part of it could still come from the individual's imagination, and/or from unintended suggestions by the therapist during the hypnosis itself.

So I have no problem with the assumption that the recount of those particular hypnotically regressed people would/could be correct as they experienced it. But this in itself neither implies nor requires that I have to like how things work "up there".

I also have to tell you, that if you still harbour resentment and revenge fantasies about those that may have wronged you in the past, you are unlikely to be able to return to source after this incarnation. Resentment acts like a rope, tying you down into this reality. If you want to escape Samsara, you have to let go of it and forgive those that have wronged you.

I think you misunderstood me. I am perfectly capable of letting go, and I have no problem forgetting about the people who've wronged me here on Earth. I do however have a problem with the entities up there ─ whoever they are and whatever they are ─ for having tossed me into this hellhole without my consent. And it's not a matter of revenge but of delivering karma where it is due ─ restoring the badly offset balance.

As above, so below, and as below, so above. It needs to be taken care of "up there" just as it does "down here". Not all of the karma I'd be delivering pertains to wrongs done against myself. I have seen too many others suffering just as badly, and ─ just as in my case ─ with there being or having been an obviously deliberate intent behind that suffering.

I personally harbour no resentment towards anyone. Not Satan, Not Yahweh, not any of the archangels, fallen angels, etc...

I do not believe in Satan ─ I have already long ago (and amply) expounded where that name comes from, and how the religious-historic description of the character is in fact self-contradictory. I also do not believe in Yahweh, although I deem it possible that there would be some narcissistic entity up there that calls itself by that name ─ and who would, if the Old Testament and/or the Torah are to be interpreted as accurate ─ would thus be one and the same thing as this mystical Satan character.

And as for angels, gods, demons, jinn or whatever, they're all just different names for the same kinds of entities, among whom you'll find good ones, bad ones and indifferent ones, just as you would among humans.

Ultimately, none of them matter, they are all small and limited creatures, that imagine themselves to be all-powerful creator or destroyer gods, but really, they have no idea about the vastness of infinity that exists beyond their limited purview.

There you have it.

If you can move beyond your preoccupation with angels, demons, gods, etc... and take a unitive, non-dual view of the universe, you will experience realms that you couldn't even have conceived of before.

I have no preoccupation with any of that. I simply wish for a non-existence after I die from this world.

[Wind]

I say this because of having dreamt of infinite possibilities and exploring them in order to help navigate this life.

Life is just one great fractal.

[Dreamtimer]

I loooove fractals. Can one be smitten by such a thing? If so, then I am. They are soooo amazing. I could just endlessly fall into the dimensions.

I recall The One posting a fractal video which was very creative because it was many iterations of fractals and the colors and shapes and dimensions changed quite a bit. I watched it through several cycles.

Then, when I went back to reading regular posts they kept moving! It took a while to stop, my brain needed to get its land legs back.

[Chris]

It's very easy, though. I simply don't like it, and I have no intention whatsoever to reincarnate. I experience my physical body as a burden, and for that matter, a high-maintenance one.

Sure, but do you have a choice though? It doesn't seem to me that one can stop reincarnating, until all dualistic attachments are severed.

I never said that the material wouldn't be legitimate, albeit that, as with every hypnotic regression, one has to practise caution on account of where the information comes from. Part of it could still come from the individual's imagination, and/or from unintended suggestions by the therapist during the hypnosis itself.

So I have no problem with the assumption that the recount of those particular hypnotically regressed people would/could be correct as they experienced it. But this in itself neither implies nor requires that I have to like how things work "up there".

I agree with that. However, notable features within the Michael Newton material include that these were mostly Americans from a Christian background, who did not believe in the concept of reincarnation and the process mentioned therein, consistently, was alien to them.

I reference this material, because it makes the very clear assertion, that souls have free will and are given a say in what kind of life they will choose for themselves. If that is true, you have chosen your current life and your current body. This is in fact quite different from mainstream religious ideas. In Eastern religions, souls have no say over their next incarnation, it is determined by a combination of Karma (consequences of past actions) and pure chance.

In Sumerian and Greek thought, the gods predetermined the fate of each mortal, even before they were born, arbitrarily, though they could be petitioned to make modifications.

I think you misunderstood me. I am perfectly capable of letting go, and I have no problem forgetting about the people who've wronged me here on Earth. I do however have a problem with the entities up there ─ whoever they are and whatever they are ─ for having tossed me into this hellhole without my consent. And it's not a matter of revenge but of delivering karma where it is due ─ restoring the badly offset balance.

That's what I meant. It isn't Karma, but retribution. The very act itself creates Karma that will tie you to this reality for much longer than you'd probably like.

As above, so below, and as below, so above. It needs to be taken care of "up there" just as it does "down here". Not all of the karma I'd be delivering pertains to wrongs done against myself. I have seen too many others suffering just as badly, and ─ just as in my case ─ with there being or having been an obviously deliberate intent behind that suffering.

Still, the consequences would be the same - no liberation for you.

I do not believe in Satan ─ I have already long ago (and amply) expounded where that name comes from, and how the religious-historic description of the character is in fact self-contradictory. I also do not believe in Yahweh, although I deem it possible that there would be some narcissistic entity up there that calls itself by that name ─ and who would, if the Old Testament and/or the Torah are to be interpreted as accurate ─ would thus be one and the same thing as this mystical Satan character.

Your belief, or lack thereof, does not make any difference to their existence or reality. I have no idea if Yahweh, Satan, et al are real, but they certainly are important characters in the Bible. In the book of Job, both of them sit on the divine council and there is a bit of friendly rivalry between them, where they seem to amuse themselves by making a wager on how Job will react to being subjected to endless torture and suffering.

And as for angels, gods, demons, jinn or whatever, they're all just different names for the same kinds of entities, among whom you'll find good ones, bad ones and indifferent ones, just as you would among humans.

It's more complicated than that, there is a hierarchy of power and wisdom, which is quite important. But, like I said, all of them have their limitations, even if some are immensely powerful and wise.

I have no preoccupation with any of that. I simply wish for a non-existence after I die from this world.

If you mean no more physical incarnations, that's certainly possible, but it requires some doing. It is usually the reward of illumined sages, who have cut their earthly attachments.

[Aragorn]

It's very easy, though. I simply don't like it, and I have no intention whatsoever to reincarnate. I experience my physical body as a burden, and for that matter, a high-maintenance one.

Sure, but do you have a choice though? It doesn't seem to me that one can stop reincarnating, until all dualistic attachments are severed.

That's the common narrative for most people, but if I am right about the nature of my soul and the reasons for my being here, then none of that applies to me. I'll get into this farther down ─ I've already spoken about this subject a few times before, even though I don't really like to.

I never said that the material wouldn't be legitimate, albeit that, as with every hypnotic regression, one has to practise caution on account of where the information comes from. Part of it could still come from the individual's imagination, and/or from unintended suggestions by the therapist during the hypnosis itself.

So I have no problem with the assumption that the recount of those particular hypnotically regressed people would/could be correct as they experienced it. But this in itself neither implies nor requires that I have to like how things work "up there".

I agree with that. However, notable features within the Michael Newton material include that these were mostly Americans from a Christian background, who did not believe in the concept of reincarnation and the process mentioned therein, consistently, was alien to them.

I reference this material, because it makes the very clear assertion, that souls have free will and are given a say in what kind of life they will choose for themselves. If that is true, you have chosen your current life and your current body. This is in fact quite different from mainstream religious ideas. In Eastern religions, souls have no say over their next incarnation, it is determined by a combination of Karma (consequences of past actions) and pure chance.

In Sumerian and Greek thought, the gods predetermined the fate of each mortal, even before they were born, arbitrarily, though they could be petitioned to make modifications.

There is definitely a very Christian undertone in all of this, whether it has to do with the near-death experiences of certain people ─ even if those people profess to be atheists, but this usually indicates that they had been raised and indoctrinated as Christians earlier and had then turned away from (that specific) religion later in life ─ or whether it has to do with the target audience being the typical US American Christian.

Indoctrination and conditioning are very powerful tools in the hands of the wrong people, and to a certain extent, each and every one of us has been indoctrinated and/or conditioned with something during our upbringing. By consequence, no matter what belief system we choose to accept later in life ─ including the belief systems called atheism and agnosticism, because those are belief systems too ─ there will always be traces of this indoctrination and/or conditioning lingering in our subconsciousness, and it will continue to reach into our awareness by way of our dreams, our spiritual experiences and even near-death experiences.

It's ubiquitous, and just about every recount of spiritual experiences and near-death experiences I've read or heard about was colorized by those subconscious notions. And I would go even farther than that and say that it may even be tied in with the culture one was born in, even if ─ as in the case of the little baby boy who supposedly had three near-death experiences ─ there hasn't been any chance to indoctrinate or condition the subject. Perhaps it's some kind of noospheric energy field, or maybe it's something that one was already programmed with from before birth ─ be it via the genetic transfer of the parents' memories onto the fetus or be it some kind of pre-programmed belief system in the soul before it is born into a human body.

That all said, there isn't even an inkling of a chance that I would ever have consented to the life that I have been living, or the things that have happened to me and are still happening to me. No fucking way. But ─ and here we go again ─ if I am right about the nature of my soul, then it is quite possible that what applies to myself does not apply to other people, and vice versa. Again, I will get deeper into this farther down.

I do not believe in Satan ─ I have already long ago (and amply) expounded where that name comes from, and how the religious-historic description of the character is in fact self-contradictory. I also do not believe in Yahweh, although I deem it possible that there would be some narcissistic entity up there that calls itself by that name ─ and who would, if the Old Testament and/or the Torah are to be interpreted as accurate ─ would thus be one and the same thing as this mystical Satan character.

And as for angels, gods, demons, jinn or whatever, they're all just different names for the same kinds of entities, among whom you'll find good ones, bad ones and indifferent ones, just as you would among humans.

Your belief, or lack thereof, does not make any difference to their existence or reality. I have no idea if Yahweh, Satan, et al are real, but they certainly are important characters in the Bible. In the book of Job, both of them sit on the divine council and there is a bit of friendly rivalry between them, where they seem to amuse themselves by making a wager on how Job will react to being subjected to endless torture and suffering.

Well, first of all, the Book of Job ─ as most things in the Bible ─ is a metaphor. Secondly, the Torah and the Old Testament state that angels have no free will and aren't even independent entities, but rather that they are emanations from Yahweh. In other words, Yahweh uses avatars that look like individual angels for communicating certain messages to humanity or for performing certain actions in the world, and the angel's name and appearance are merely identifiers for which aspect of his personality Yahweh chooses to manifest at that particular point in time.

So for instance, according to the Kabbalah, the Angel of Death is called Azrael, but as such, Azrael is merely Yahweh in his killing mood. Likewise, in the Book of Tobit, Tobias is accompanied on his journey by a stranger who appears to be the archangel Raphael, who represents the healing side of Yahweh. And Raphael fights, subdues and chains the demon Asmodeus ─ which is a Latin name, presumed by the Kabbalah to have been the fallen angel Azazel ─ who obviously represents one of Yahweh's more violent and possessive traits. A similar theme can be found in Hinduism (Shiva as an avatar of Vishnu) and in Zoroastrianism (Ahriman as an avatar of Ahura Mazda).

The character of Satan in the Book of Job is also not a demon, because he resides in Heaven. Furthermore, his name isn't Satan, because the word "Satan" is a title ─ which is why the word "Satan" is prefixed with the article "the". The word itself stems from the Hebrew word "haschatan", which means "the opponent", "the adversary", and in the story of Job, the Satan plays the role of a prosecutor in Yahweh's celestial courtroom. His purpose is to expose the shortcomings of mankind before Yahweh, who in turn presides as the judge.

It also deserves noting that it is not the Satan who subjects Job to all of his ordeals. It is Yahweh himself who causes Job to suffer endlessly, simply so as to make a point to the Satan that even without Yahweh's protection and sheltering, humans would still continue worshiping and believing in Yahweh. Which in my personal opinion makes Yahweh into a self-righteous, callous and sadistic narcissist who deserves a firm kick in the balls. Or at least, if he had any.

I think you misunderstood me. I am perfectly capable of letting go, and I have no problem forgetting about the people who've wronged me here on Earth. I do however have a problem with the entities up there ─ whoever they are and whatever they are ─ for having tossed me into this hellhole without my consent. And it's not a matter of revenge but of delivering karma where it is due ─ restoring the badly offset balance.

As above, so below, and as below, so above. It needs to be taken care of "up there" just as it does "down here". Not all of the karma I'd be delivering pertains to wrongs done against myself. I have seen too many others suffering just as badly, and ─ just as in my case ─ with there being or having been an obviously deliberate intent behind that suffering.

That's what I meant. It isn't Karma, but retribution.

Karma is the restoration of an offset balance, and I firmly believe that any form of retribution should be educational. If there is no educational aspect to it, then it would be mere revenge. If there is an educational aspect, then the perpetrators will come to learn and understand how and why their actions were wrong, and then the balance would be restored, because with that understanding, they would not be engaging in their earlier wrongdoing anymore.

The very act itself creates Karma that will tie you to this reality for much longer than you'd probably like.

Okay, so here's the story ─ I've already alluded to it a few times higher up in this reply, and as I said, I don't like talking about this, but here goes...

The late Dolores Cannon garnered a lot of information from performing hypnotic regressions on people, but over time, a lot of that information began contradicting her earlier information, and I believe that Dolores eventually lost track of the facts when she spoke about the Three Waves of Volunteers.

In her original information, the Three Waves of Volunteers are souls who had never incarnated before, anywhere. They come straight from the vicinity of what Dolores calls "God", but which I myself would rather call "the Source" ─ I get knee-jerk reactions whenever I hear the word "God" being used as a proper name, and even when I hear about beings who refer to themselves (or prefer being referred to by humans) as "gods".

So, reiterating Dolores' original information, the Three Waves of Volunteers have never incarnated before, and they will also never incarnate again, because incarnation is not something they normally engage in. Also, they are immune to karma. They cannot gather any negative karma because their souls are pure. However, they are also very vulnerable, and considering that they have been sent out across roughly three human generations, it was particularly hard for those of the First Wave to adapt to their life on Earth.

The First Wave started coming in roughly in the early 1960s, until about the middle of the 1970s, which was a time of great turmoil, violence, and a climate of intolerance and oppression. The Second Wave started coming in from the late 1970s until the early 1990s, and they had it easier. Society had already sufficiently mellowed up by that time. The Third Wave, lastly, started coming in from the mid 1990s until roughly the end of the 2000s.

The thing however is, as I already mentioned, that the more people Dolores was regressing, the more information she got, and that this later information started conflicting with her earlier information. Her later information regarding what she herself has kept on referring to as the Three Waves of Volunteers seemed to mostly comprise the recounts of Wanderers, i.e. souls that had already incarnated before, whether here on Earth or elsewhere in the universe, but that kept on incarnating here because of the events of the time frame.

Either they felt that they had some self-assumed purpose or responsibility with regard to the events that were (and would continue to be) unfolding here on Earth, or they were simply here as a witness to those events. And so Dolores started lumping those souls in with the Three Waves of Volunteers, which contradicts the earlier information regarding souls that had never incarnated before, were never going to reincarnate, and were immune to karma.

That all said, allegedly I am here as a member of the First Wave, as per Dolores' original information, and my job here is apparently to show people the way by setting examples. And that's exactly what I've been doing all of my life. But I am no volunteer ─ I was apparently "volunteered" by someone else ─ and no matter what examples I set, people simply aren't seeing it anymore, if they ever have. They've already long become too self-absorbed to still be swayed in the right direction, and ─ as scientific research has shown ─ in this day and age of automation and far-reaching technological innovation, human intelligence is rapidly and seriously declining. IQ scores and general knowledge levels are rapidly dropping. I see this every day at the Manjaro forum, and it has by now become almost impossible to still have a profound conversation with other people.

You can give a man a fish, and you will have fed him for the day. But you can teach a man to fish, and you will have fed him for the rest of his life. But whenever I'm fishing, people aren't looking at how I do it. They're simply lining up with their knives, forks and plates in their hands.

Anyway, at 58 years old, with lots of health issues and pain, on a planet with a fucked up and by now highly unpredictable and volatile climate, and with a dangerously mutating virus going round that vaccinations don't seem capable of stopping from contaminating people, it doesn't look like there's much of a point in still nourishing hope, whether for humanity at large or for my own chances at ever finding happiness on this rock.

I'm still faithfully doing whatever I think and feel is the right thing to do, but I'm guessing that in the grander scheme of things, this in itself would only be a formality anymore. I do what I do because I am who I am ─ it's that simple.

End of story.

[Wind]

I think it's interesting to talk about these kind of things despite some different viewpoints.

I have been shown quite clearly what my soul is, but I don't like to talk about it openly or even privately, because I don't want to appear as anything special. I'm barely a human if anything and I only find it interesting to research and search the truth and perhaps educate some people about it, not in the sense that I would ever be interested in converting people, because that's a fools errand and impossible anyways. People believe what they want to believe. Everyone has to know the truth themselves and find it out on their own, eventually it happen even if it takes eons. "Billions of years ago, you were a big bang, but now you're a complicated human being." - Alan Watts

Everything is conscious and every being has it's own level of consciousness. On this blue planet there are so many different kind of consciousnesses, including in human form. Personally I know that I am a "wanderer" and I have had many lives on this planet before too, but mostly elsewhere than where I currently am living now and perhaps for that reason I don't find the local culture and environment exactly comforting, this is a cold and dark country, the climate only feeds on my melancholic nature. I remember just being in some places and my soul feels familiar in Asia and places with deserts and dry places. My heart tells me that my deepest desire is to know the Creator and be free from Samsara. I suppose I am here to help others in my own way and I must have chosen to be in the midst of this chaos and madness, or my higher Self must have knowing all the risks, traumas, potential outcomes, rewards and such. I don't know if there have been any karmic duties or obligations, but it is possible. We are bound to other people, that's just the way it is.

Still my soul very heavily feels like that I am in place which feels quite primitive and hostile, I have had a hard time understanding the cruel and bestial nature of man. This planet is not a planet of harmony, this planet is a planet of sorrow and it draws brothers and sisters of sorrow towards it. There are other more "normal" places where things are much more easy and harmonious. Is this really "normal"? Maybe for humans it is, but I think many feel in their hearts that there is nothing natural about the way this world currently functions, it's very messed up and it's going to lead to a system failure. System busters will try to change that or die trying, we'll have to see what really will happen after the dust has settled. I don't mean any normal activism with that btw, it all starts with the change in the individual. Be the change you want to see in the world... "No one is useless in this world who lightens the burdens of another." ~ Charles Dickens

[Octopus Garden]

Some incredible writing and profound thinking on this thread. Thank you, everybody. The only thing I can add is we don't understand free will, chance and determinism very well and how they interact with one another.

Without chance, free will can't exist. We see free will and the predetermined as divorced from one another, when they are married to each other. And like a marriage there are constraints that can crush the individual. But the partners are bound to each other and must work it out. They work towards crawling together, to walking and then to dancing.

It's as if free will and the preordained require each other to dance life into being. They occasionally break away from each other, on the cosmic dance floor, to swirl specific events into existence. These are the forces that give birth to the macrocosm and the microcosmic. As above, so below.

[Emil El Zapato]

I was convinced of the grandeur of fractals when I learned that an entire forest can be modeled on the basis of one branch. That is truly a mind-blowing performance by God through nature. The efficiency of that is just astounding.

The West has its ghosts, wandering souls, and demons. The East has its analogs that go by different descriptions. All cultures have their favorites but to me, they seem to have a commonality. They are unhappy, they are lost and looking for a peaceful home, they are reincarnated in some cases to continue the search, they are hungry, they are many things not good. Just a thought Aragorn, but, I think you might be in for another trip, I think you need to forgive yourself for what you feel are shortcomings, even inadequacies. You're not being fair to yourself. I'm Christian as you well know and I think the Bible has a lot to say about happiness, grief, sadness, joy, etc. In effect, it is only relevant when viewed with the perspective that others are more important than oneself. The smallest of sins is as wrong and painful to the Trinity as the greatest of them. Consider the underlying meaning of that statement. I could interpret it to mean that in the mind of the universal, it all shrinks to insignificance, not devoid of value, just insignificant in the totality of consciousness. As in asymptotic behavior, nature's measure.

On the other hand, it does seem very pointless to me to return without knowledge of having been before ... that don't do poopoo for me.

[Chris]

There is definitely a very Christian undertone in all of this, whether it has to do with the near-death experiences of certain people ─ even if those people profess to be atheists, but this usually indicates that they had been raised and indoctrinated as Christians earlier and had then turned away from (that specific) religion later in life ─ or whether it has to do with the target audience being the typical US American Christian.

I just don't see it. To me, the Michael Newton material goes against Christian teachings in a major way.

It's ubiquitous, and just about every recount of spiritual experiences and near-death experiences I've read or heard about was colorized by those subconscious notions. And I would go even farther than that and say that it may even be tied in with the culture one was born in, even if ─ as in the case of the little baby boy who supposedly had three near-death experiences ─ there hasn't been any chance to indoctrinate or condition the subject. Perhaps it's some kind of noospheric energy field, or maybe it's something that one was already programmed with from before birth ─ be it via the genetic transfer of the parents' memories onto the fetus or be it some kind of pre-programmed belief system in the soul before it is born into a human body.

Yeah sure, we create our own reality to a large extent, especially in the astral and causal worlds, so we would manifest whatever our frame of reference is, whether it be Buddhism, Shintoism, Christianity, etc...

I imagine, your astral reality will be an actual Shire from Lord of the Rings

That all said, there isn't even an inkling of a chance that I would ever have consented to the life that I have been living, or the things that have happened to me and are still happening to me. No fucking way. But ─ and here we go again ─ if I am right about the nature of my soul, then it is quite possible that what applies to myself does not apply to other people, and vice versa. Again, I will get deeper into this farther down.

I see two possibilities. Either you experienced suffering due to past karma (which is most people), or if you were a more advanced soul, you consented to suffer on behalf of others, to lessen their karmic load and help them progress, out of compassion.

Karma is the restoration of an offset balance, and I firmly believe that any form of retribution should be educational. If there is no educational aspect to it, then it would be mere revenge. If there is an educational aspect, then the perpetrators will come to learn and understand how and why their actions were wrong, and then the balance would be restored, because with that understanding, they would not be engaging in their earlier wrongdoing anymore.

No.

Karma is the law of consequences. If you do something, act in a certain way, the consequences may eventually come back to haunt you. Every action has consequences, therefore all action generates Karma, which is why it is so damn difficult to break out from the cycle of reincarnation.

Okay, so here's the story ─ I've already alluded to it a few times higher up in this reply, and as I said, I don't like talking about this, but here goes...

Thanks for sharing that.

I haven't heard about Dolores Cannon before, so I cannot judge the authenticity of his work.

The concept of the Three Waves of Volunteers is intriguing. I don't know what to make of it, personally. All I can say, is that Karma is a natural law, it applies to everyone, even gods who may incarnate in the flesh (such as Avatars). Even Krishna, an avatar of Vishnu, suffered the consequences of his actions and died miserably and in pain, because of a curse by a grieving mother, whose son died as a consequence of Krishna's machinations in the great war described in the Mahabharata. The curse of a grieving mother is so strong that even a perfect being, a divine soul in the flesh, cannot escape it.

This is just my personal opinion, but it doesn't seem to me that you are free of the consequences of Karma at all, in fact it looks like you are suffering precisely because of it.

I sense a lot of resentment in you, that is not conducive to liberation, which seems to be your ultimate goal.

If you ask me, you have a lot of work ahead of you, if you truly want to achieve your goal. It is imperative, that you get rid of your attachments and the ties that bind you to the material realm. Resentment and hate do not lead anywhere, even when they are fully justified. Only forgiveness and letting go can end the cycle of rebirth. Being liberated also means that you are free of the usual cotterie of human emotions that plague our primate species. These create invisible ties of energy that make it impossible for a soul escape its bondage.

These ties must be cut, accumulated karma, which build up daily, must be worked off or burnt away. This is not something you can avoid, no matter where your soul may come from.

All of us were once at a much higher station and now we're not. In that sense, we are all fallen. It is our task in this life, to pick ourselves up after the fall, put ourselves back together again, grow wings and fly away.