Page 1 of 8 1234 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 112

Thread: The Lines Have Been Drawn

  1. #1
    Senior Member Fred Steeves's Avatar
    Join Date
    1st May 2016
    Location
    East Tennessee U.S.A.
    Posts
    890
    Thanks
    1,316
    Thanked 5,510 Times in 894 Posts

    The Lines Have Been Drawn

    Tim Pool very succinctly points out something here that I've been observing for some time now. Something that continues to build momentum. The machine, as he puts it, keeps churning and nothing can stop it. The lines are being drawn, people are continuously being baited to choose one side or the other; once a side is chosen it's similar to war where the other side is dehumanized, and whatever they happen to think about things is irrelevant. At this point there is no talking any more, only yelling past each other, and trading insults as tensions continually escalate.

    When we choose a side we wind up diving down the echo chamber of that side. We listen to nothing but what our chosen side has to say, and that is the only solution to said problems is to defeat the other side. At all cost.

    It becomes an obsession which can't be denied, the lure of the machine is too much to resist. And what does the machine want? The machine thrives on division, on hate, on conflict, and ultimately on destruction. There is nothing that can be said to stop, or even slow the machine down, the only way out for any given individual is to simply not be a part of it. As Fleetwood Mac said: "You can go your own way".

    If enough people actually did that it WOULD at least slow the machine down, but that ain't happenin...
    The unexamined life is not worth living.

    Socrates

  2. The Following 11 Users Say Thank You to Fred Steeves For This Useful Post:

    Aianawa (21st March 2019), Aragorn (20th March 2019), Bane (27th March 2019), Cearna (26th March 2019), Chris (20th March 2019), Dreamtimer (22nd March 2019), Elen (20th March 2019), Kathy (20th March 2019), WantDisclosure (21st March 2019), Wind (20th March 2019), Zebowho (2nd April 2019)

  3. #2
    Moderator Wind's Avatar
    Join Date
    17th January 2015
    Location
    Just here
    Posts
    836
    Thanks
    6,093
    Thanked 4,878 Times in 838 Posts
    Was it something that was being planned all along?

  4. The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to Wind For This Useful Post:

    Aianawa (21st March 2019), Aragorn (21st March 2019), Dreamtimer (22nd March 2019), Elen (20th March 2019), Kathy (20th March 2019)

  5. #3
    Super Moderator Norway Elen's Avatar
    Join Date
    2nd July 2015
    Location
    Scotland
    Posts
    4,134
    Thanks
    53,665
    Thanked 19,005 Times in 4,136 Posts
    Quote Originally posted by Wind View Post
    Was it something that was being planned all along?
    Yes yes it must have been!
    Whatever is true. Whatever is noble. Whatever is right. Whatever is lovely. Whatever is admirable. Anything of excellence and worthy of praise. Dwell on these things. Jesus Christ (I agree)

  6. The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to Elen For This Useful Post:

    Aianawa (21st March 2019), Aragorn (21st March 2019), Dreamtimer (22nd March 2019), Kathy (20th March 2019), Wind (20th March 2019)

  7. #4
    Senior Member Black Panther's Avatar
    Join Date
    24th September 2013
    Posts
    151
    Thanks
    313
    Thanked 971 Times in 149 Posts
    Quote Originally posted by Fred Steeves View Post
    As Fleetwood Mac said: "You can go your own way".
    U2 can go YOUR own way, Fred


    Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ej2S-ANeuww

  8. The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to Black Panther For This Useful Post:

    Aianawa (21st March 2019), Aragorn (21st March 2019), Dreamtimer (22nd March 2019), Elen (21st March 2019), Kathy (22nd March 2019)

  9. #5
    Senior Member Aianawa's Avatar
    Join Date
    18th March 2015
    Posts
    5,417
    Thanks
    26,845
    Thanked 23,596 Times in 5,227 Posts
    It was once very easy for the weres, not now as know thyself or own mind has bitten massive chunks out of the weres narrative creating, finger pointing is coming back in from observation of late but also ignoring stupid, especially by the young ones, is being observed strongly lol basically their own world is much better.

  10. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Aianawa For This Useful Post:

    Aragorn (21st March 2019), Dreamtimer (22nd March 2019), Elen (21st March 2019), Kathy (22nd March 2019)

  11. #6
    Retired Member United States
    Join Date
    8th November 2015
    Posts
    1,264
    Thanks
    1,691
    Thanked 7,646 Times in 1,264 Posts
    Quote Originally posted by Aianawa View Post
    It was once very easy for the weres, not now as know thyself or own mind has bitten massive chunks out of the weres narrative creating, finger pointing is coming back in from observation of late but also ignoring stupid, especially by the young ones, is being observed strongly lol basically their own world is much better.
    IMO there is a different context for drawing lines.

    In the last few years, I have been studying all sorts of bits and pieces that IMO are a jigsaw puzzle of an alternative POV. People keep marveling... 'wow what IS this landscape all about?

    Starting with Robert Anton Wilson's Cosmic Trigger, it became apparent that actually all kinds of different landscapes are holding one thing in common... observers.

    In Cosmic Trigger he lays out the way that whenyou start paying attention to anything, youwill see more and more of it if you give it meaning. I think it was the number 23 that came up more and more in seemingly synchronistic ways and more and more evident all the time.

    Another story was about someone who observed conspiracy theories and became caught up in one.

    IMO we keep seeing choices presented in binary oppositions and every one agrees to just choice one or the other when all the time, if no one chooses any of it... THEN WHAT?

    IMO there are all kinds of POV on how we are manifesting the choices WE MAKE of attention and "respect". We make what we choose the important and we see more and more of what supports the choice. So, the line if any being drawn is between those who take responsibility (and those who cannot take responsibility ) for how important we are. What we choose to see becomes and becomes and becomes.

    WE don't passively take in landscapes. WE ACTIVELY LOOK imprinting our vision on what could be and making THEN looking real.

    Anybody with the interest to see how patterns are formed can then repattern. It is our own particular worlds that we live in. They are reality tunnels and we share them with everyone who is in a kind of relationship to our choice. If we get really Universal in our POV, we meet those people and experience that POV. We can choose any possible and make it more and more probable the more we intend it. However whatever we choose (attention informing what we choose and how we systematically replicate any thing at all as the technology ) will be what we live in. Our VISION gets cemented into fact by belief in it, What IF we learn how to unchoose, unbelieve and disagree? IMO If we change our mind, the landscape MUST alter.

    A couple of songs about possibility of feeling into an unknown possible


    Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MmZexg8sxyk


    Electric Feel
    MGMT
    All along the western front
    People line up to receive
    She got the current in her hand
    Just shock you like you won't believe
    Sun in the amazon
    With the voltage running through her skin
    Standing there with nothing on
    She gonna teach me how to swim
    I said ooh girl
    Shock me like an electric eel
    Baby girl
    Turn me on with your electric feel
    I said ooh girl
    Shock me like an electric eel
    Baby girl
    Turn me on with your electric feel
    All along the eastern shore
    Put your circuits in the sea
    This is what the world is for
    Making electricity
    You can feel it in your mind
    Oh you can do it all the time
    Plug it in, change the world
    You are my electric girl
    I said ooh girl
    Shock me like an electric eel
    Baby girl
    Turn me on with your electric feel
    I said ooh girl
    Shock me like an electric eel
    Baby girl
    Turn me on with your electric feel
    Do what you feel now
    Electric feel now
    Do what you feel now
    Electric feel now
    Do what you feel now
    Electric feel now
    Do what you feel now
    Electric feel now
    Do what you feel now
    Electric feel now

    Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1LsabQV0Yjk


    "Budding Trees"

    In the moon of the budding trees
    I was gifted new eyes to see
    All of the shifting shape and ways you can be
    Wake the dreams into realities
    Wake the dreams into realities

    Sunset diamonds trickle down our cheeks
    The language of no words is how we speak
    Pacha Mama spinning firelight
    And a Little Bear singing by the fireside
    Out of this city with the wind on our neck
    That's us whistling upon your neck
    Moonlit diamonds sparkle into my mouth
    Feels like hunger and it tastes like salt
    Feels like hunger and it tastes like salt

    So, tap me out and tap me into you
    Heal my brain and my body too
    Balance my chemistry hydrate these cells
    Cuz the body talks and the meditation helps
    The body talks and meditation helps
    The body talks and meditation helps

    A little bit of cinnamon pours as we snoot
    All up on my shit in the morning commute
    Coastal quiver on a quest through the dunes
    Sandy toes and bottomless curves of the moon
    Heavy lifting for Pele's children
    Hand of the goddess soaking cliffs keep building
    Plate is full but appetite has dwindled
    I feel a little sick so I keep the fire kindled

    You the pillar steadfast light of bravery
    And I the dimly burning candle still shaking
    Riddled fear quiver my bones so easy!
    Well, you're the guru now so visualize healing
    Yeah, you're the guru now so visualize leaving

    Let her go for she can no longer feed you
    And many children need that mana creature
    Just barely missed you I was finally ready!
    But you are a long gone too much heavy history
    Yeah you are a long gone too much heavy history
    Let go of blame that shit will never serve me!
    Bless other men investigate your mystery

    So, tap me out and tap me into you
    Heal my brain and my body too
    Balance my chemistry hydrate these cells
    Cuz the body talks and the meditation helps
    The body talks and meditation helps
    The body talks and meditation helps

    Little spider weaves a wispy web
    And stumbling through the woods it catches to my head
    She crawls behind my ear and whispers secrets
    Dragonfly wiz by and sings now teach it
    Yeah, dragonfly wiz by and sings now teach it
    Form on the trail I watch you head up mauka
    I turn makai and whisper, "thank you sister"
    Edge of the west where water touches land
    You are the east with folded maps in hand
    Time to increase my frequency!
    Hands of light and bodies talking
    Gimme some of that wild fox medicine!
    But, keep me here in this wild present tense
    Fully supported on new lovers chest
    Dawning adventures sparkle get some rest!
    Dawning adventures sparkle get some rest!

    So, tap me out and tap me into you
    Heal my brain and my body too
    Balance my chemistry hydrate these cells
    Cuz the body talks and the meditation helps
    The body talks and meditation helps
    The body talks and meditation helps
    Last edited by Maggie, 21st March 2019 at 03:15.

  12. The Following 7 Users Say Thank You to Maggie For This Useful Post:

    Aragorn (21st March 2019), Dreamtimer (22nd March 2019), Elen (21st March 2019), Kathy (22nd March 2019), NotAPretender (21st March 2019), palooka's revenge (22nd March 2019), starry night (21st March 2019)

  13. #7
    Super Moderator United States Dreamtimer's Avatar
    Join Date
    7th April 2015
    Location
    Patapsco Valley
    Posts
    8,386
    Thanks
    47,549
    Thanked 37,531 Times in 8,303 Posts
    Conservatives in America have been talking about Civil War for quite some time now. Having been raised by conservatives and spent much time around them I have been able to see this for myself.

    Conservatives were lacking a national leader to back them. Now they have one.

    Conservatives brag on a regular basis about how they have guns and "the other side" doesn't. They know who they're gonna go shoot. And if someone is a heretic or unpatriotic they don't really have to think about the humanity of the person, do they?

    They have a leader who tells them that the other team "hates America" and "is not Patriotic". He speaks in a code they understand perfectly.

    Just like Sarah Palin did. Even bsbray went on about how he understood exactly what she meant with her word salads.

    And that would be because he heard what he wanted to hear.

    People are still chanting about Hillary who isn't in any kind of power anymore and won't be in the future. She's not running. But it doesn't matter.

    Because reality doesn't matter. The fantasy of Civil War and Revolution are much more fun than the hard work of reaching out to a neighbor and across the aisle.

    Our Dear Leader is taking advantage of every right wing fantasy and stoking the fires. And just like the jewish guy behind the demonization of Soros, he won't take responsibility.

    Why should he when folks won't make him do it?


    I'm curious Fred, you have seen side-taking with myself and others where it didn't exist. Are you perhaps more cynical than necessary?

  14. The Following 6 Users Say Thank You to Dreamtimer For This Useful Post:

    Aragorn (21st March 2019), Elen (21st March 2019), Kathy (22nd March 2019), NotAPretender (21st March 2019), palooka's revenge (22nd March 2019), Wind (23rd March 2019)

  15. #8
    Senior Member Fred Steeves's Avatar
    Join Date
    1st May 2016
    Location
    East Tennessee U.S.A.
    Posts
    890
    Thanks
    1,316
    Thanked 5,510 Times in 894 Posts
    Quote Originally posted by Wind View Post
    Was it something that was being planned all along?
    I don't know about all along, more like when an author is out to write a book and has the general story line in mind, but the details and characters need to be fleshed out along the way. Like I don't for one minute think that Captain Chaos was planned all along, but in this currrnt climate the story line was ready for this latest necessary ingredient to draw out more of the lizard brain of people. On both sides of the aisle, TDS runs rampant. We just can't help ourselves...

    Divide and conquer is of course the ancient ongoing story line, which is still unnervingly successful, and is why I look for the rare voices out there who may well be a member of any particular tribe, but are unafraid and open minded enough to question and even challenge some doings of their own "side" - Much less actually stand up to and point out wrongs done to the other side. That's heresy for any tribe.

    Tim Pool in the video I posted is one such rare person who has recently caught my attention. He seems to have a good handle on what is going on to keep furthering our areas of great divides (which go way beyond the political realms), and has come to the same conclusion that nothing can be done to stop it. I see virtually no one on the Right who is willing to humanize, and therefore grant legitimaticy to those on the Left, but Tim and a *scant* few others from the Left are willing to do so. Which is why I chose to highlight that particular video, it takes a lot of guts to go against the general narrative of which one's peer group strictly adheres to.
    The unexamined life is not worth living.

    Socrates

  16. The Following 7 Users Say Thank You to Fred Steeves For This Useful Post:

    Aragorn (21st March 2019), Dreamtimer (22nd March 2019), Elen (21st March 2019), palooka's revenge (22nd March 2019), sean.s (24th March 2019), starry night (21st March 2019), Wind (23rd March 2019)

  17. #9
    Senior Member United States starry night's Avatar
    Join Date
    21st August 2018
    Posts
    53
    Thanks
    109
    Thanked 312 Times in 53 Posts

    yes to many things that many are saying here. The way I understand/apprehend it is that these "sides" have been in place for a long, long, long time. or another way to put it, is that the gaps have been here for a long time. perhaps, forever, since the beginning.

    and I don't experience it as just two sides, just one gap. I define a gap as ANY place ANY part of ourselves is outside of our conscious acceptance.

    and in my own healing, where I have not really gone all the way down into my own pain, my own victimhood, found compassion for myself, felt all the feelings, MOVED all the feelings... that is where I am the most likely to project the lack of acceptance for the victimhood of OTHERS.

    Before I understood that I had been severely abused, when I still had blocked that from my memory, I was really reactive around others who were working through their abuse. Not accepting, not loving. I accused them of playing "the victim card."

    Later, as I began to work through my stuff, I recognized that I was envious of them, of their freedom to own/accept this truth about themselves. I made amends.

    I also experience this from the other side. The first time this happened to me, a person got really mad when I shared my desire to raise consciousness about the issues that people with DID have, and he stalked off, muttering about me retreating into my child self--like I had control over it. I was shocked and hurt, but recognized pretty quickly that he had his own unresolved trauma issues.

    And so, as I am looking with alarm at these memes when people seem to be saying "we've got more ammo than you, so we will win" I'm basically understanding it as "I don't want to feel my pain, so I will kill it (the gap) (you) instead."

    Which is kinda how it has always gone down. Which is why I think the revolution, what is really gonna heal this, is not ideological, not spiritual, not economic, but emotional.
    Last edited by starry night, 21st March 2019 at 22:12.
    Healing Happens

  18. The Following 6 Users Say Thank You to starry night For This Useful Post:

    Aragorn (21st March 2019), Dreamtimer (22nd March 2019), Elen (22nd March 2019), Kathy (22nd March 2019), Maggie (23rd March 2019), palooka's revenge (22nd March 2019)

  19. #10
    Super Moderator United States Dreamtimer's Avatar
    Join Date
    7th April 2015
    Location
    Patapsco Valley
    Posts
    8,386
    Thanks
    47,549
    Thanked 37,531 Times in 8,303 Posts
    Quote Originally posted by Fred Steeves View Post
    Tim Pool very succinctly points out something here that I've been observing for some time now. Something that continues to build momentum. The machine, as he puts it, keeps churning and nothing can stop it. The lines are being drawn, people are continuously being baited to choose one side or the other; once a side is chosen it's similar to war where the other side is dehumanized, and whatever they happen to think about things is irrelevant. At this point there is no talking any more, only yelling past each other, and trading insults as tensions continually escalate.

    When we choose a side we wind up diving down the echo chamber of that side. We listen to nothing but what our chosen side has to say, and that is the only solution to said problems is to defeat the other side. At all cost.

    It becomes an obsession which can't be denied, the lure of the machine is too much to resist. And what does the machine want? The machine thrives on division, on hate, on conflict, and ultimately on destruction. There is nothing that can be said to stop, or even slow the machine down, the only way out for any given individual is to simply not be a part of it. As Fleetwood Mac said: "You can go your own way".

    If enough people actually did that it WOULD at least slow the machine down, but that ain't happenin...
    This was a great video. I thought I recognized Tim. I went to his site and then I recalled that he'd recently been on the Joe Rogan podcast.

    Joe is a person who goes his own way, imo.


    starry night, I believe you're absolutely right. It is emotional. And it will be a revolution. And it's badly needed.


    China is busy buying up Africa and Trump is enabling Putin's expansion. What in the world are people thinking? Do they really think they can sow that level of chaos here and come out strong?

    My brother believed Iraq would be easy. "I think it could be over in a few weeks," he said.

    And he's still talking about most people like they're stupid and worthless.

    I don't buy into that.

  20. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Dreamtimer For This Useful Post:

    Aragorn (22nd March 2019), Elen (22nd March 2019), Kathy (23rd March 2019), starry night (24th March 2019)

  21. #11
    Senior Member Fred Steeves's Avatar
    Join Date
    1st May 2016
    Location
    East Tennessee U.S.A.
    Posts
    890
    Thanks
    1,316
    Thanked 5,510 Times in 894 Posts
    Here's but one example of repeated attempts to rip apart Venezuela for the purposes of regime change. No coincidences:

    The US-funded CANVAS organization that trained Juan Guaido and his allies produced a 2010 memo on exploiting electricity outages and urged the opposition “to take advantage of the situation…towards their needs”

    A September 2010 memo by a U.S.-funded soft power organization that helped train Venezuelan coup leader Juan Guaido and his allies identifies the potential collapse of the country’s electrical sector as "a watershed event" that "would likely have the impact of galvanizing public unrest in a way that no opposition group could ever hope to generate."

    The memo has special relevance today as Guaido moves to exploit nationwide blackouts caused by a major failure at the Simon Bolivar Hydroelectric Plant at Guri dam– a crisis that Venezuela’s government blames on U.S. sabotage.
    It was authored by Srdja Popovic of the Center for Applied Non-Violent Action and Strategies (CANVAS), a Belgrade-based "democracy promotion" organization funded by the US government that has trained thousands of U.S.-aligned youth activists in countries where the West seeks regime change.

    This group reportedly hosted Guaido and the key leaders of his Popular Will party for a series of training sessions, fashioning them into a "Generation 2007" determined to foment resistance to then-President Hugo Chavez and sabotage his plans to implement "21st century socialism" in Venezuela.
    https://www.telesurenglish.net/opini...0315-0017.html



    Here's a typical example of a company (New Knowledge), comprised of ex Intel types here in the States, that worked on drawing the lines of division. A self described false flag operation, comprised of doing the exact thing they are supposed to be guarding against in a fiercely fought senate campaign in Alabama.

    It matters not that the targeted republican candidate was a dirt bag, what matters is that this was done, and it demonstrated one way of HOW it's done:
    The project’s operators created a Facebook page on which they posed as conservative Alabamians, using it to try to divide Republicans and even to endorse a write-in candidate to draw votes from Mr. Moore. It involved a scheme to link the Moore campaign to thousands of Russian accounts that suddenly began following the Republican candidate on Twitter, a development that drew national media attention.

    “We orchestrated an elaborate ‘false flag’ operation that planted the idea that the Moore campaign was amplified on social media by a Russian botnet,” the report says.

    Mr. Morgan said in an interview that the Russian botnet ruse “does not ring a bell,” adding that others had worked on the effort and had written the report. He said he saw the project as “a small experiment” designed to explore how certain online tactics worked, not to affect the election.

    Mr. Morgan said he could not account for the claims in the report that the project sought to “enrage and energize Democrats” and “depress turnout” among Republicans, partly by emphasizing accusations that Mr. Moore had pursued teenage girls when he was a prosecutor in his 30s.
    https://www.nytimes.com/2018/12/19/u...es-russia.html
    The unexamined life is not worth living.

    Socrates

  22. The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to Fred Steeves For This Useful Post:

    Aragorn (23rd March 2019), Dreamtimer (23rd March 2019), Elen (23rd March 2019), palooka's revenge (23rd March 2019), starry night (24th March 2019)

  23. #12
    Super Moderator United States Dreamtimer's Avatar
    Join Date
    7th April 2015
    Location
    Patapsco Valley
    Posts
    8,386
    Thanks
    47,549
    Thanked 37,531 Times in 8,303 Posts
    Will the extant chaos screw up these guys' work?

    Not just Captain Chaos, but the force itself. It seems like even these folks have to suffer from the law of unintended consequences which would be on overdrive in times of chaos.

  24. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Dreamtimer For This Useful Post:

    Aragorn (23rd March 2019), Elen (23rd March 2019), Wind (23rd March 2019)

  25. #13
    Retired Member United States
    Join Date
    8th November 2015
    Posts
    1,264
    Thanks
    1,691
    Thanked 7,646 Times in 1,264 Posts
    I think that people are the issue always, the way we believe things are and what should be. The way that IMO we can embrace something unknown is by moving to a whole different context. The emotion of fear and all its corollaries is very addictive. I think that my body is bound to die and in the mean time, I am allowed to see and sustain new possibilities BEYOND THE FAMILIAR PAST and and IMO if I succeed, the world will change.

    That is BE CAUSE the world is an Affect of CONSCIOUSNESS.


    Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j0V8scgzchw
    Last edited by Maggie, 23rd March 2019 at 16:47.

  26. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Maggie For This Useful Post:

    Aragorn (23rd March 2019), Dreamtimer (23rd March 2019), Elen (23rd March 2019), NotAPretender (23rd March 2019)

  27. #14
    Moderator Wind's Avatar
    Join Date
    17th January 2015
    Location
    Just here
    Posts
    836
    Thanks
    6,093
    Thanked 4,878 Times in 838 Posts
    Quote Originally posted by Dreamtimer View Post
    Will the extant chaos screw up these guys' work?

    Not just Captain Chaos, but the force itself. It seems like even these folks have to suffer from the law of unintended consequences which would be on overdrive in times of chaos.
    Chaos is chaos and it manifests in many diverse forms. The antidote is of course order... We just have to remember that too much of anything, including order will not be a good thing. These chaotic times serve a purpose for sure, from the ashes will always rise something new, hopefully something much better too.

  28. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Wind For This Useful Post:

    Aragorn (23rd March 2019), Dreamtimer (23rd March 2019), Elen (23rd March 2019), NotAPretender (23rd March 2019)

  29. #15
    Retired Member United States
    Join Date
    8th November 2015
    Posts
    1,264
    Thanks
    1,691
    Thanked 7,646 Times in 1,264 Posts
    Quote Originally posted by Wind View Post
    Chaos is chaos and it manifests in many diverse forms. The antidote is of course order... We just have to remember that too much of anything, including order will not be a good thing. These chaotic times serve a purpose for sure, from the ashes will always rise something new, hopefully something much better too.
    I think you have a point but I emphasize two aspects

    chaos is random energy that becomes harnessed BUT BY WHAT CONSTRUCT?

    The purpose from the ashes is not by accident AND BY WHOM IS THAT DETERMINED?

    In this "age of information", new opportunities are evidenced by our own PERSON... the construction determined by persons who know something.

    This is illusion? Then who determines what it looks like?
    I do not accept that I am determined by a collective but by my own harmonic resonance to a different and rather unknown possible.

    I think we are all so powerful that we can play out any eventuality. It could be a revolution (going round and round the mulberry bush)
    As the world turns, the drama of the familiar passionate beliefs.

    We are so powerful.

  30. The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to Maggie For This Useful Post:

    Aragorn (23rd March 2019), Dreamtimer (23rd March 2019), Elen (23rd March 2019), NotAPretender (23rd March 2019), Wind (23rd March 2019)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •