BR's disclosure on CG

[Aragorn]

[...]

Donk, Lord Sidious, and sometimes Fred and Aragorn.....often your words depict a grudge that has not been processed thoroughly IMO and thus the sniping and snarky remarks at TargeT and others who can display a balance in the dynamics of the forum, it's owner and now the additional Corey crap.

I don't hold any grudges against Bill Ryan, but I'm not going to hide the fact that I don't particularly like the man either. And when I call him an obsessive-compulsive narcissist and a Machiavellian sociopath, then that's not gratuitous name-calling, nor any unprocessed grudge, but rather an accurate description of the man's psychological makeup, based upon my experience with, research about and education in the field.

In addition to the above, when I told Sam that he was being an apologist, that too was not any name-calling, nor any grudge. Sam is a friend of mine, and I was merely confronting him with the very truth he keeps running away from. And it was not the first time I have had to do this either, although the previous time I did actually manage to get through to him and wake him up, albeit that it took me quite some time and a lot of effort to get him there.

Now, I can't speak for Fred, but I don't think Fred holds any personal grudges against El Sombrero™ either. I see Fred's contributions in the research regarding Bill Ryan as very interesting, serene and factual.

Oh, and I most definitely don't have anything against TargeT either. On the contrary, I like and respect him for what he does. And maybe you've missed it, Sandy, but I'm the guy who has already repeatedly asked the participants of this thread to refrain from going ad hominem with one another.

Fred and Aragorn>>>if bill is cia and or an asset of some secret society, then so be it.......keep researching but detach from the personage of your target you are reaching for as your personal bias colors your efforts.

There's no personal bias here, Sandy. I report verifiable facts only. And I think that this is no different whereas Fred is concerned.

[Dumpster Diver]

Great thread...I continue to learn a lot from you guys.

I'm sorry that it comes from received wounds to you, but as a non-participant in the past "Avalon Wars" information presented in this threat has helped me a lot.

As far as the wider CG/BR conflict is concerned, I think it will come to define the entire alt-world "arena." I also feel there are more shoes "left to drop."

[sandy]

Hey Donk, don't get me wrong, I was furious initially and reacted. At first I had a hard time in wiping the egg off my face for being duped by bills public image.

I worked in the correction system, mainly with high security inmates for many years; as a behavior counsellor, so liked to think that I can spot a scammer very easily......NAH!! got duped and felt had for sure...didn't like it one bit. I too thought for awhile that forum members needed to be made aware that thing were not what they seemed by challenging bill from time to time to no avail.

I then decided what were my priorities..........'saving face' and leaving the forum or gathering info and staying in the game of learning all I could about the hidden in this world......that is when I stepped back because learning is of high value to me even at the expense of feeling duped. It wasn't the first time and won't be the last but in my senior years I have finally learned to stop cutting my nose off to save my face.......hahahha

Love you honesty and genuine care and concern for others Donk.....your authenticity is pretty special so please don't change that while on your journey this time around.

Thanks, I'll have to think about that..."enabler to save those that can't see this?" I like to think I'm not out here trying to "save" anybody anymore but I do get irratated at enabling so gotta watch for it in myself

The way I see it, is once you go through what you yourself described, ya gotta sh!t or get off the pot...again, like you described you did, with results way more positive than I ever got when I did the same thing back in the day. So my resentment may have greater...particularly when I learned that Christine was Bill's wife, I found it so insulting to our intelligences and such a cognitive dissonance to hide a marriage like that on a truth site.

Like hiding Corey's name, it made me feel embarrassed to be a part of it. So I tried really hard to walk my walk and be the change I wanted to see, and when all those phonies...them damn enablers...basically said "nope, you're the problem", I threw all my resentment on the pages there until they had to kick me off

So I wouldn't call what I'm doing these days "holding a grudge", maybe it is but I feel personally feel pretty over it...I do like being a counter balance to what I see is bullsh!t. And sure, it's not as "big" as corey has gotten...but it's my peeps. I think a majority of those that are drawn to PA (or Bill) are bright and well intended, and some..like me when I first came around...trusting and hungry for info that "resonated"

I probably couldn't hear anything like what I'm doing when I was in my honeymoon all gaga over that place and Bill's character's brilliance and charm, but I was glad to have the folks out there that shared their experience that was out on nexus and the like when i started questioning. I like to think my sharing helps those that start seeing the red flags, but I have no delusions I'm saving the world or anything. I like to do it, it's therapeutic and educational for me, hopefully someone else gets something out of it (like I get from your post sandy)

If strong feelings come in it is in the disappointment and irrational of the sam's and target's and mike's and runningdeer's that experience a lot of the same stuff I did and still come out of it as apologists. I mean you yourself at least tried and failing that felt stepping back was right way to go....lots of folks are like that I'm sure.

Some of the more visible though just straight deny or excuse and have to project it outward. I am the same way, I project my reality of the situation, which happens to be counter to the narrative bill and followers are creating for others...hopefully in a counterbalance. We shall see, appreciate your feedback, hopefully it will help temper my communication to seem less immature than you are seeing it

[sandy]

Dear Aragorn and long time Buddy Fred,

Your research is valued by me and I read everything you both post regarding the dynamics of the alternative media and community. It does not just lie with bill tho' imo, and thus there are many with sociopathic traits and agenda's out there to say the least. Can't label any of them as such but the characteristics are very visible in a number of so called leaders in this arena. We have to be vigilant versus condeming first and foremost or we can lose the discernment and often the agenda due to emotions.

Aragorn, this is the gist of my message to you and your personal assessments and writings of those you undertake to set on the path you are paving. What is a shame is that the raw experiences you have gone through with bill target his efforts and avalon each time, rather than widening the scope to include other such culprits to make your points about the behind scenes happening in this industry. When I mentioned that bias can get in the way it can happen unknowingly by mentioning where or how you gained the insight. When this targeting happens then the message after the fact, you are trying to convey gets lost in the focus of and drama of..... he said and she said dynamics versus the factual info that was presented.

Fred, I have also seen that you have really got past your personal experiences re avalon. Your latter posts regarding the ill begotten s**t going on with many in this field has been 'untainted' with labelling and procrastinations about bill. I have noticed and feel remiss in not letting you know what good work you are presenting these days. My apologies for being uncouth and selfish in lapping up your posts with no validation for such!! Please do not keep things to yourself*** that you see going on as you collect the dots in your research. Your work is of the utmost quality and integrity and thus so important to those of us who want to know all the evil doings behind the scenes that you have discovered. We need you!!

Thanks for all the feedback everyone, hope I have responded in ways that continue to bring us together as a community here at TOT.

My apologies for derailing>>>>>>>>now>>>

[modwiz]

The impact on the alt-community from behind the scenes manipulation of it is where focus would be better placed IMO. CG is little more than a front for a world-wide "unification" effort. That is, capturing the minds of as many as possible. I do not believe many of the people we see making videos are aware of it.....yet. The counseling program for traumatized people reeks of religious training. I see Mr Spaceman coming with a message "for all" to bring unity, one world gooberment and religion, to make the world a 'better place'. Free energy? We can have that after we are 'unified' and 'ascended' enough to responsibly handle unlimited energy that could be used for good or ill. There will be disappointment to be sure and the counseling will help people 'understand' why they have to wait for free energy while they are counseled into understanding the 'unifying' message. Anyone who rejects this message will be a heretic and worthy of being called a hater.

I "see" the pope and other religious leaders accepting this new Revelation and bestowing their blessings upon it. The pope has a hand in this behind the scenes but knows his hand must go unseen, lest suspicions arise. Better to let the ET crowd, the disclosure crowd, do the roll-out on this one.

With regards to BR and CG. Which of these two represents the greater thread to the alt-community and the world at large? Drop the personalities and the past. Drop concept of motives. Let's instead look at the effects, the disturbances, into the community and world. Who is actually dangerous?

[enjoy being]

The last few pages of this thread are another example of the thing I describe in relation to what happened during the charles fiasco, it is not peculiar to alt forums by any means, it is an example of how things can start to deteriorate into clash.

I just deleted from a local forum I had been a member of for 12 years because of the same sort of dynamic which is exponentially out of control. It had become an uncontrollable cess pit of uncheck personal crusading on a childish level where none where even aware of their infantile actions, in fact many had formed alliances based purely on not seeing their group hysteria and instead endorsing it as they set about targetting individuals who stand out or dare to point out the dynamic they all are stuck in.
It had been well overdue for me to leave, there was no inspiration for me, it was about the input I might make and be silently heard by a few who I'd never know of. The final straw was a matter of principal I guess, where the administration team, after a few weeks or more from mentioning a new tool they were considering, finally implemented it. People could already block others from entering their threads, but now a block has the option to make those people completely invisible, an ignore or mute function. The sad thing or especially sad thing is the main perpetrators of the chaos have not been fixed, they are in fact dancing on the tables and just using the whole thing as some kind of signal that they are in the right. The main trigger for this happening being by way of one other targetted individual who is an attention seeker, and indeed can be slightly irritating in it always being about them. But such are the others that they cant help themselves from fanning fires or starting new ones. They love it and if there is noone to pick on they time an time again will either set on each other or search for any oddities in others as new whipping posts.
I had enough and found the action of stealing away peoples lessons in gaining the ability of self control a final straw.
Funny to notice that their recent ramping up of the toxicity of personal attacks and hysteria, coincided with the slightly raised temperature witnessed in here, almost like some natural rythm. One which I have noticed to happen in the past.
It also ties into the idea of wanting to have the last word, and illcommunication creating something out of nothing. People placing different definitions to others intentions, chosing what they think is meant, either accidently or seemingly on purpose to "get off" on the drama, then pointing at others as being drama lamas.
It is a dynamic with a very definite signature. It often has a sense of possession of people, or like a fart in a room full of school kids, the desire to react is infectuous, an emotional ouroboros. Showing how the concept of divide and conquer is still an installed and constantly updated virus that even in an environment where people are supposed to be more aware, is present.

[Dumpster Diver]

The impact on the alt-community from behind the scenes manipulation of it is where focus would be better placed IMO. CG is little more than a front for a world-wide "unification" effort. That is, capturing the minds of as many as possible. I do not believe many of the people we see making videos are aware of it.....yet. The counseling program for traumatized people reeks of religious training. I see Mr Spaceman coming with a message "for all" to bring unity, one world gooberment and religion, to make the world a 'better place'. Free energy? We can have that after we are 'unified' and 'ascended' enough to responsibly handle unlimited energy that could be used for good or ill. There will be disappointment to be sure and the counseling will help people 'understand' why they have to wait for free energy while they are counseled into understanding the 'unifying' message. Anyone who rejects this message will be a heretic and worthy of being called a hater.

I "see" the pope and other religious leaders accepting this new Revelation and bestowing their blessings upon it. The pope has a hand in this behind the scenes but knows his hand must go unseen, lest suspicions arise. Better to let the ET crowd, the disclosure crowd, do the roll-out on this one.

With regards to BR and CG. Which of these two represents the greater thread to the alt-community and the world at large? Drop the personalities and the past. Drop concept of motives. Let's instead look at the effects, the disturbances, into the community and world. Who is actually dangerous?

Firstly, as you know, DW has my top scores in terms of verifiable "correctness" (Dolan calls this falsifiability, i.e. something that can be proven correct or incorrect). Again, this is due to the Wisdom Teachings on Gaia TV and his books. However, my best sources are negative as the negativity shows through because the negative message must be conveyed, probably on orders by folks in control. This part is then inverted by me, and the rest of the "sandwich wrappers" is the truth that needs to wrap the false statements in order to sell it.

So far, I've not been able to ID the negative part, if it exists, in DW's message. And frankly, he and now CG are tending to show more positive "movement."

...and now with the all fronts assault on CG/DW, I'm now tending to think they are really being considered by the Deep State to be harmful to the Deep State message(s).

I know I'm one of the few guys here at TOT who view DW as positive. But there you have it.

So, to answer your question: right now I see BR as being very dangerous. DW is tending to be on a "truer" path. And CG, while positive, needs more verifiable data to show his value. As he agrees with DW, DW lends his verifiability to CG. BR, BTW is running at about a 50% verifiability; an almost "perfect" non-information source. I'm tending to think this is not by chance.

[Paloma]

Firstly, as you know, DW has my top scores in terms of verifiable "correctness" (Dolan calls this falsifiability, i.e. something that can be proven correct or incorrect). Again, this is due to the Wisdom Teachings on Gaia TV and his books. However, my best sources are negative as the negativity shows through because the negative message must be conveyed, probably on orders by folks in control. This part is then inverted by me, and the rest of the "sandwich wrappers" is the truth that needs to wrap the false statements in order to sell it.

So far, I've not been able to ID the negative part, if it exists, in DW's message. And frankly, he and now CG are tending to show more positive "movement."

...and now with the all fronts assault on CG/DW, I'm now tending to think they are really being considered by the Deep State to be harmful to the Deep State message(s).

I know I'm one of the few guys here at TOT who view DW as positive. But there you have it.

So, to answer your question: right now I see BR as being very dangerous. DW is tending to be on a "truer" path. And CG, while positive, needs more verifiable data to show his value. As he agrees with DW, DW lends his verifiability to CG. BR, BTW is running at about a 50% verifiability; an almost "perfect" non-information source. I'm tending to think this is not by chance.

The great myth makers who create reality (at least until now) work both ends of the battery, the positive and the negative.
It doesn't mean that one side or the other wins, or is better, but that the outcome is the result of the dynamic between the two. DW will be forgotten, BR will be forgotten, the hidden players will never be known, and the emerging reality will surprise everyone for a brief moment, before everyone settles into the new system.
Then a new set of lessons, designed to meet the learning capacity of that generation.

[Outlander]

So, to answer your question: right now I see BR as being very dangerous. DW is tending to be on a "truer" path. And CG, while positive, needs more verifiable data to show his value. As he agrees with DW, DW lends his verifiability to CG. BR, BTW is running at about a 50% verifiability; an almost "perfect" non-information source. I'm tending to think this is not by chance.

DW, CG and BR I could give a place but who the hell is BTW?

[enjoy being]

BTW is internet acronym for - by the way. :-)

[Chuck]

Playing catch up...

Good to see old friends here.

Yes Fred, reminds me of the early days of Nexus when many dared to peel away the curtain. I loved the Easter Bunny and Mrs Doubtfire... suspending disbelief is fun ... when I know I'm doing it. Seeing it happen to me unknowingly more times than I care to admit gets annoying, lol. Thanks for the background on Jack, Kerry and David, Lord Sid.

Aragorn, I think it may have been Clif High who coined the phrase "Blue Chickens".

Thanks donk for many inside stories including Christine's reaction to Bill's latest. Yet I can't help myself to chuckle reading that she doesn't want to harm him yet writes, "He has murderous thoughts and desires and when in that state of being he is dangerous, this he consciously knows to be true because he asked me on many occasions to deal with the people he despised because he couldn't trust his reactions." hahahaha revealing pillow talk is not hurtful at all! ...feathers of the same blue chicken.

Nothing, can I borrow this? "It's been lonely in the saddle since the horse died". hilarious

Luv ya Gramma sandy

[DNA]

Great thread...I continue to learn a lot from you guys.

I'm sorry that it comes from received wounds to you, but as a non-participant in the past "Avalon Wars" information presented in this threat has helped me a lot.

As far as the wider CG/BR conflict is concerned, I think it will come to define the entire alt-world "arena." I also feel there are more shoes "left to drop."

I find myself at times, perplexed at how much activity on this forum is generated due to the perceived politics on other forums.
Just for the record, I personally do not have a problem with Bill Ryan.
I think he has done far more good in the world than bad, and generally speaking, when weighing pros and cons the world is a far better place with him than with out him.
This forum is an acorn that fell off of his tree and would not exist without him.
Drink that in for a moment before engaging in further vitriol.
Nothing against you double d, this is more a general comment in terms of this thread.

I will repeat a standard verse I've come to know myself to repeat.
We are all human.
We are all frail egos.
We are all capable of wrongs and it is of the utmost importance that we forgive one another petty transgressions and attempt to move on from them.

[Dumpster Diver]

I find myself at times, perplexed at how much activity on this forum is generated due to the perceived politics on other forums.
Just for the record, I personally do not have a problem with Bill Ryan.
I think he has done far more good in the world than bad, and generally speaking, when weighing pros and cons the world is a far better place with him than with out him.
This forum is an acorn that fell off of his tree and would not exist without him.
Drink that in for a moment before engaging in further vitriol.
Nothing against you double d, this is more a general comment in terms of this thread.

I will repeat a standard verse I've come to know myself to repeat.
We are all human.
We are all frail egos.
We are all capable of wrongs and it is of the utmost importance that we forgive one another petty transgressions and attempt to move on from them.

I've no problem at all. I keep trying to get folks to understand that EVERYONE in this arena is an information source. DO NOT quit listening to anybody just because you a) dislike them b) caught them in an untruth c) don't like the way they talk about their junk or whatever. Nobody is 100% right all the time. No matter what the Christians say, Christ made a few boo-boos as well.

And further, I've found the negative guys are actually better info sources than the positive guys because they KNOW what the negative issue is they are pushing. Think about that. They have been told what to push. Then you invert that and you can really move along.

[DNA]

I've no problem at all. I keep trying to get folks to understand that EVERYONE in this arena is an information source. DO NOT quit listening to anybody just because you a) dislike them b) caught them in an untruth c) don't like the way they talk about their junk or whatever. Nobody is 100% right all the time. No matter what the Christians say, Christ made a few boo-boos as well.

And further, I've found the negative guys are actually better info sources than the positive guys because they KNOW what the negative issue is they are pushing. Think about that. They have been told what to push. Then you invert that and you can really move along.

I use the mainstream media as a negative in so far as what you are saying, but I'm all ears if you would wish to add other sources to the opposite barometer group.

[Fred Steeves]

Playing catch up...

Good to see old friends here.

Yes Fred, reminds me of the early days of Nexus when many dared to peel away the curtain.

Well son of a gun Chuck, I've been wondering if that was you. Nice to see you around again, those were the days my friend!

Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3C81d28TY1E