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Bob
26th December 2014, 19:52
Immortality possible? For the body, not as a cripple but vibrant and in full health?

How about fixed at a biological age of let's say 39?



In this thread we will dissect the mechanisms of aging, how and why cells die, and thusly the complex organism. This thread is not about AI, nor uploading one's brain into some 'thing'..

In this thread we'll try to talk about fine tuning what we have, or optimizing gene sequencing, turning off the death mechanisms, and turning ON the regeneration, bringing the body back to about the optimal of 39.

People will say the soul doesn't die, they are the immortal being, and having a limited body life is no concern to them.

Plenty of material for many more threads, to get into those other concepts. Within this thread we will look at finding out IF immortality can be achieved. And what is it, in the cells that programs in cell death..

Have breakthroughs been achieved? Yes.. optimum yet, no..

Enjoy the read, and in some spots it may be a bit technical, I will endeavor to break it down in to simpler terms as we proceed..

--Bob



http://www.notable-quotes.com/i/immortality_quote_2.jpg

PS - has anyone talked about '39' as an age when asked how old they are?

Jack Benny.. actually started using 39 as the age he said he was when asked.

Recognized as a leading American entertainer of the 20th century, Benny portrayed his character as a miser, playing his violin badly. In character, he would always be 39 years of age, regardless of his actual age.

Benny was known for comic timing, and the ability to create laughter with a pregnant pause or a single expression, such as his signature exasperated "Well!" His radio and television programs, popular from the 1930s to the 1970s, were a major influence on the sitcom genre.

Hilarious right? Just a fiction?

W E L L

:)


Maybe not..

Bob
26th December 2014, 19:53
The body has built in senescence. This is a gradual programmed deterioration of functional ability characteristic of most complex lifeforms, arguably found in all biological kingdoms, that on the level of the organism increases mortality after it grows up.

Growing old "gracefully" has been a choice for folks who choose to savor the good moments; burning out like a "road flare" tends to be a wild ride hot and heavy pedal to the metal.. Supposedly with older age comes some wisdom that it hurts more to bang into the wall full speed, then simply going around it..

So for old and young alike, how about get a bigger more fruitful ride? Not quite done learning and experiencing yet?

It's not a fear of dying.. thinking that "well on another plane one will ascend", and not be put back into 'storage' for soul recycling is always the discussion (numerous threads about the light and not..)

None of that is for discussion in this thread, this is about something very interesting..

That the bodies do HAVE a set of triggers whence pressed, in the right sequence, the body repairs, age reduces, and immortality is achieved. Fountain of youth?


A meeting happened

Stem cell researchers meeting in San Antonio say they are just a few decades away from the ultimate prize...coming up with a 'universal pill' to rejuvenate human tissue and extend our functional lives indefinitely, News Radio 1200 WOAI's Stephanie Narvaez reports.

The idea of the STEM CELL is that it is a cell which can become anything NEEDED for the body's blue-print which is encoded in the DNA. DNA is instructions in how to take raw materials, and fold it into a LIFE FORM. DNA takes chaos and creates order from it.

Dr. Aubrey DeGrey, the Chief Science Officer of California-based SENS Research Foundation, told researchers at the Global Stem Cell Summit recently, that stem cell scientists from around the world are working on a 'pill that would prevent humans from getting sick.'

What exists in the DNA are triggers which can turn on REPAIR SEQUENCES.. Sequence are instructions that can tell the cells to do something.. This pill would contain a method of turning on those sequences.. It would also contain substances to TURN OFF viral replication, and other genetically damaging substances.

Degrey: "It should prevent us from getting sick, ever," he said. "Basically, I'm saying that we won't get anything any more. People will get chronologically older, but they won't get physiologically older."

The immortalizing 'God pill' has been a goal of researchers ever since the isolation of the human genome, The genome is a data bank study of all of the DNA and what in the DNA does what.

It was important to have DNA research. To understand the instructions and coding of LIFE itself.

Dr. DeGrey, is a professor at the Moscow Institute of Physics and Technology.

Without any extraordinary breakthrough occurring, science is 'twenty to thirty years away' from coming up with the proper DNA triggers. Those being activated, and the human body then essentially automatically rejuvenates itself. Functional IMMORTALITY.

Right now the DNA therapy database is showing 30 more years of quality life is capable. Going full immortality is only a matter of mapping and triggering the proper sequences.

Sources: assorted life rejuvenation articles (additional references will be at the conclusion of the thread)

Bob
26th December 2014, 19:54
I had started looking at the built-in senescence issue to see why would it logically be incorporated into a cell, or an organism.. My guess is, it has to do with nature trying many different combinations of gene codes to see "what is the fittest" to deal with the current level of assault.

If the gig is to figure out "what does it mean to be __________(identity, fill in the blank with your favorite 'self')" then if that answer is derived, if one has reproduced then the question as far as gene code is answered. As far as the spirit for the identity being satisfied, that is another question. If the soul base is using a particular set of similar genetic bodies to try to get an answer to something that is interesting also...

I started looking 50 years ago into every piece of data that was available that I could get my hands on in this subject - including what are the damaging factors messing with gene codes. Not too much progress being talked about, so I went looking for my own data to develop my own research, based on guidance provided by those who tried.

The situation comes down to addressing what is in the body, the mechanisms that keeps it running well. What are the steps taken to keep it running well, with quality experience. When something gets out of rhythm, (that is the key word), what method can be used to get it back..

When the cells have a program within them, to re-establish bio-rhythms (biological cellular rhythms), that program can be re-activated. Normally some type of disease trigger will cause a rebuilding mechanism to happen.. Or an injury, requiring rapid cell healing (get a nasty burn and what happens? Certain reactions are turned on, and eventually the burn is healed, even without a scar..)

Bob
26th December 2014, 19:56
Point to ask, what is it that is in the body, what are the mechanisms that keep it running well.

What are the steps taken to keep it running well, with quality experience.

When something gets out of rhythm, (that is the key word), what (physical) method(s) can be used to get it back..

In the subsequent posts, we will look at those rhythms.. both for cell life and for cell death..

Bob
26th December 2014, 19:56
Whether or not a spiritual factor is involved to get to the place of figuring out the right frequency patterns is somewhat related to the thread, meaning the frequencies can be used to evoke the triggering, if one were able to sort out what GENE code means, in frequency space.

Assuming that an untrained mind can trigger the correct patterns - doubt that. BUT WHAT IF WE COULD??

Bob
26th December 2014, 19:57
Seniors received a significant boost to their immune systems when given a drug that targets a genetic signaling pathway linked to aging and immune function.

(Source (http://health.usnews.com/health-news/articles/2014/12/24/researchers-take-first-baby-step-toward-anti-aging-drug))

The mTOR genetic pathway promotes healthy growth in the young. (This is how the genetic switches work.. When the HGH is still present, mTOR works fine.. WHEN HGS is turned OFF (growing stops), and mTOR response changes.. in other words, PROPER sequencing of the switching is required, re-establishing proper cycles)..


When drugs like rapamycin are used to inhibit the effects of the mTOR pathway in mice, they "seem to extend lifespan and delay the onset of aging-related illnesses," Mannick said.

Mannick and her colleagues decided to investigate whether a rapamycin-like drug could reverse the natural decline that elderly people experience in their ability to fight off infections.

Rapamycin belongs to a class of drugs known as mTOR inhibitors, which have been shown to counteract aging and aging-related diseases in mice and other animals.

Bob
26th December 2014, 20:00
Apoptosis - programmed Cell Death

We will get a little bit technical below, no worries.. When we get into the LETTER SEQUENCES for the GENES, these are JUST designations pointing to the gene program.. sorta like names used to label CD's, purely arbitrary, and used for catelogging only :)


--------------------

Within the nucleus of the Cell, there are Chromosomes, or information packets containing further sets of instructions called GENES - which are made of/from DNA - we ARE made by the instructions from our GENES.. STEP by STEP.. From start to finish, the GENES have it all within them..

So our 3 key words are Chromosomes, GENES and DNA..

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-n4_nw_Qgbj0/UyPsY90VMgI/AAAAAAAACuY/CdrT2MQ9qts/s1600/Cell+Chromosome++DNA+Gene.gif

DNA - The DNA in one's cells is packaged into 46 chromosomes in the nucleus. As well as being a naturally helical molecule, DNA is supercoiled using enzymes so that it takes up less space.

Try holding a piece of string at one end, and twisting the other. As you add twist, the string creates coils of coils; and eventually, coils of coils of coils.

One's DNA is arranged as a coil of coils of coils of coils of coils! (TIGHT PACKING.)

This allows the 3 billion base pairs in each cell to fit into a space just 6 microns across.

If you stretched the DNA in one cell all the way out, it would be about 2m long and all the DNA in all your cells put together would be about twice the diameter of the Solar System. THERE ARE ONLY TWO STRANDS in DNA.

http://cdn.sciencefocus.com/sites/default/files/imagecache/490px_wide/qanda/images/dna.gif

CHROMOSOME - In humans, each cell normally contains 23 pairs of chromosomes, for a total of 46.

Twenty-two of these pairs, called autosomes, look the same in both males and females.

The 23rd pair, the sex chromosomes, differ between males and females. Females have two copies of the X chromosome, while males have one X and one Y chromosome.

http://ghr.nlm.nih.gov/handbook/illustrations/chromosomes.jpg

GENE - Most genes contain the information needed to make functional molecules called proteins. (A few genes produce other molecules that help the cell assemble proteins.)

The journey from gene to protein is complex and tightly controlled within each cell.

It consists of two major steps: transcription and translation. Together, transcription and translation are known as gene expression.

NB: ALL ACTIONS to MAKE the body, keep it living, ARE CONTROLLED BY THE GENES.

GENES are sensitive to external AND internal chemical and electrical stimulation.

During the process of transcription, the information stored in a gene’s DNA is transferred to a similar molecule called RNA (ribonucleic acid) in the cell nucleus. Both RNA and DNA are made up of a chain of nucleotide bases, but they have slightly different chemical properties.

The type of RNA that contains the information for making a protein is called messenger RNA (mRNA) because it carries the information, or message, from the DNA out of the nucleus into the cytoplasm. (Cytoplasm, the semi-liquid gel within the cell in which the nucleus resides).

Translation, the second step in getting from a gene to a protein, takes place in the cytoplasm.

The mRNA interacts with a specialized complex called a ribosome, which “reads” the sequence of mRNA bases. Each sequence of three bases, called a codon, usually codes for one particular amino acid. (Amino acids are the building blocks of proteins.)

A type of RNA called transfer RNA (tRNA) assembles the protein, one amino acid at a time.

Protein assembly continues until the ribosome encounters a “stop” codon (a sequence of three bases that does not code for an amino acid).


---------------------------

The flow of information from DNA to RNA to Proteins is one of the fundamental principles of molecular biology.

Separation of GENES into FUNCTION -

Each cell expresses, or turns on, only a fraction of its genes.

The rest of the genes are repressed, or turned off. The process of turning genes on and off is known as gene regulation.

Gene regulation is an important part of normal development.

Genes are turned on and off in different patterns during development to make a brain cell look and act different from a liver cell or a muscle cell, for example.

Gene regulation also allows cells to react quickly to changes in their environments.

Although we know that the regulation of genes is critical for life, this complex process is not yet fully understood.

Gene regulation can occur at any point during gene expression, but most commonly occurs at the level of transcription (when the information in a gene’s DNA is transferred to mRNA).

Signals from the environment or from other cells activate proteins called transcription factors.

These proteins bind to regulatory regions of a gene and increase or decrease the level of transcription.

By controlling the level of transcription, this process can determine the amount of protein product that is made by a gene at any given time.

ONE ONLY wants a certain amount of muscles built, or skin built, or heart cells built at a given time.. WHEN DAMAGE occurs one wants some type of REPAIR to start, to enable the organ to continue to function properly..

Induction of Apoptosis:

There are GENES specifically designed to terminate or kill the cell. These are the killers..

There are specific categories, where attempts to repair damage happen first. When damage repair cannot be adequately accomplished the "death receptors" activate.

A cell has to normally TURN OFF the death sequence and a properly functioning cell WILL continually turn OFF its own death.. (Anti-Apoptosis genes). FOLLOW me on this.. The cell MUST continually TURN OFF its own death.. !!

When the cell cannot turn OFF its death cycle, which IS normally there, latent and waiting, due to excessive unrepairable damage to the DNA, the death receptors start to function to call up the steps needed to shut-down dna replication.. FLAGS appear to the other cells in the body responsible for cleaning up debris (damaged cellular material).

Death Domain Receptors: CRADD, FADD, TNF, TNFRSF10B (DR5).

DNA Damage: ABL1, CIDEA, CIDEB, TP53, TP73.

Extracellular Signals: CFLAR (CASPER), DAPK1, TNFRSF25 (DR3).
Other: BAD, BAK1, BAX, BCL10, BCL2L11, BCLAF1, BID, BIK, BNIP1, BNIP3, BNIP3L, CASP1 (ICE), CASP10 (MCH4), CASP14, CASP2, CASP3, CASP4, CASP6, CASP8, CD27 (TNFRSF7), CD70 (TNFSF7), DFFA, FAS (TNFRSF6), FASLG (TNFSF6), GADD45A, HRK, LTA (TNFB), NOD1 (CARD4), PYCARD (TMS1/ASC), TNFRSF10A, TNFRSF9, TNFSF10 (TRAIL), TNFSF8, TP53BP2, TRADD, TRAF3.

Anti-Apoptosis: AKT1, BAG1, BAG3, BAG4, BAX, BCL2, BCL2A1 (Bfl-1/A1), BCL2L1 (BCL-X), BCL2L10, BCL2L2, BFAR, BIRC3 (c-IAP1), BIRC6, BIRC8, BNIP1, BNIP2, BNIP3, BNIP3L, BRAF, CD27 (TNFRSF7), CD40LG (TNFSF5), CFLAR (CASPER), DAPK1, FAS (TNFRSF6), HRK, IGF1R, MCL1, NAIP (BIRC1), NOL3, RIPK2, TNF, XIAP (BIRC4).

Regulation of Apoptosis:

Negative Regulation: BAG1, BAG3, BAG4, BCL10, BCL2, BCL2A1 (Bfl-1/A1), BCL2L1 (BCL-X), BCL2L10, BCL2L2, BFAR, BIRC3 (c-IAP1), BIRC6, BIRC8, BNIP1, BNIP2, BNIP3, BNIP3L, BRAF, CASP3, CD27 (TNFRSF7), CD40LG (TNFSF5), CFLAR (CASPER), CIDEA, DAPK1, DFFA, FAS (TNFRSF6), IGF1R, MCL1, NAIP (BIRC1), NOL3, TP53, TP73, XIAP (BIRC4).

Positive Regulation: ABL1, AKT1, BAD, BAK1, BAX, BCL2L11, BCLAF1, BID, BIK, BNIP3, BNIP3L, CASP1 (ICE), CASP10 (MCH4), CASP14, CASP2, CASP4, CASP6, CASP8, CD70 (TNFSF7), CIDEB, CRADD, FADD, FASLG (TNFSF6), HRK, LTA (TNFB), NOD1 (CARD4), PYCARD (TMS1/ASC), RIPK2, TNF, TNFRSF10A, TNFRSF10B (DR5), TNFRSF25 (DR3), TNFRSF9, TNFSF10 (TRAIL), TNFSF8, TP53, TP53BP2, TRADD, TRAF2, TRAF3, TRAF4.

Both positive and negative regulation steps provide a type of ACTIVE FEEDBACK to keep the repair and killing mechanisms in balance.

It should be obvious that when the feedback mechanisms are set out of rhythm, that issues can arise.. It is in these feedback mechanisms where 'tampering' has happened, leading to a body "life span" at best on a programmed average of about 100 years.

I will get further into the specific gene sequences in the repair and regulatory genes later in the thread.

Bob
26th December 2014, 20:01
There are 84 key genes involved in programmed cell death.

Apoptosis plays a critical role in normal biological processes requiring cell removal including differentiation, development, and homeostasis.

Stress responses (such as heat shock, ischemia, unfolded proteins, and viral infection) cause badly damaged cells to undergo apoptosis.

In cell culture, growth factor withdrawal and many known experimental compounds have a similar effect.

An acquired defect in apoptosis activation often leads to uncontrolled cell growth, oncogenesis, and cancer. (KEY UNDERSTANDING HERE)

Ligand-bound tumor necrosis factor (TNF) receptors initiate apoptosis by recruiting FADD and other death domain adaptor proteins that then recruit and activate caspases.

Environmental stresses trigger BCL2 protein oligomerization and insertion into the mitochondrial membrane, releasing APAF1 and other CARD family members that also oligomerize to recruit and activate caspases.

Caspases promote a proteolysis cascade that degrades cellular protein targets, while the IAP protein family directly inhibits caspases. (This is an example of the positive/negative FEEDBACK mechanism at work).

This array includes TNF ligands and their receptors, members of the bcl-2, caspase, IAP, TRAF, CARD, death domain, death effector domain, and CIDE families, as well as genes involved in the p53 and DNA damage pathways.

Bob
26th December 2014, 20:02
Caspases and the apoptosome - Killers kept under control

The caspases are a family of proteins (made by the GENES) that are one of the main executors of the apoptotic process.

They belong to a group of enzymes known as cysteine proteases and exist within the cell as inactive pro-forms or zymogens.

Keywords, exist within the cell AS NORMALLY INACTIVE proto-forms.

These zymogens can be cleaved to form active enzymes following the induction of apoptosis. So splitting them off, allows them to then become potentially ACTIVATED.. Whence activated, the cascade reactions start to rip apart the cell (and of course facilitate cellular death). Stopping this from happening would be ONE pathway for cellular immortallizing.

Induction of apoptosis via death receptors typically results in the activation of an initiator caspase such as caspase 8 or caspase 10.

These caspases can then activate other caspases in a cascade.

This is where the DEATH sequence is actively promoting the disintegration of the DNA and other cellular proteins back into basic amino acids (that can potentially be recycled).

This cascade eventually leads to the activation of the effector caspases, such as caspase 3 and caspase 6.

These caspases are responsible for the cleavage of the key cellular proteins, such as cytoskeletal proteins, that leads to the typical morphological changes observed in cells undergoing apoptosis.

The Apopto-some

The program packet in other words, or a set of instructions and feedback mechanisms to activate various sub-routines to control how to kill.

There are a number of other mechanisms, aside from activation of the death receptors, through which the caspase cascade can be activated.

Granzyme B can be delivered into cells by cytotoxic T lymphocytes and is able to directly activate caspases 3, 7, 8 and 10.

The mitochondria are also key regulators of the caspase cascade and apoptosis. Release of cytochrome C from mitochondria can lead to the activation of caspase 9, and then of caspase 3. This effect is mediated through the formation of an apoptosome, a multi-protein complex consisting of cytochrome C, Apaf-1, pro-caspase 9 and ATP.

Caspases and chromatin breakdown

One of the hallmarks of apoptosis is the cleavage of chromosomal DNA into nucleosomal units.

The caspases play an important role in this process by activating DNases, inhibiting DNA repair enzymes and breaking down structural proteins in the nucleus.

This processes is illustrated below:

http://www.reading.ac.uk/nitricoxide/intro/apoptosis/chromatin.jpg

1) Inactivation of enzymes involved in DNA repair.

The enzyme poly (ADP-ribose) polymerase, or PARP, was one of the first proteins identified as a substrate for caspases. PARP is involved in repair of DNA damage and functions by catalyzing the synthesis of poly (ADP-ribose) and by binding to DNA strand breaks and modifying nuclear proteins. The ability of PARP to repair DNA damage is prevented following cleavage of PARP by caspase-3.

2) Breakdown of structural nuclear proteins.

Lamins are intra-nuclear proteins that maintain the shape of the nucleus and mediate interactions between chromatin and the nuclear membrane. Degradation of lamins by caspase 6 results in the chromatin condensation and nuclear fragmentation commonly observed in apoptotic cells.

3) Fragmentation of DNA.

The fragmentation of DNA into nucleosomal units - as seen in DNA laddering assays - is caused by an enzyme known as CAD, or caspase activated DNase. Normally CAD exists as an inactive complex with ICAD (inhibitor of CAD). During apoptosis, ICAD is cleaved by caspases, such as caspase 3, to release CAD. Rapid fragmentation of the nuclear DNA follows.

And there you have it, a cell is taken apart, reduced to bare components, and quite "dead".

SO, what happens when CASPASES are toned down a bit?

sandy
26th December 2014, 20:40
Well this is really "thick" as the jargon is foreign to my ears/knowledge. I'm gleaning that toning down the caspases, would assist the body to rejuvenate more readily and thus slow down the aging process..............hope I don't have this backwards as I found it somewhat confusing to my non-scientific mind :)

By the way Bob, wasn't the 'original' Rife machine able to re-calibrate our frequencies to their healthy functioning state and thus vanished as a result?

Bob
26th December 2014, 20:52
VERY GOOD Sandy - missing dots connected :)

Rife, Abrams, Drown - each of those researchers were experimenting with machines which were able to induce different frequency patterns able to alter the gene triggers, (activation or suppression).



Well this is really "thick" as the jargon is foreign to my ears/knowledge. I'm gleaning that toning down the caspases, would assist the body to rejuvenate more readily and thus slow down the aging process..............hope I don't have this backwards as I found it somewhat confusing to my non-scientific mind :)

By the way Bob, wasn't the 'original' Rife machine able to re-calibrate our frequencies to their healthy functioning state and thus vanished as a result?

Bob
26th December 2014, 21:03
When is it appropriate to have DEAD cells present? Think about the SKIN, a layer of dead cells (outermost), separated by an inner basal cell level, where the cells going to the surface are not completely 'digested'. Mucous membranes, the tissues in the mouth, intestine, at the surface must be used protectively..

New skin cells are formed from the basal cells in the lowest cell layer in the epidermis. From there they migrate towards the surface.

So dead cells do have a purpose, on the OUTSIDE of the body, the surface layers exposed to the outside world. A layer of dead keratin-filled cells at the surface, to help reduce water loss.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/27/Skin.png/600px-Skin.png

Bob
26th December 2014, 21:58
Hundreds of Caspase inhibitors are being located, from natural substances, also derived from viruses, as well as synthetically synthesized..

Iodoacetamide is one of those substances - the smallest amounts of IodoAcetamide have resulted in complete caspase suppression.

Iodo-acetamide is a cysteine protease inhibitor that blocks HSF fragmentation, also inhibited apoptosis. (HSF - Heat Shock Fragmentation induced)

2- iodine acetamide; iodine substituting acetamide

Production methods : the chloro-acetamide recombination reaction with sodium iodide is used. Will start with chloro-acetamide; needed reagents, Anhydrous acetone, and sodium iodide; requires that Anhydrous sodium iodide is placed in a bath with the acetamide for about 15h. Then cool to room temperature, filtered with sodium chloride, using acetone recovery, poured into the drying oven after the sodium bisulfate ice water, then use sodium chloride and keep the saturated solution set to pH 6. Cooling and crystallization, filtration in crude. Crude but can use water purification crystallization, which afterwards, the synthesis and recovery steps are now finished. Iodide coupling to the acetamide is the object removing the chlorine component. Acetamide is an organic compound with the formula CH₃CONH₂. It is the simplest amide derived from acetic acid.

(Source (http://www.chemyq.com/En/xz/xz10/97648dqbid.htm))

Are there interesting observations with the acetate chloro or acetate iodo (iodine) substances?

DCA (DiChloroAcetate) has been used experimentally in stopping some Cancers..

Looking further then into acetates should be useful.. (Acetate, as in vinegar, acetic acid)..

Spiral
26th December 2014, 22:34
There is a LOT going on in this field, certainly in the UK which quite frankly if if I posted about I would be suicided before you could say "Qlue wot would get me killed'.

Not joking either !

Elbie
26th December 2014, 23:00
There is a LOT going on in this field, certainly in the UK which quite frankly if if I posted about I would be suicided before you could say "Qlue wot would get me killed'.

Not joking either !

tho it may not stop you from PMing bob to help with useful references


bob, when you mentioned 'acetates as in vinegar', was that to suggest a dietary use? thanks

Bob
26th December 2014, 23:03
About a miraculous diet? Immortality with the right food and preparation?

Looking at the above "science" to find out what has to be worked with to trigger proper longevity, what comes to mind?

Iodine

Sea Salt

Vinegar

so....

What if the bowl that the ingredients were mixed in, on a fire, heated, were iron, with traces of copper... ? If there were some ammonia compounds too, how about a dash of ethanol..

ORGANIC chemistry reactions could very well be happening in the food preparations..

Where DCA (dichloroacetate an anti-cancer substance) and IAM (Iodo-Acetamide) could be created in small amounts.. Such a diet would lead to suppression of apoptosis, plus the DCA would work towards stopping certain types of cancers..

ADD IN then the right fungus mushroom, and immune boosting would occur..

ODD coincidence, maybe not, maybe without knowing the "science", natural substances combined in the right way have been leading to immortality.. !!

Bob
26th December 2014, 23:04
tho it may not stop you from PMing bob to help with useful references


bob, when you mentioned 'acetates as in vinegar', was that to suggest a dietary use? thanks

I was actually answering your question as you posted :)

Elbie
26th December 2014, 23:06
About a miraculous diet? Immortality with the right food and preparation?

Looking at the above "science" to find out what has to be worked with to trigger proper longevity, what comes to mind?

Iodine

Sea Salt

Vinegar

so....

What if the bowl that the ingredients were mixed in, on a fire, heated, were iron, with traces of copper... ? If there were some ammonia compounds too, how about a dash of ethanol..

ORGANIC chemistry reactions could very well be happening in the food preparations..

Where DCA (dichloroacetate an anti-cancer substance) and IAM (Iodo-Acetamide) could be created in small amounts.. Such a diet would lead to suppression of apoptosis, plus the DCA would work towards stopping certain types of cancers..

ADD IN then the right fungus mushroom, and immune boosting would occur..

ODD coincidence, maybe not, maybe without knowing the "science", natural substances combined in the right way have been leading to immortality.. !!


a dashing response!

thanks muchly


----post update ----
.
I was actually answering your question as you posted

i've gathered that..useful synchronicity

Bob
26th December 2014, 23:12
I would wonder a bit, with a society living by the sea, who used natural sea salts, and sea vegetables, possibly different types of kelp, seaweeds, with wine which has turned (and good for cooking), would their handed down instructions, be part of the recipes which would trigger immortality, or at least really good health.. I keep thinking about certain Mediterranean areas.. Immortal Gods, Olympus? and they ate what?

Elbie
26th December 2014, 23:30
I would wonder a bit, with a society living by the sea, who used natural sea salts, and sea vegetables, possibly different types of kelp, seaweeds, with wine which has turned (and good for cooking), would their handed down instructions, be part of the recipes which would trigger immortality, or at least really good health.. I keep thinking about certain Mediterranean areas.. Immortal Gods, Olympus? and they ate what?

one of my great grand dads died while pushing the third set of teeth :hilarious:
bless him, according to family seniors who remembered,noone knew what was the illness that befell him suddenly - considering he was going strong despite pushing 101..anyway, turned out, this is what they realised on his death bed, it was the new teeth! he developed unusually high temperature (like babies do) and succumbed to it . nobody guessed a third set of teeth was something possible and assumed he was poorly due to his old age.

he lived on a farm.

Bob
26th December 2014, 23:39
one of my great grand dads died while pushing the third set of teeth :hilarious:
bless him, according to family seniors who remembered,noone knew what was the illness that befell him suddenly - considering he was going strong despite pushing 101..anyway, turned out, this is what they realised on his death bed, it was the new teeth! he developed unusually high temperature (like babies do) and succumbed to it . nobody guessed a third set of teeth was something possible and assumed he was poorly due to his old age.

he lived on a farm.

That sounds like the heat-shock stress mechanism in the cells was not turned off.. IF it were, he would still be alive me-thinks.. I'll keep that in mind with the gene triggers, which need to be dealt with properly.. tnx

Elbie
26th December 2014, 23:55
That sounds like the heat-shock stress mechanism in the cells was not turned off.. IF it were, he would still be alive me-thinks.. I'll keep that in mind with the gene triggers, which need to be dealt with properly.. tnx
thanks..me too thinks he would have gone on for another good while..the familiy members were too embarrassed to call for any help considring his actual age given prevalent prejudices..they were mindul not to be laughed at by the (small) community..as cruel as it sounds.

Bob
27th December 2014, 00:01
I have seen medico established prejudices, first hand and it is not fair, that 'they' feel there is an expiration stamp placed on the bottom of one's foot with their belief of accepted death, or how useful a person is to 'society' (how about how useful to cabal).. Frankly, we can solve death and then deal with population, and housing, and food - all of which is solvable, provided those in power are reminded they work for the people, not the other way around...

Pris
27th December 2014, 00:12
Still looking for a cure for accelerated decrepitude, eh Bobroy? :D

lookbeyond
27th December 2014, 00:13
Seniors received a significant boost to their immune systems when given a drug that targets a genetic signaling pathway linked to aging and immune function.

(Source (http://health.usnews.com/health-news/articles/2014/12/24/researchers-take-first-baby-step-toward-anti-aging-drug))

The mTOR genetic pathway promotes healthy growth in the young. (This is how the genetic switches work.. When the HGH is still present, mTOR works fine.. WHEN HGS is turned OFF (growing stops), and mTOR response changes.. in other words, PROPER sequencing of the switching is required, re-establishing proper cycles)..


When drugs like rapamycin are used to inhibit the effects of the mTOR pathway in mice, they "seem to extend lifespan and delay the onset of aging-related illnesses," Mannick said.

Mannick and her colleagues decided to investigate whether a rapamycin-like drug could reverse the natural decline that elderly people experience in their ability to fight off infections.

Rapamycin belongs to a class of drugs known as mTOR inhibitors, which have been shown to counteract aging and aging-related diseases in mice and other animals.

Hi Bob, i read somewhere about a particular exercise sequence to increase HGH levels, as i read about them (the exercises) they seemed unnatural (for want of a better word) and so did not pursue it,--lb

Bob
27th December 2014, 00:21
Still looking for a cure for accelerated decrepitude, eh Bobroy? :D

:) :) With the proper repair sequences anything is possible, including transformation into other forms, if desired.. Knowing the triggers, the sequences and the substances to be used when is the key.. The other way is purely the electronic way, using the frequency patterns instead of physical substances.

norman
27th December 2014, 00:24
I once spent 3 months in Scottsdale with these people.

http://www.peopleunlimitedinc.com/

At the time, it fried my brain, but, they might have something to say about this subject. They are hell bent on becoming physically immortal, that's for sure.

Bob
27th December 2014, 00:26
Hi Bob, i read somewhere about a particular exercise sequence to increase HGH levels, as i read about them (the exercises) they seemed unnatural (for want of a better word) and so did not pursue it,--lb

WHEN to turn on what... Turning on repair gene patterns says FIX what can be fixed... Adding HGH (Human Growth Hormone), may be appropriate at the right time.. Is it needed to stimulate new cell growth, turning on protein generation? What if the mechanisms of turning on full DNA repairs were more appropriate, and within the repair sequences, one of the steps could be natural HGH generation??

Looking into the amazing gene database, there are so many abilities which can be accomplished working with what is naturally there.. No GMO needed unless one is wanting to sprout a new function for a mammal body (it has been suggested in the early days of GMO, that incorporating Chlorophyll in the back with the skin cells would let one naturally have an ability to synthesize energy from sunlight, carbon dioxide (waste from exhaling) and water..


http://adweek.blogs.com/photos/uncategorized/jollygreen_1.jpg

Elbie
27th December 2014, 00:54
I have seen medico established prejudices, first hand and it is not fair, that 'they' feel there is an expiration stamp placed on the bottom of one's foot with their belief of accepted death, or how useful a person is to 'society' (how about how useful to cabal).. Frankly, we can solve death and then deal with population, and housing, and food - all of which is solvable, provided those in power are reminded they work for the people, not the other way around...

i can't agree with you more on this one.

i got so close to being a premature gonner due to one such medical presumptuous assumption..i kept begging them to take my blood sample for analysis to, frankly, prove what my strong (turned out correct) diagnostics guess was, they kept throwing paracetamols at me asking me to go home and sleep it off 'because i looked good'. i felt i was on my last legs after three long weeks of not knowing where excrutiating headaches came from.
once i finally got them to look into my blood and when the results arrived, they panicked, the note read 'plasmodium vivax' (with three exlamation marks by the lab technician) and wanted to hospitalise me there and then.. i wasn't having any of their hospitalisation , just wanted a medicine to put me back on track.
later on, when i enquired, my doc said that although in medical journals it is EXTREMELY rare that one should develop malaria 18 months following bite exposure..i could have ended up like my great grand dad :hilarious: dying well before time due to prejudice.

most ironically, i live about three short miles from one of the best hospitals for tropical deseases in eu.

Bob
27th December 2014, 01:06
Just for reference was it a combo of MALARONE and PROGUANAL HCL which terminated the latent and reactivated plasmodium? I have been exposed to both yellow fever and malaria.. not fun..

TURNING ON the repair mechanisms, dealing with parasites, dealing with cellular toxins (see the thread on detoxing), dealing with viruses (will be starting a thread on broad spectrum anti-viral substances) opens up a regimen for permanent immortality. (In actuality I looked at about 10,000 years was a workable number for rejuvenation and repair.. the odds change when unexpected accident happens, such as stupidity and arrogance by 'learnered medico' who know better...(sigh))



i can't agree with you more on this one.

i got so close to being a premature gonner due to one such medical assumptuous presumption..

i kept begging them to take my blood sample for analysis to, frankly, prove what my strong (turned out correct) diagnostics guess was, they kept throwing paracetamols at me asking me to go home and sleep it off 'because i looked good'.

i felt i was on my last legs after three long weeks of not knowing where excruciating headaches came from.

Once i finally got them to look into my blood and when the results arrived, they panicked, the note read 'plasmodium vivax' (with three exlamation marks by the lab technician) and wanted to hospitalise me there and then.. i wasn't having any of their hospitalisation , just wanted a medicine to put me back on track.

Later on, when i enquired, my doc said that although in medical journals it is EXTREMELY rare that one should develop malaria 18 months following bite exposure..i could have ended up like my great grand dad :hilarious: dying well before time due to prejudice.

Most ironically, i live about three short miles from one of the best hospitals for tropical deseases in eu.

Elbie
27th December 2014, 01:28
i sincerely do not remember, this was 10 -12 years ago. it's on my medical record and i could find out when i am next at my gps. if you can wait i could pull that info.

i remember feeling angry afterwords and because i was suspicious over whether i got a proper treatment, i got in touch with a german doc by phone, a specialist for tropical diseases who i met socially while in Africa and to my satisfaction, he confirmed to me i was given the latest/best meds.
your first mention rings a bell but i can't say i am sure..what was peculiar about these tiny tablets is that they had to be taken at exactly prescribed intervals which were not the same. i was warned to really watch it or be hospitalised.
again, this was at the time, they may have advanced the treatment options since.

Bob
27th December 2014, 01:35
Elbie understood.. The point being we need to deal with parasites, viruses, dangerous accidents (like doctor induced diseases and maladies), and built-in programming in the Genes.. I consider proper nutrition and detoxing some of the steps needed.. Supplements I would assume could be things like the proper anti-virals, and detox facilitators.. Parasites, I can only imagine how many different types the body has to deal with on a regular basis.. It's amazing we live as long as we do..

Pris
27th December 2014, 04:12
I once spent 3 months in Scottsdale with these people.

http://www.peopleunlimitedinc.com/

At the time, it fried my brain, but, they might have something to say about this subject. They are hell bent on becoming physically immortal, that's for sure.


Three months? If you don't mind my asking, did you learn anything useful you could share?

norman
27th December 2014, 15:34
Three months? If you don't mind my asking, did you learn anything useful you could share?


It was very intense, for me. I felt I was having all my buttons pressed at the same time, and indefinitely.

There are lots of things I could try digging back up from my long term memory ( it was 1989 ! ). One of the main things that sticks with me is the thing about relationships. Most of us either start out with the intent, or sooner or later end up with the function, of using a relationship as a hiding place. A place where we can avoid dealing with the very things that are ultimately going to kill us.



There are a couple videos on the web site that are a tad hyper. Here's one that's more cerebral and in the frame of intellectual pursuit, NOT, ultimately what they are about, but it's how most people expect to learn about things.

The first 7m:50s are junk prepping time, best to skip it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=WwohrY51x24

BabaRa
27th December 2014, 22:15
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=WwohrY51x24

Hardly know what to say first. Short of time, so will be concise.

The guy and the gal on either end of the couch have had EXTENSIVE plastic surgery, botox, etc. Couldn't be sure of the guy in the middle. That tells me much and should tell all of you much. So activating our DNA means finding a plastic surgeon.?!?!

I did like the gal that did the interview, she seemed sincere.

My opinion: You do not have to be celebate to find enlightenment or to find the Fountain of Youth. You need to be joyful, compassionate, grateful, etc. You also need to find a purpose that is greater than self. It doesn't have to be big, it could be very simple like helping those around you when you can.

BabaRa
27th December 2014, 22:40
Point to ask, what is it that is in the body, what are the mechanisms that keep it running well.

What are the steps taken to keep it running well, with quality experience.

When something gets out of rhythm, (that is the key word), what (physical) method(s) can be used to get it back..

In the subsequent posts, we will look at those rhythms.. both for cell life and for cell death..



Bob, so much to say here so little time.

I understand you want to keep it at the body level, but I don't know how you can not address consciousness. You speak of
" fine tuning what we have, or optimizing gene sequencing, turning off the death mechanisms, and turning ON the regeneration, bringing the body back to about the optimal of 39." But WHAT are you going to use to turn this sequences on and off?

I'm guessing you're familar with Bruce Lipton, who is a MD medical researcher. He has a great video, the biology of belief. Shows in a lab experiment how you can take a cancer cell out of a patient and it will heal. Put it back in the patient and same cell goes cancerous again. His conclusion was the belief system of the patient was affecting the cell and in order to cure the patient one had to change their belief system.

Depak Chopra an endochronologist turned spiritual teacher came to the conclusion that our biology conforms to our thoughts and beliefs. He came to this conclusion after treating many patients and trying to figure out why one body would heal under a certain treatment and another would not.

Medical studies have shown that STRESS plays a big role in All illnesses.

Most on this Forum know I am in my mid-70's - so I have many friends and acquaintances in that age group - as well as many who are not. My personal observation is that a person's outlook plays a key role. Also, most important - exercise as well as plenty of fluids.

I have a brother, age 82, rarely eats fruit or veggies, rarely drinks anything but soda. Has had more than his share of sugar and carbs, not to mention Southern Comfort 100 proof. He is healthy. I believe it's because he hikes for at least an hour every day and often 3 hours (and I'm talking serious hiking here) - and he LOVES life.

I'm not trying to dismiss science here. Have you read many books on electrons. You might find them fascinating. Stay searching, never know what or who will turn up.

Bob
27th December 2014, 23:13
Hia BabaRa, very great observations and questions :)

The frequency energetics were touched in Posts 5 10 and 11.

It's interesting that you bring up Lipton and the suggestion of morphogenic "reality" holding a stasis field. I was just discussing that very subject with our chat group today (holographic biocoherence is the specialty).. The missing data is called "scaffolding" or why does a cell culture not properly differentiate into lets say a full finger where there is no "finger" electromagnetically being expressed.

Can mind modify biochemistry - of course it can, but to know WHAT it is modifying forms a basis for discussion.. Since pointing out the mechanism of turning off (continually), the subroutine of cell death for instance then allows one to focus on how is that done.. When is it not done? another question..

If one were to look at holographic bioresonance across the species one would open up a door for a quantum level structuring holding mankind in a model.

My feeling is the molecular basis is important in understanding structure, and in this thread we are attempting to get to why are the electrodynamics expressed by sugars/amino acids, minerals, water and proteins when arranged in a holographic geometry plus given an over-unity "kick start" able to replicate and grow and evoke a nervous system, eventually reaching a point when we can ask WHAT is it ALL about, why are we here and what are we solving or not solving by being..

A group was started (http://jandeane81.com/group.php?groupid=4), but not developed yet, specifically about understanding and working with energetics at a quantum holographic level.

It's an interesting technology having been developed and refined continually. Since about 1969 I first started working in the fields of bioenergetics, documentation and quantification of biofields as well as biomolecular communications. The group (http://jandeane81.com/group.php?groupid=4) is to get into understanding how to work with mind and electromagnetic holograms, to help to address energetic assault from different sources. Over the last 15 years of using this in various configurations, in short it is allowing people to have a way to control and balance their own bio-electronic holographic environment. As the technology works at the level of quantum, (at the point of information/concept formation), its interface into regular time-space is pretty much adequate to affect a working adjustable bio-balancing ..

Agreed so much to discuss and in such a short space of time.

Pris
28th December 2014, 01:29
It was very intense, for me. I felt I was having all my buttons pressed at the same time, and indefinitely.

There are lots of things I could try digging back up from my long term memory ( it was 1989 ! ). One of the main things that sticks with me is the thing about relationships. Most of us either start out with the intent, or sooner or later end up with the function, of using a relationship as a hiding place. A place where we can avoid dealing with the very things that are ultimately going to kill us.



There are a couple videos on the web site that are a tad hyper. Here's one that's more cerebral and in the frame of intellectual pursuit, NOT, ultimately what they are about, but it's how most people expect to learn about things.

The first 7m:50s are junk prepping time, best to skip it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=WwohrY51x24


Out of interest, I happened to find this: Charles Paul Brown dies in October at the age of 79 (one of the founders of PeopleUnlimited).

http://www.azcentral.com/story/news/local/scottsdale/2014/11/16/people-unlimited-scottsdale-charles-paul-brown-immortality/19152253/

Bob
28th December 2014, 01:42
Out of interest, I happened to find this: Charles Paul Brown dies in October at the age of 79 (one of the founders of PeopleUnlimited).

Wasn't immortal then.. Or experiencing life longevity either..

The interesting point mentioned in a few posts above, is STRESS.. WHICH is what the gene system uses to turn ON proper methods to deal with it. How much does the mind come to play? In post #5:


Whether or not a spiritual factor is involved to get to the place of figuring out the right frequency patterns is somewhat related to the thread, meaning the frequencies can be used to evoke the triggering, if one were able to sort out what GENE code means, in frequency space.

Assuming that an untrained mind can trigger the correct patterns - doubt that. BUT WHAT IF WE COULD??

So how are frequency patterns induced?

Biologically some rhythm changes - diet induced, life pattern change, chemical change, environmental factor changes..

Shock factor is a strong one, heat, chemical, or radiation, or emotional (physical shock such as massive cellular trauma is in a separate category)..

On come the appropriate subroutines to deal with the assault.. IF THE GENE CODE is intact and not damaged..

As soon as APOPTOSIS is turned on the repair mechanisms are destroyed, the cell is committed to death.. Is the whole organism tho? Not necessarily.. unless the overall quantities of apoptosis triggered cells exceed the amount of well functioning cells. There are many many cells in the body, each energetically radiating a field which is able to be monitored, depending on the function and the molecule being expressed.

So a person has learned to trigger mental stress to evoked a "cellular repair trigger", (shock mechanism repair),


It was very intense, for me. I felt I was having all my buttons pressed at the same time, and indefinitely.


that protocol obviously proved to be somewhat limited if the head practitioner of the organization succumbed at 79, not at the theoretical "program" value of 100..

Would it be better to use a better method than inducing trauma, or thinking good thoughts?

norman
28th December 2014, 01:58
Out of interest, I happened to find this: Charles Paul Brown dies in October at the age of 79 (one of the founders of PeopleUnlimited).

http://www.azcentral.com/story/news/local/scottsdale/2014/11/16/people-unlimited-scottsdale-charles-paul-brown-immortality/19152253/


I was wondering what happened to Charles, now I know why he's been written out of the script. He died !

I always had a problem with them as a "movement". I came home from there in tatters. Took me a few years to get over it. Now I know that I was, really, a fringe participant in a "cult".

However, as with a lot of cults, there are things one can take away from them, and digest for future reference.

As I watch them now, I can see how they are lost from something I've learned to be closer to since that time. They almost look like robots to me now. Their 'aliveness' is looking more and more like a demonic possession of some kind.

Babara mentioned plastic surgery and botox. I hadn't thought of that. She's probably right.

I'm not even looking for physical immortality. I wasn't then, either. I just tagged along with an ex girlfriend who made up her mind she wanted to go there. If I was making that decision again now, I'd stay home and let her go on her own.

oh, there was one big spinoff from it. During the time I was there, a big event happened on their calendar which a lot of the world's big shot healing community people attended. The basic idea was " how far can healing go ? if I heal one thing and die of another ". I saw quite a few healing 'experts' struggling with the limits of their own abilities and also recognizing stuff within themselves that limited them. Even so, at the time, I felt I was miles behind any of them. Jeez, I was still nipping outside to sit by the bins to have a smoke.



edit:

here's one little factoid that the cult message carried that is actually true:

“There are many cults on this planet, but the largest one is the cult of death.”

Bob
28th December 2014, 02:12
I'd kinda say the emphasis was look at the gene codes for finding the patterns.. The interpretation of the message got muddled probably.. I think the most important aspect seen to date is:

The cells are running with a dead-man's switch which needs to be turned OFF.. to stay alive..

It is turned off, if the gene code program continues to run with minimal flaws.. If the unkill message happens at the end of the circulating program, (due to a healthy cell with undamaged instructions), the cell resets, and lives, and the program starts back up again sequencing thru step by step, and living.. and reproducing and living...

During the aging, or stress excesses, damage happens, the UNKILL step never happens, and the predominant KILL sequence takes over..and gradually the growing older happens, as more and more information is lost..

Interesting negative programming logic, but a very unique fail-safe to deal with damage..

Pris
28th December 2014, 02:49
I was wondering what happened to Charles, now I know why he's been written out of the script. He died !

I always had a problem with them as a "movement". I came home from there in tatters. Took me a few years to get over it. Now I know that I was, really, a fringe participant in a "cult".

However, as with a lot of cults, there are things one can take away from them, and digest for future reference.

As I watch them now, I can see how they are lost from something I've learned to be closer to since that time. They almost look like robots to me now. Their 'aliveness' is looking more and more like a demonic possession of some kind.

Babara mentioned plastic surgery and botox. I hadn't thought of that. She's probably right.

I'm not even looking for physical immortality. I wasn't then, either. I just tagged along with an ex girlfriend who made up her mind she wanted to go there. If I was making that decision again now, I'd stay home and let her go on her own.

oh, there was one big spinoff from it. During the time I was there, a big event happened on their calendar which a lot of the world's big shot healing community people attended. The basic idea was " how far can healing go ? if I heal one thing and die of another ". I saw quite a few healing 'experts' struggling with the limits of their own abilities and also recognizing stuff within themselves that limited them. Even so, at the time, I felt I was miles behind any of them. Jeez, I was still nipping outside to sit by the bins to have a smoke.

All this information is very good for us to consider for interest's sake.

One thing that keeps coming up for me is the 'stress factor'. I do feel that stress plays a HUGE factor in aging. I'm not talking about healthy stress -- I mean unhealthy stress.

Healthy stress, for example, would be the stress that accompanies working on a creative project and having to overcome perceived limitations -- all from the mindset of being a powerful creator.

Unhealthy stress would be centred around fear and worry outside of myself... trauma... a sense of helplessness -- like my reaction to some perceived horrific event (like 911 [was it all Hollywood?]) or to some 'imminent world disaster' that will never happen.

I think I can describe what unhealthy stress feels like in my own body -- it's like a vice-grip that suddenly squeezes my heart. It's actually acute and painful.

Healthy stress is empowering and pulls me forward without any pain in my heart centre. There is a sense of urgency and feeling 'alive' in the moment. It's quite exhilarating. Time becomes irrelevant. Eating and sleeping often become secondary in importance. This isn't to say that lack of eating and sleeping is necessarily a good thing. When I am 'in the flow', I go with it.

We all go through creative cycles. When you require food and sleep, it will 'catch up' and your body will let you know.

Unrest

A FIERCE unrest seethes at the core
Of all existing things:
It was the eager wish to soar
That gave the gods their wings.

~Don Marquis

modwiz
28th December 2014, 03:01
All this information is very good for us to consider for interest's sake.

One thing that keeps coming up for me is the 'stress factor'. I do feel that stress plays a HUGE factor in aging. I'm not talking about healthy stress -- I mean unhealthy stress.

Healthy stress, for example, would be the stress that accompanies working on a creative project and having to overcome perceived limitations -- all from the mindset of being a powerful creator.

Unhealthy stress would be centred around fear and worry outside of myself... trauma... a sense of helplessness -- like my reaction to some perceived horrific event (like 911 [was it all Hollywood?]) or to some 'imminent world disaster' that will never happen.

I think I can describe what unhealthy stress feels like in my own body -- it's like a vice-grip that suddenly squeezes my heart. It's actually acute and painful.

Healthy stress is empowering and pulls me forward without any pain in my heart centre. There is a sense of urgency and feeling 'alive' in the moment. It's quite exhilarating. Time becomes irrelevant. Eating and sleeping often become secondary in importance. This isn't to say that lack of eating and sleeping is necessarily a good thing. When I am 'in the flow', I go with it.

We all go through creative cycles. When you require food and sleep, it will 'catch up' and your body will let you know.

Unrest

A FIERCE unrest seethes at the core
Of all existing things:
It was the eager wish to soar
That gave the gods their wings.

~Don Marquis

I agree there is healthy stress that moves us to creativity and action. I have been fortunate to have arranged my living situation to eliminate constant environmental stresses. Which in my experience largely results from being aligned with poor decision makers in my life. Much poor health is the result of a life of poor choices both emotional and dietary. When other are left to care for those results it is stressful, even if personally rewarding at some level for the person. When life intrudes with challenges from the void, it is usually a good stress that moves us forward in life and comprehension of it, IMO.