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Thread: Coronavirus with an R0 of 3 or beyond

  1. #1396
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    The poor sap. So deep into Newsmax and QAnon, he never stood a chance.

    Remember: This one didn’t deny COVID-19 or its danger. He just refused to do anything about it. He wouldn’t even wear a mask, so you can’t even blame it on religious-based Mark of the Beast nonsense. He was opposed to all efforts to defeat a disease he freely admitted was deadly and killing millions. Simply unfathomable.

    Also speaks to all the ways the anti-vaxx movement has gotten its claws into people. Some are roped in by religion—fetal lines or the Mark of the Beast—others by fears of 5G or chemtrails, some just don’t want the government “telling them what to do,” and others are afraid of scary-sounding vaccine ingredients. There are the ones that think it’s a global elite trying to “force” people into “compliance,” while others think it’s a plot by dastardly China to destroy our economy. Or maybe it was a plot to deny Trump his rightful reelection. Some think it’s a hoax, others believe it’s just the flu, while others admit it’s real, just won’t do anything about it. Some wouldn’t take the vaccine because it didn’t have FDA authorization, others think it’s been “rushed” now that it has been, and yet others think the vaccine is literally killing millions and even billions of people. Then, somehow, you have to fit in the “vitamins and supplements” crowd, the hydroxychloroquine and ivermectin proponents, the “Big Pharma is making lots of money off me” crowd (as they buy boner pills), and the “hospitals make big money from killing COVID patients” people.

    This chaos is a huge advantage for the conspiracy theorists—they can create any number of narratives that fit into any number of people’s preconceived biases. A single story to explain it all would fall apart under the weight of evidence. But 1,000 theories? It’s impossible for anyone to systematically undermine all of the shit that’s being flung against the wall.
    Is there a corresponding link to this by chance? I like to follow up on strongly worded opinion pieces, to see what else they write and if they just like beating on drums or not.

    Not that this piece isn't accurate in many respects because it is, it rightly points out much of the high strangeness that gets breathlessly reported on at places like Project Avalon. The vax causing bodies to become magnetized, zombifying brains, it's a slow motion genocide, and on and on and on ad nauseum. That was even part of what made me be seen as "divisive" over there, to question some of that crap, and to point out inherent dangers of a group referring to themselves as "The Purebloods".

    What we have here though, is yet another front on the great culture war. The opposing team pretty much only saw masks, vaccines, vaccine passports, and lockdowns as tools to combat the virus. Nothing else, look nowhere else for any other possible answers. They saw Dr. Fauci as almost an infallible god, and totally disregarded his own form of misinformation early on when lying through his teeth saying no need for masks. That's what these sides do, they minimize or even outright ignore their own transgressions, while being hair on fire about pointing out the slightest transgression coming from "The Others".

    Here are some other rules of the road:

    Both sides have their respective beliefs on what evil country bedevils the planet. To the anti vax side it's usually China, to the pro vax side it's usually Russia.

    The anti vax side is right wing, the pro vax side is left wing.

    The anti vax side refuses to see its own strong element of censorship, the pro vax side refuses to see its own strong element of censorship.

    Deep down, both sides long to be the censors.

    The anti vax side loves FOX NEWS, the pro vax side loves MSNBC.

    So damn predictable, and never the two sides shall speak to one another. Nothing but contempt for "The Others".

    It still confounds me how a medical emergency became not only politicized, but got sucked right into the very fabric of the culture war itself. Interesting that if you know what a single warrior thinks about just one front of this war, you'll have a pretty good idea of where they stand on all the fronts. Just a matter of which particular battlefield they happen to meet up on, on any given day.
    The unexamined life is not worth living.

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    Quote Originally posted by Fred Steeves View Post
    Is there a corresponding link to this by chance? I like to follow up on strongly worded opinion pieces, to see what else they write and if they just like beating on drums or not.

    Not that this piece isn't accurate in many respects because it is, it rightly points out much of the high strangeness that gets breathlessly reported on at places like Project Avalon. The vax causing bodies to become magnetized, zombifying brains, it's a slow motion genocide, and on and on and on ad nauseum. That was even part of what made me be seen as "divisive" over there, to question some of that crap, and to point out inherent dangers of a group referring to themselves as "The Purebloods".

    What we have here though, is yet another front on the great culture war. The opposing team pretty much only saw masks, vaccines, vaccine passports, and lockdowns as tools to combat the virus. Nothing else, look nowhere else for any other possible answers. They saw Dr. Fauci as almost an infallible god, and totally disregarded his own form of misinformation early on when lying through his teeth saying no need for masks. That's what these sides do, they minimize or even outright ignore their own transgressions, while being hair on fire about pointing out the slightest transgression coming from "The Others".

    Here are some other rules of the road:

    Both sides have their respective beliefs on what evil country bedevils the planet. To the anti vax side it's usually China, to the pro vax side it's usually Russia.

    The anti vax side is right wing, the pro vax side is left wing.

    The anti vax side refuses to see its own strong element of censorship, the pro vax side refuses to see its own strong element of censorship.

    Deep down, both sides long to be the censors.

    The anti vax side loves FOX NEWS, the pro vax side loves MSNBC.

    So damn predictable, and never the two sides shall speak to one another. Nothing but contempt for "The Others".

    It still confounds me how a medical emergency became not only politicized, but got sucked right into the very fabric of the culture war itself. Interesting that if you know what a single warrior thinks about just one front of this war, you'll have a pretty good idea of where they stand on all the fronts. Just a matter of which particular battlefield they happen to meet up on, on any given day.
    I agree, the polarization and the politicization of the vaccine issue is really frustrating.

    I am generally pro-vax and I am double-vaxxed for covid. However, I do think that some of the criticism levelled at covid vaccines is valid. As we discussed here before, they are far less effective and safe as has been advertised and there is a certain amount of authoritarianism that is connected to the vaccine issue, it is used to clamp down on dissent and curtail freedoms. I also think Dr Robert Malone is legit, something many here don't agree with.

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  5. #1398
    Super Moderator Fred Steeves's Avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by Chris View Post
    I agree, the polarization and the politicization of the vaccine issue is really frustrating.

    I am generally pro-vax and I am double-vaxxed for covid. However, I do think that some of the criticism levelled at covid vaccines is valid. As we discussed here before, they are far less effective and safe as has been advertised and there is a certain amount of authoritarianism that is connected to the vaccine issue, it is used to clamp down on dissent and curtail freedoms. I also think Dr Robert Malone is legit, something many here don't agree with.
    I got the first double Moderna vax round last spring (which made me stupid, pro vax/anti science). But that didn't mean I had no concerns about it, and by the time the third round was being trotted out I was having some real issues with the big push for them, and seriously questioning were they really needed (which made me a stupid, antivax/science denier).

    Never was gonna get that third dose. Wound up with a nice little visit from Uncle Omicron, but at least now I feel pretty secure in being naturally immunized for some time. Coupled with not being a fan of lockdowns, and the extreme manner in which this has been politicized, I wonder if that tips the scales towards me a right wing science denier, as opposed to a left wing science denier...
    Last edited by Fred Steeves, 17th February 2022 at 03:27.
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    Quote Originally posted by Fred Steeves View Post
    I got the first double Moderna vax round last spring (which made me stupid, pro vax/anti science). But that didn't mean I had no concerns about it, and by the time the third round was being trotted out I was having some real issues with the big push for them, and seriously questioning were they really needed (which made me a stupid, antivax/science denier).

    Never was gonna get that third dose. Wound up with a nice little visit from Uncle Omicron, but at least now I feel pretty secure in being naturally immunized for some time. Coupled with not being a fan of lockdowns, and the extreme manner in which this has been politicized, I wonder if that tips the scales towards me a right wing science denier, as opposed to a left wing science denier...
    Yeah, there doesn't seem to be a middle ground, classic polarization / divide n rule tactics.

    Either you believe that Lizard People, with the help of Bill Gates and 5G towers are injecting you with poison and the Mark of the Beast to exterminate humanity and bring about the apocalypse, or otherwise you are a Brainwashed sheep sycopanth who hasn't "woken up" and seen through the lies of mainstream media.

    It's so predictable and just incredibly stupid. Lack of nuance and distinction is a sign of low intelligence btw, things are never black and white, never so simple.

    As for me, I believe in the general efficacy and usefulness of vaccines. I am double vaxxed, with Sinopharm, which is a real, traditional vaccine and I wouldn't mind taking a third shot at all, if I could stick to the tried and tested technology, but medical protocol prohibits me from taking a third Sinopharm shot and they are pushing people towards mRNA and vector vaccines, which are more effective in the elderly, but far less safe overall.

    Frankly, mRNA technology is still experimental and a really stupid and roundabout way to vaccinate someone, there is really no need to do a gene therapy when there are much safer, tried and tested methods out there, for instance protein-based or inactivated virus vaccines.

    All the rest is speculation, but I tend to go to greed and avarice when it comes to why this thing is being pushed down our throats. Anyone who trusts big pharma or big anything to have our best interests at heart is frankly a fool. They are out there to make money and they have little regard for human life, injuries, or anything else, if it hurts their bottom line.

    BTW, I still haven't seen a single MM media report about the adverse effects of Corona vaccines, there are tens of thousands of dead and even more with serious injuries, some of them life-changing, like paralysis or myocarditis. If this was at any other time and not during a major pandemic, it would be the scandal of the century, but now people are just getting away with pushing unsafe and experimental pharmaceuticals on the general population, with government assistance, no less. All I see in the media is attempts to discredit anyone who talks about it. So yeah, nuance and taking a balanced approach is important.

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    Quote Originally posted by Chris View Post
    Frankly, mRNA technology is still experimental and a really stupid and roundabout way to vaccinate someone, there is really no need to do a gene therapy when there are much safer, tried and tested methods out there, for instance protein-based or inactivated virus vaccines.
    mRNA is most certainly not gene therapy — not even by a long shot. It boggles my mind that people would think so, but then again, I guess we can blame the drop in quality of the education system for that.

    Here's how it works... Traditional vaccination introduces dead or weakened viruses into your body, so that your immune system can start building up a defense against them. However, this is a slow process, exactly because those viruses are dead or weakened, and thus they pose less of a threat to your health, and thus your body responds to their presence in your body with lower priority. As such, a traditional vaccine is in fact based upon making you just a little bit ill from the virus — not as ill as with a full-on infection, but still enough to trigger a response from your immune system.

    mRNA vaccination on the other hand does not introduce any viruses into your bloodstream, and thus, you cannot get sick from the virus itself. Instead, the vaccine only contains a piece of RNA from the virus. As such, your body does not have to suffer from the ill effects of toxins being released by the virus — because the virus itself has not been introduced into your body — while your immune system on the other hand does recognize the piece of virus RNA and regards it as an intruder, with as a result that you start developing antibodies against the virus even though the virus itself does not reside in your bloodstream.

    And that's all there is to it. Your DNA is not being changed, because this has nothing to do with your DNA or your genes. It is simply the triggering of a natural immune response by way of a piece of genetic code from the virus instead of by the whole virus itself. This genetic code does not have anything to do with your genetic code. It is only a marker to make your body identify the virus as an intruder and prepare itself for battle against said intruder by developing antibodies.

    Of course, certain people can experience illness from the vaccine because if your immune system responds too violently, then this too will give you some of the symptoms that people traditionally associate with an infection, such as fever. Because in the end, that's what fever is. Fever is never caused by any virus or bacteria, but by your immune system itself as it's fighting off the virus or bacteria. That is not to say that the virus or bacteria would itself not have any ill effects on your body, of course. For instance, muscle pain during a virus infection is a result of the toxins created by the virus while it's reproducing at the cost of your own genetic code. But the fever is not; it is caused by your own body.

    Now, that all said, I myself have not been vaccinated, and this is not because I would be anti-vaxx — I am not! — but because I have autoimmune issues, and I know how violently my body responded to the alpha strain of the SARS-CoV-2 virus when I got infected with it twice in 2020 — first in April, and then again in October. And I may have also had the omicron strain about a month ago, but I'm not certain. I was never tested, and I'm not the kind of guy who calls or visits a doctor over the slightest bit of discomfort. I will always try to help myself first before calling upon help from someone else, in every aspect of my life — life itself has conditioned me that way.

    Still, what I wrote above about the vaccines is the truth. An mRNA vaccine is not and has nothing to do with gene therapy. It's only a way of vaccinating you against a particular virus without having to introduce any real viruses — dead or weakened — into your bloodstream, but instead they inject only a piece of the virus' genetic code into your blood so that your immune system will recognize it as an intruder and build up antibodies against said intruder. You can compare it to the cops identifying a vehicle as stolen by looking at its license plate instead of looking at its shape and color.
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    https://mrna.creative-biolabs.com/mr...SAAEgJC2_D_BwE

    mRNA for Gene Therapy


    Creative Biolabs is a leading service provider that focuses on messenger ribonucleic acid (mRNA) therapeutics development. Currently, various platforms have been established for analyzing the function and mechanism of action of mRNA. By combining cutting edge technologies with proprietary innovations, scientists at Creative Biolabs provide a full range of services on mRNA-based gene therapy. With our extensive experience and advanced platform, we are always dedicated to assisting our clients with the most satisfactory data.

    Introduction of Gene Therapy

    Gene therapy has shown promising results in the treatment of human diseases, including tumors, autoimmune disorders, and infectious diseases. Normally, gene therapy is generated by transferring specific genetic information into target cells to alter their functions in disease therapy. In particular, gene therapy can be used for replacing or blocking mutated genes that cause diseases. Moreover, recent reports have demonstrated that gene therapy can also be used for inserting target genes against diseases. Meanwhile, many studies have indicated that vectors play a significant role in delivering genes. Different types of delivery vectors have been designed in the past few years of studies. Among them, several kinds of virus-based vectors, such as retroviral vectors, lentiviral vectors, adenoviral vectors, as well as adeno-associated viral vectors, are widely used in gene therapy development. Besides, many advanced technologies, such as genetic engineering, recombinant DNA technique, as well as mRNA technology, have been utilized in improving the performance of gene therapy in disease treatments.

    Services for mRNA-based Gene Therapy
    Since the great success of gene therapy in cancer treatment, many attempts have been made recently to improve their safety and efficacy both in preclinical trials and clinical trials. Also, recent researchers have illustrated that some viral vectors can cause many severe side effects in disease models. Nowadays, mRNA molecules have been considered as suitable alternative plasmids for gene therapy due to their rapid and high-level expression in cancers. Furthermore, many reporters have revealed that mRNA-based gene therapy can be achieved at different levels, such as cell level, exosome level, and molecular-level. Till now, several mRNA-based modalities have been designed and developed for treating glioblastoma multiforme (GBM) in preclinical studies and some of them are undergoing different phases of clinical trials.

    Therefore, Creative Biolabs has established a panel of platforms to design and validate potential mRNA molecules for the treatment of various human diseases, including cancers. Equipped with several advanced technologies, we can provide a seamless service chain, ranging from in silico mRNA structure prediction, mRNA constructs design, animal modeling, to safety and toxicity evaluation. Meanwhile, we are capable of offering a wide array of optimization assays to improve the efficacy of mRNA-based gene therapy.

    De novo synthesis of the functional proteins
    The delivery of the specific mRNA to the target cells
    In vitro and in vivo assessment

    With over years of experience in mRNA therapeutics development, Creative Biolabs offers a large collection of mRNA-based assays targeting different types of disease targets. Our client-focused, integrated team will anticipate challenges, overcome difficulties, and successfully convert various potential targets into clinical trials. If you are interested in our services, please feel free to contact us for more information.

    Reference

    Michel, T.; et al. Next-Generation Therapeutics: mRNA as a Novel Therapeutic Option for Single-Gene Disorders. Modern Tools for Genetic Engineering. 2016, 18: 3-20.
    Verma, I. M.; et al. Gene therapy: promises, problems, and prospects. InGenes and Resistance to Disease. 2000, 20: 147-157.

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    Quote Originally posted by Chris View Post
    https://mrna.creative-biolabs.com/mr...SAAEgJC2_D_BwE

    mRNA for Gene Therapy


    Creative Biolabs is a leading service provider that focuses on messenger ribonucleic acid (mRNA) therapeutics development. Currently, various platforms have been established for analyzing the function and mechanism of action of mRNA. By combining cutting edge technologies with proprietary innovations, scientists at Creative Biolabs provide a full range of services on mRNA-based gene therapy. With our extensive experience and advanced platform, we are always dedicated to assisting our clients with the most satisfactory data.

    Introduction of Gene Therapy

    Gene therapy has shown promising results in the treatment of human diseases, including tumors, autoimmune disorders, and infectious diseases. Normally, gene therapy is generated by transferring specific genetic information into target cells to alter their functions in disease therapy. In particular, gene therapy can be used for replacing or blocking mutated genes that cause diseases. Moreover, recent reports have demonstrated that gene therapy can also be used for inserting target genes against diseases. Meanwhile, many studies have indicated that vectors play a significant role in delivering genes. Different types of delivery vectors have been designed in the past few years of studies. Among them, several kinds of virus-based vectors, such as retroviral vectors, lentiviral vectors, adenoviral vectors, as well as adeno-associated viral vectors, are widely used in gene therapy development. Besides, many advanced technologies, such as genetic engineering, recombinant DNA technique, as well as mRNA technology, have been utilized in improving the performance of gene therapy in disease treatments.

    Services for mRNA-based Gene Therapy
    Since the great success of gene therapy in cancer treatment, many attempts have been made recently to improve their safety and efficacy both in preclinical trials and clinical trials. Also, recent researchers have illustrated that some viral vectors can cause many severe side effects in disease models. Nowadays, mRNA molecules have been considered as suitable alternative plasmids for gene therapy due to their rapid and high-level expression in cancers. Furthermore, many reporters have revealed that mRNA-based gene therapy can be achieved at different levels, such as cell level, exosome level, and molecular-level. Till now, several mRNA-based modalities have been designed and developed for treating glioblastoma multiforme (GBM) in preclinical studies and some of them are undergoing different phases of clinical trials.

    Therefore, Creative Biolabs has established a panel of platforms to design and validate potential mRNA molecules for the treatment of various human diseases, including cancers. Equipped with several advanced technologies, we can provide a seamless service chain, ranging from in silico mRNA structure prediction, mRNA constructs design, animal modeling, to safety and toxicity evaluation. Meanwhile, we are capable of offering a wide array of optimization assays to improve the efficacy of mRNA-based gene therapy.

    De novo synthesis of the functional proteins
    The delivery of the specific mRNA to the target cells
    In vitro and in vivo assessment

    With over years of experience in mRNA therapeutics development, Creative Biolabs offers a large collection of mRNA-based assays targeting different types of disease targets. Our client-focused, integrated team will anticipate challenges, overcome difficulties, and successfully convert various potential targets into clinical trials. If you are interested in our services, please feel free to contact us for more information.

    Reference

    Michel, T.; et al. Next-Generation Therapeutics: mRNA as a Novel Therapeutic Option for Single-Gene Disorders. Modern Tools for Genetic Engineering. 2016, 18: 3-20.
    Verma, I. M.; et al. Gene therapy: promises, problems, and prospects. InGenes and Resistance to Disease. 2000, 20: 147-157.
    mRNA can indeed be used in gene therapy, but mRNA-based vaccines are themselves not gene therapy.
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    Quote Originally posted by Aragorn View Post
    mRNA can indeed be used for gene therapy, but mRNA-based vaccines are themselves not gene therapy.
    They keep saying that, but in previous discussions about this I cited two respected and credentialed research scientists who claimed that mRNA vaccines were gene therapies.

    One of them is cited in the previous post, Dr Verma, I. M.

    Anyways, it is a side matter, whether mRNA vaccines are gene therapies or not is beside the point. The point is the lack of reporting on adverse effects, which are in fact well-documented despite all the concerted and sustained worldwide efforts to suppress this information. And by adverse effects I mean tens of thousands dead and even more injured for life.

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    Quote Originally posted by Chris View Post
    Anyways, it is a side matter, whether mRNA vaccines are gene therapies or not is beside the point. The point is the lack of reporting on adverse effects, which are in fact well-documented despite all the concerted and sustained worldwide efforts to suppress this information. And by adverse effects I mean tens of thousands dead and even more injured for life.
    Those numbers have been both hugely exaggerated and hugely misinterpreted. I have recently spoken about this elsewhere, and the numbers the so-called "alternative community" — read: the alt-right and the anti-vaxx militants — are touting are a complete misconstruction; sometimes deliberately, and sometimes just out of ignorance.

    Those numbers only represent the amount of people who have died and of whom it was known that they had been vaccinated, but without any correlation at all between their deaths and the fact that they were vaccinated. Long story short, you go and get your shot, you walk out of the vaccination center, and you get run over by a bus. You are now one of those people on that list.

    But wait, let's make it even more suspicious. You are someone with a history of severe heart attacks, but so far, every time, the good doctors have managed to keep you alive and get you through. You go and get the vaccine. Five days later, you are wheeled into the ER on a stretcher because you're having yet another heart attack. Only this time, you die. Sorry dude, time's up, and your life was already hanging by a thread anyway. But, you are now one of those statistics. You got vaxxed and you died of a heart attack.

    See how that goes?

    As for the gene therapy thing, it is only gene therapy if they use mRNA for changing the genetic makeup of your own cells. The cells with the virus' mRNA that they inject you with are not yours, and their only role is to expose your immune system to that mRNA. I don't care what that Dr. Verma says. Andrew Wakefield was a doctor too, and some doctors just happen to be frauds, while yet some other doctors happen to be incompetent. And some of them are both.

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    I saw a Martin Luther quote from the Bubonic plague. I looked up what he said and did during that time to see if it's got any merit. Here's the image I saw:



    Here's from an article in Religion News,

    And what the reformer had to say in his 1527 letter, later published as a treatise, is “strikingly relevant” today, said Hendel, who spoke at the Friday session.

    Luther wrote that letter in the midst of an outbreak of the bubonic plague in Wittenberg, according to the professor emeritus. He was responding to a Lutheran leader in Breslau, who asked whether a Christian ought to leave a city in the midst of a plague outbreak for someplace safer.

    In his treatise, Luther wrote:

    “Therefore I shall ask God mercifully to protect us. Then I shall fumigate, help purify the air, administer medicine, and take it. I shall avoid places and persons where my presence is not needed in order not to become contaminated and thus perchance infect and pollute others, and so cause their death as a result of my negligence. … See, this is such a God-fearing faith because it is neither brash nor foolhardy and does not tempt God.”
    Personally, I prefer the unreacted quote in the image. I'm not Lutheran. I do have a Lutheran minister in my family.

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    Quote Originally posted by Dreamtimer View Post
    I saw a Martin Luther quote from the Bubonic plague. I looked up what he said and did during that time to see if it's got any merit. Here's the image I saw:



    Here's from an article in Religion News,



    Personally, I prefer the unreacted quote in the image. I'm not Lutheran. I do have a Lutheran minister in my family.
    That quote sounds suspiciously Christian.
    “To seek self-knowledge is to embark on a journey which ... will always be incomplete" - courtesy of Godel's Incompleteness Theorem

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    As I have compromised immune system I could be messed up after being affected from covid, I still suffer from some symptoms.

    This part stood out too as I have CFS. It's still not understood what causes it, but some have suspected the Epstein-Barr virus.

    Long covid symptoms summary






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    Super Moderator United States Dreamtimer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally posted by Wind View Post
    As I have compromised immune system I could be messed up after being affected from covid, I still suffer from some symptoms.

    This part stood out too as I have CFS. It's still not understood what causes it, but some have suspected the Epstein-Barr virus.
    I was just reading up on long Covid. That sucks about the mitochondria. And in a weird synchronicity I was just listening to how being out in space creates long-term problems with mitochondria.

    We have a weakened populace around the world and we will be facing other pandemics. I'm personally thinking of the various microbes which will be released into the environment as permafrost melts.

    We're going to need all the assists we can give ourselves because immune systems don't repair damage and other viruses could be much worse.

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    I've been contemplating the folks who refer to getting vaccinated as living in fear. Or who diminish the concerns of Covid by pointing to stats like 99.6% survival rate. You wouldn't risk plane flights with those stats. Or many other things. And fear is not the motive for vaccination. It's more often the motive for not being vaccinated.

    If just getting diseases was the best way to go we would't have antibiotics, or vaccines, or anti-viral meds, or anti-parasitic meds. And we'd also have the bugs and STDs and deformities and disabilities associated with disease which used to be rampant.

    Exactly what is the long-term goal here? The propaganda is only leading to death and division. What's the payout?

    There isn't one, is there? It's just a disease of the mind which leads to further spread of a disease. The mind needs healing because more pandemics are on the way.

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    Super Moderator Wind's Avatar
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    Now what is this talk about monkeypox?

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