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jimmer
29th September 2014, 16:20
this 90s video may be a bit insider if you haven't read john keel's telling
of his early exploits, including his investigations into middle-eastern black magic,
in his first book, Jadoo.

in his early twenties, he struck out on his own, virtually broke, seeking great stories to tell –
finding them and more, along the way.

after discussing his early years in new york and then in the army,
he shows a film that brings to life some of his tales from those mysterious lands he traveled,
seeking the truths behind ancient 'black magic' or Jadoo.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ILjG35Ps-Mk&list=UUlaXlMoDfC6BX4tjiYo5sHw

Frances
1st October 2014, 10:50
http://www.sott.net/articles/show/229112-John-Keel-and-His-Adventures-into-Unreality

Interesting article about true paranormal stories that John Keel experienced.
The events that led up to J. Keel writing his book, "The Mothman Prophecies".
The book based on a true event which took place at Point Pleasant U.S.A.
Frances.

jimmer
1st October 2014, 12:50
http://www.sott.net/articles/show/229112-John-Keel-and-His-Adventures-into-Unreality

Interesting article about true paranormal stories that John Keel experienced.
The events that led up to J. Keel writing his book, "The Mothman Prophecies".
The book based on a true event which took place at Point Pleasant U.S.A.
Frances.

quite a big and lengthy find, frances.
can't wait to dig in.

jimmer
1st October 2014, 15:44
that is one heck of a read.
keel could have made a fortune writing
about high strangeness, but after the eighth tower,
he stopped.
throughout the rest of his life, he would become poor,
rich and poor again.
he found his own truth and stuck with it.

"[W]e do not know who we are or what we are doing here.
But we are slowly learning.
Once we begin looking beyond the mere manifestations we will finally glimpse the real truth.
Belief has always been the enemy of truth; yet, ironically,
if our minds are supple enough, belief can sometimes open the door."

I've got two of his earlier books to consume before I dig into 'the mothman prophecies,'
now sitting on my shelf.

what a mind to explore.

Frances
1st October 2014, 16:40
http://apmagazine.info/index.php/component/content/article?id=476

Link to Alternate Perceptions web site.
Article of an interview with Brad Steiger where John Keel gives an account of the manifestation of three men in black.
They manifested themselves into John's house.
Frances.

jimmer
1st October 2014, 18:09
touché, frances.

here's a 1973 interview with keel on the occasion
of a recent flap of UFO incidents. (http://members.tripod.com/~task_2/Wave-Keel.htm)

john really opens up and delves into his theory, in a big way.

"Collectively, American ufologists are ill informed and poorly educated in history, philosophy, and the behavioral sciences.
So they have failed to recognize what is actually happening (in contrast to what they think is happening)."

jimmer
1st October 2014, 18:27
last keel post today, promise. :eyebrows:

this is a nice article about keel, that explores why he just stopped. (http://mysteriousuniverse.org/2011/08/john-keel-father-of-modern-forteana-or-just-another-guy/)

here's a link to a website of keel's many personal letters, scripts, unpublished manuscripts and
other left behind artifacts that describe a person of wit and of the mind. (with some raunch thrown in : ) (http://www.johnkeel.com)

jimmer
6th October 2014, 14:41
this is an interesting keel factoid.

how did john keel's new york address correlate with the mount pleasant silver bridge disaster?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nK3FfOW1YEw

jimmer
6th October 2014, 15:01
dramatization of an actual letter john keel received as he investigated mount pleasant mothman case.
seems that keel was getting too close to something...

(it's funny. when I first watched the movie, mothman prophecies, I wasn't that impressed.
later, after hearing others discuss the movie, I watched it again and realized I must have nodded off somewhere along the line.
I missed half the movie and it's message.
a second wide awake viewing over the weekend was much more impressive, bordering on great.
keel's theories of what high strangeness is all about came through loud and clear from alan bates' performance.
'we are not meant to know.')


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xJhM5EdGT7k

I'm reading, operation trojan horse, his investigation into the heart of ufology and the mysteries of high strangeness.
mothman prophecies awaits on my shelf.

jimmer
6th October 2014, 15:16
john keel on 'intelligent lights' in the sky, how the mothman was named and
why he ultimately stopped investigating ufology. (he chokes up)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MJ16gZldFiQ

jimmer
7th October 2014, 17:11
here's a scratchy, yet quite good radio interview with john keel from 1992.

along the way:
will we ever figure this high strangeness thing out, what are crop circles and are ufos actually 'tricksters'?

keel implores someone to research and publish a compiled history of ufo researchers/sightings, so that every new generation has a baseline for further investigation.
currently, that book does not exist leaving each cycle with little context to understand where we are now. (keel did his own historical research.)

"...a much larger phenomenon than this extraterrestrial group."

feel free to advance past the intro stuff. (or not)
the interview begins at 5:26.
https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTl--ZyhxC2Hs8d84AGr6bwvZdT0JAxnNc3Buz0Xdo6kIBhqHD4lg
http://www.theparacast.com/darkmatters/JohnKeel.mp3

(be prepared to adjust your volume. the audio is a bit rough.)

jimmer
8th October 2014, 16:24
within a tribute letter upon john keel's passing, dr. steven mizracht condenses
keel's 'high strangeness' belief system in 5 points:

1
That the phenomenon might be ultra-terrestrial,
i.e. not so much originating from other planets, but possibly other dimensions of existence.
That in fact it wasn't really coming from somewhere else so much as something parallel to here.
Maybe around us all the time but not normally apprehensible to our senses?
Keel sometimes liked to say the phenomenon is much a part of our planet as the weather.
2
That the phenomenon had historical roots deeper than 1947.
The flying saucer era may have begun with Kenneth Arnold in 1947, but things that were called different things in earlier epochs,
such as Mystery Airships, or Foo Fighters, or Ghost Rockets, or just Strange Stuff in the Sky, might have been earlier manifestations.
In fact, Keel was so adamant on this that he devoted himself to debunking the Roswell obsession of many of his peers,
insisting that the Roswell incident was a Japanese fugu bomb balloon.
3
That the phenomenon seemed to respond to peoples beliefs.
Keel always cautioned people that Belief is the Enemy.
Certainly, it's generally a good admonition in general, given the damage dogmatism, fanaticism, and fundamentalism cause, in general.
But Keel was speaking about what seemed to be its adaptive nature, that it molded itself to peoples expectations.
Vallee suggested the same thing, except I think he leaned more generally to the Magonia school that peoples perceptions were molded by their culture,
which is why medieval people seeing the same thing as modern people called it angels, whereas we call it spaceships.
4
That one should be cautious of the UFOlogical establishment.
Keel in response to my letter to him sent one of his pamphlets lampooning the UFO people.
He said they had a diet too heavy in science fiction and everything was always being force-clawed into alien technology explanations.
They should look more at the history of religious apparitions, mythology, faeries, and folklore and realize they weren't dealing with something new.
Vallee often said the same thing. So did Carl Jung, way back in the 50s.
5
That the phenomenon was part of something that could be considered a control system.
Of course, I was always fascinated most of all by this subject.
Control for what purpose?
Forteans have always danced around this subject ever since Charles Fort opined in his tomes 'We are property'.
Vallee hinted that the control was more or less benevolent, perhaps for the betterment of our evolution.
Keel was always more pessimistic.
He saw manipulation.
I think he was at his most ascerbic in books like Disneyland of the Gods or the Eighth Tower.
Keel liked to discuss how the ancient gods seemed to manipulate human beings, pretty much treat us like cattle, serfs, puppets.
He didn't see the situation improving now that our new gods were the Ashtar Command and the Space Brothers.

keel's findings and beliefs were extremely unpopular amongst the ufology establishment, as you can imagine.
big picture: he was ostracized for life.
he didn't give a rip.
he solved the greatest mystery of all time.

swipe and read the entire letter here. it's quite good. (http://www.psiopradio.com/2009/07/psiop-radio-81-090712-farewell-to-fortean-john-keel-wguest-loren-coleman/)

jimmer
8th October 2014, 18:01
this is an image of the photocopy keel made of the original, contactee sketch of mothman.

http://i953.photobucket.com/albums/ae18/jimmerer/MOTHMAN1_zpsc02d61bc.jpg

http://www.johnkeel.com/?m=201105

Frances
8th October 2014, 18:01
I am enjoying this thread, John Keel is helping me understand a great deal.
I have Charles Fort's, Complete Books.
I have trouble reading it, it's just the way he writes. It makes a great reference book though.
John keel makes the paranormal more understandable.
Frances.

jimmer
8th October 2014, 18:18
I am enjoying this thread, John Keel is helping me understand a great deal.
I have Charles Fort's, Complete Books.
I have trouble reading it, it's just the way he writes. It makes a great reference book though.
John keel makes the paranormal more understandable.
Frances.

wow. how many books are we talking about?
how far back in history did Fort go with his long lost stories?

I read that Fort's system of recording his found oddities were 1 x 2-3" scraps of paper dumped into labeled boxes.
funny.

Frances
8th October 2014, 18:49
I have one very large thick paper back book by Charles Fort.
Its called the Complete Books Of Charles Fort.
It contains,
The Book Of The Dammed.
Lo!.
Wild Talents.
New Lands.

I bought it after watching One of Jordan Maxwell's presentations.
He mentioned it as being a book that explains all.
He was told to get the book during one of his paranormal experiences, of which he had many.
The presentations were in the good old days of Project Camelot with Kerry and Bill.
Frances.

jimmer
8th October 2014, 19:24
wow. how many books are we talking about?
how far back in history did Fort go with his long lost stories?

I read that Fort's system of recording his found oddities were 1 x 2-3" scraps of paper dumped into labeled boxes.
funny.

worth owning?

Frances
9th October 2014, 00:03
Worth owning?

Well for me John Keel explains it in a better form of writing.
I can ponder the mysteries without more puzzles. I don't need more puzzles.
I want some clarity and truth.
I probaby will not get it but its all worth a try, at the moment anyway.
Frances.

jimmer
9th October 2014, 15:42
here's an excellent keel interview leading to the release of his movie.

at this point, john wasn't feeling well, yet he gave it his all.
at some point, john snaps at the interviewer for badgering :eyebrows:
(later, the audio gets messed up, speeds up and slows down, eventually correcting itself. don't freak out.)

his last statement is pretty telling as to the lingering residue of his mothman experience.
https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTl--ZyhxC2Hs8d84AGr6bwvZdT0JAxnNc3Buz0Xdo6kIBhqHD4lg
http://radiomisterioso.com/tag/john-keel/

jimmer
9th October 2014, 16:41
Well for me John Keel explains it in a better form of writing.


are you reading or have read him?
if so, which one(s)?
I'm into 'operation trojan horse.'
if begins comparing (in detail) two big ufo flaps: 1967 v. 1897
fascinating research into the never ending story.
that's where I'm at now.

Frances
9th October 2014, 17:29
I am nearly finished The Eighth Tower, it's not a Large book so I am taking my time with it.
I want to read more of his work and my Christmas list contains titles of his other books.
So I am looking forward to some winter reading.

This thread with his interviews and articles is giving me a better grasp of the paranormal, so when I come to read
J. Keel's books I hope I will have a better understanding.
I think I may get The Mothman Prophecies DVD so I can see the things I missed first time round.
Frances.

jimmer
9th October 2014, 17:34
I am nearly finished The Eighth Tower...

how's that cranium doing, frances :eyebrows:
part 3 is astounding, heady stuff.

samos
9th October 2014, 17:56
I thoroughly enjoyed The Eighth Tower.... working on a second reading, almost back to back. this time I've been doing some fact checking online from all the countless astounding stories he mentions. I imagine his networking system was much more difficult back then. newspaper clippings and phone calls, getting out and beating the path. His fortean chronicles are amazingly accurate. so many challenging and ridiculed his work... he showed the truth, plain as day... it was a bitter pill for many. you know, here at TOT, we are all a little bit of Forteans. :-)

jimmer
9th October 2014, 18:09
you know, here at TOT, we are all a little bit of Forteans. :-)

or is it now, 'keelean' :eyebrows:

if keel was actively researching today, he'd have a field day.
n-o-o-o problem.

the stories connected to the nationwide flap on 1897 are riveting and über odd.
he spent lots of time researching the book, operation trojan horse
and didn't get a penny of royalty. (from the last posted interview)
it didn't sell. it didn't fit the popular paradigm.
stupid humans ; )

keel knew. others blinked.

Tribe
9th October 2014, 18:11
on jimmers recommendation i have brought the eighth tower and really wanted to read it straight away but then thought my husband would love it too, so ive saved it for part of his christmas present , i of course wil get to read it after he has lol !

samos i agree . i love a bit of forteana :) x

jimmer
9th October 2014, 18:31
spoiler alert: the eighth tower

as keel summarizes his unified theory he mentions the big (for the time) sci-fi film,
forbidden planet, as accurately dealing with origins of the things that go bump in the night. (or forest : )

morbeus experiences a slight taste of a higher, ancient power.

the krell are the ultras.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CrZagvsP3o0


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IYFr3UyVpRA

jimmer
9th October 2014, 18:35
on jimmers recommendation i have brought the eighth tower and really wanted to read it straight away but then thought my husband would love it too, so ive saved it for part of his christmas present , i of course wil get to read it after he has lol !
samos i agree . i love a bit of forteana :) x

be sure your hubby doesn't spoil it for you, tribe.
you've got to read it first-hand.
second-hand is cheating :eyebrows:

Spiral
9th October 2014, 19:07
be sure your hubby doesn't spoil it for you, tribe.
you've got to read it first-hand.
second-hand is cheating :eyebrows:

Quite a salesman you've turned out to be ;)

Half the forum is buying John Keel books !

jimmer
9th October 2014, 19:23
Quite a salesman you've turned out to be ;)
Half the forum is buying John Keel books !

could be the start of something big :eyebrows: (I love this frickin icon)
john would be proud.

have you read it, spiral? if so, whadaya think?

nice halloween icon. sc-c-c-ary

jimmer
9th October 2014, 19:36
ok, this is for all we new found keeleans. (an adjunct to order of the fortean : )

linda moulton howe investigates a super case of ultra high strangeness, 2006.

as we listen, have fun applying keel's theory to what this boy experienced.
from outer space or somewhere much closer?

asked if they came from someplace in outspace, the witness said,
'I don't know where they came from.'
https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTl--ZyhxC2Hs8d84AGr6bwvZdT0JAxnNc3Buz0Xdo6kIBhqHD4lg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fLVDB1Gd2ow
(so dense, it's worth two listens)

Spiral
9th October 2014, 19:55
could be the start of something big :eyebrows: (I love this frickin icon)
john would be proud.

have you read it, spiral? if so, whadaya think?

nice halloween icon. sc-c-c-ary

Only read chapter one so far & its very good indeed, we have got major thunderstorms forecast so I should have a lot of reading time over the next several days as we have to unplug everything to stop it being blown up !

Thanks for all the JK material you have dug up, there are few who can or will go beyond "spacemen from distant planets" he is up there with John Mack in my books.

jimmer
9th October 2014, 19:59
wait until you get to the big, big, big concluding part III
(on that day, be sure to have eaten your wheaties ; )

jimmer
10th October 2014, 14:34
if you're hankering to know more about john keel, his background, his experiences, what made him tick,
check out this lengthy, wide-ranging, transcibed interview. (http://drdavidclarke.co.uk/about/the-john-keel-interview/)

warm-up your text to speech machine. it's big.

"Then when I turned sixteen I got so bored with school
because in this town’s school there were no courses left for me to take.
I took all the science courses in one year,
courses that were considered the toughest courses,
chemistry and physics and so on."

"When I was living in New York as an eighteen year old,
I was living in a furnished room and I woke up one night
and the whole room was bathed in this very peculiar light.
I thought the building was on fire!
... a flood of material was coming into my mind,
and suddenly I understood everything."

jimmer
10th October 2014, 15:28
from the john keel tribute site: (http://www.johnkeel.com)

John printed up many different business cards over the years, most of them with a distinctive Keelian twist.
Visitors to this site who haven’t read Jadoo may be puzzled by the subtitle affixed to John’s name above.
Let me quote from page 159, where our author is trying to get a visa extension from a hostile bureaucrat in Delhi:

“Suddenly there was a bellow of deep, booming laughter in another office. The young man reappeared.

“‘Follow me please.’

“He took me into a narrow, dimly lightly room where a huge man with sparkling eyes sat with his feet on the desk. He jumped up and shook my hand.

“‘You are the American who does the rope trick?’ he asked, grinning.

“He picked up my card from his desk — calling cards are much in vogue in India — read it over again, sat down with a crash, and rocked with mirth.

“I had a hundred of these cards printed up for two rupees bearing the legend: John A. Keel — Not an authority on anything.

“‘Wonderful! Wonderful!’ he cried. ‘You’re the first American I’ve ever met who wasn’t an ‘expert’ on something!'”

That broke the ice, and the visa was extended.

http://www.johnkeel.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/JAKCARD1.jpg

jimmer
10th October 2014, 16:01
here's an outreach to we TOTers.
does anyone have the capability to download torrent files and post them?
the reason I ask is that on January 24, 2002, Art Bell, for the first time, interviewed John Keel.
I've found only two YT posted segments of that full interview.
After researching the full interview file (for 2 days) and after contacting the webmaster at
Art Bell's Dark Matter site, it looks like the owners of C2C have that show, locked up.
the only way to listen to that keel-historic interview would be through torrent collections of past C2C shows.
I do not have that capability.

for now, here are those two and only two segments.
the first, loren coleman introduces art to john's career and the mothman saga (while promoting his book).
the second, john comes on, slow at first and then it takes off like old friends, only to abruptly end. ouch.
fun, nonetheless...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SWlbUJ8Q_AQ

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YD4uRzOAy94

jimmer
11th October 2014, 15:08
not to get too mothman-ed out, this 13 month flap is one of the best
documented high strangeness cases in history.
this one had it all: ufo sightings, a bizarre ominous bird-like creature, MIB, a stranger named Indrid Cold
and what about all those mysterious phone calls and the prophecies...

if you are curious, this seems to be the best documentary I could find.

It features john keel and is not narrated by stacy keach for the history channel ; )


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YsMmBaqsZ5o

jimmer
11th October 2014, 17:43
ok, let's go all the way...

audio interview with woodward derenberger on first contact with the nefarious, indrid cold.

"We mean you no harm."


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5HxY4suVjSo

from woody's book, visitors from lanulos, john keel provided its forward.
(many of the the comments to this post are very interesting) (http://www.johnkeel.com/?p=73)

the indrid cold craft (recreation)
http://strangedigest.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/05/lanulos2.jpg

jimmer
12th October 2014, 14:56
1 in a never-ending series: applying the keel theory

for our first case, let's revisit a previously TOT posted case of ufo high-strangeness -- alien pancakes.

http://jandeane81.com/threads/2460-Ufo-Pancakes?p=17758&viewfull=1#post17758


now, here's an article about this über strange, ultra out-there case,
directly attaching its explanation to the ultraterrestrial theory shared by Valle and Keel.

http://www.ufoevidence.org/Cases/CaseSubarticle.asp?ID=973

http://www.theironskeptic.com/articles/Simonton/Pancake.jpg

1 down.

jimmer
12th October 2014, 15:23
2 in a never-ending series: applying the keel theory

from a recent Ria post on the thread: UFOs – Throughout The Ages with Stephen Mera
http://jandeane81.com/threads/4293-UFOs-–-Throughout-The-Ages-with-Stephen-Mera

One of the earliest of documented sightings of aerial phenomena took place on April 4, 1561 at dawn over Nuremberg, Germany.
(note: the descriptions of the aerial objects were not of a technology or look the could not have related to that time period.
they only saw things they could imagine and relate to, as fantastic as this display was.)

http://altereddimensions.net/2012/nuremberg-germany-ufo-battle

http://www.thelivingmoon.com/49ufo_files/04images/Reports/Woodcutting.jpg

jimmer
13th October 2014, 14:49
who was the 'father' of modern ufology?
keyhole? no.
adamski? no.
kenneth arnold? no chance.
it was an impish publisher named, ray palmer.

swipe and read john keel's telling of how it all started and took off. (http://www.softcom.net/users/falconkam/manwho.html)

In 1947, the editor of Amazing Stories watched in astonishment
as the things he had been fabricating for years in his magazine suddenly came true!

http://www.softcom.net/users/falconkam/fatetwo.jpg

mojo
13th October 2014, 16:10
wow thats a neat magazine cover, is there a place to read the article? never mind I see the links...:)

jimmer
13th October 2014, 16:19
looks like it's still published. (http://www.fatemag.com)

http://www.fatemag.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/The-UFO.jpg

jimmer
13th October 2014, 20:18
3 in a never-ending series: applying the keel theory

the case of david adair and the 'symbiotic engine.'

the story of a genius engineer's trip to area 51 in order to inspect
an engine, seemingly from another realm.
he believed the engine was capable of reading his thoughts.
there's lots more...

is this object extraterrestrial or from the ultra-imagination,
transmorgrified to marvel and inspire. (read: clark's black monolith)

think about all the aerial displays throughout history.
we are only shown what is just beyond our grasp.
teasing, prodding and playing to see what we make of it.
(or am I off-base?)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jqhLO4RZgdo

jimmer
18th October 2014, 15:06
some say that john keel would 'elaborate' or even 'concoct' some of his material.

let's see how keel described the ' ufo pancake case (http://jandeane81.com/threads/4277-John-Keel-Adventurer?p=34463&viewfull=1#post34463),' from the book, 'operation trojan horse:' (text to speech machine warning) :eyebrows:

"Consider the case of poor Joe Simonton and his outer-space pancake.
It's a classic of the negative factor.
Simonton, a sixty-year-old chicken farmer outside of Eagle River, Wisconsin, said he heard a strange sound outside his farmhouse at 11 A.M. on Tuesday, April 18, 1961. He looked out of the window and was startled to see a silvery metallic machine descending in his yard. As he stepped outside, some kind of hatch slid open in the upper part of the object and three dark-skinned men became visible. He estimated that these men were about 5 feet tall and between twenty-five to thirty years of age. They wore clinging dark-blue uniforms with turtleneck tops and had on apparently knitted headgear, such as is worn under crash helmets. All were clean-shaven, and none of them spoke during the brief episode that followed.

"One of them stepped to the hatch, Simonton said, and held out a shiny bucket-like affair which had a handle on either side, indicating that he wanted the farmer to fill it with water. Simonton took it, filled it from his pump, and returned it to the silent man. He noticed that the interior of the craft was black, "like wrought iron , " and that one man was busy at some kind of instrument panel, while the other was working at what seemed to be a stove. A pile of pancakes sat nearby. Simonton says he gestured at the pancakes, and the man with the bucket turned, picked up four of them, and handed them to him. He then attached some kind of rope to his belt, and the hatch slid shut. Joe Simonton stood with his mouth open, four warm pancakes in his hands, as the object, which had been humming throughout, began to make a sound like "tires on a wet pavement" and rose slowly into the air, moving off to the south. At about that same time, an insurance agent named Savino Borgo was driving along Highway 70, about a mile from Simonton's farm, when he saw what he later described as a saucer rising diagonally into the air and flying parallel with the highway.

"Eagle River is in a thinly populated section of northern Wisconsin, just a few miles south of the Michigan border and surrounded by forests and small lakes. About a month later, on May 25 , there was a widespread power failure throughout the area that also affected local telephone service. On February 24 of that year a B-47 bomber had crashed near Hurley, Wisconsin, about sixty miles northwest of Eagle River. Another B-47 crashed on May 2 only two miles from the site of the February accident. The pilot of the second plane was later quoted in the press as saying that, "I felt this weightlessness-I was hanging by my straps, " just before his craft went out of control and headed for the ground. There were numerous other incidents and UFO sightings in the area during thatperiod-which was the "lull" from 1959 to 1963.

"So once again we have a series of sightings and incidents that corroborate an unusual story. But, unfortunately, we also had those four miserable pancakes. Simonton turned one over to a local judge named Carter who, incidentally, vouched for his honesty and reliability , as did everyone else who knew him. Dr. J. Allen Hynek was given the second one, and a third went to the National Investigation Committee on AerialPhenomena, which turned it over to a New York researcher, Alex Mebane. Simonton held onto the fourth one. He said he took a nibble out of it, and "it tasted like cardboard. "

"Were the pancakes made out of exotic Martian mush? Of course not. They were plain old cornmeal, salt, and hydrogenated oil . Simonton's story got a big play in the national press, and NICAP capitalized on the publicity by issuing statements about their "thorough investigation" which was "under way , "etc. But when the press interest died, NICAP dropped the whole thing. The Aerial Phenomena Research Organization investigators stuck with it, however, and when an Eagle River businessman made a joking reference to Simonton having been hypnotized (he later denied this), some leaped on that as the explanation. Cecile Hess, APRO's man in nearby Rhinelander, Wisconsin, didn't buy the hypnotized theory. "If I ever saw a sincere and honest man, it was Simonton," Hess commented.

"If it happened again, " Simonton told a UPI reporter in early May, "I don't think I'd tell anybody about it. "

"Simonton was a bewildered victim of the artifact game. Scores of contactees have been given pieces of junk metal , scraps of paper, and, in many cases, chunks of crystal or tektites (pieces of glass). The contactees display these materials almost proudly as proof of their experiences. One would assume that outright hoaxsters would try to construct better, more impressive, artifacts to support their stories of encounters with the wonderful "space people. "

this is a single report out of literally hundreds that keel unearthed that shaped and supported his 'ultraterrestrial' theory.
so, not only did keel accurately relate the strange facts of this specific case, he also uncovered unreported correlating events that support
the fact that these events actually happened and that they are completely unexplainable, supported only by his über trickster thesis.
well done, keel.

http://www.theironskeptic.com/articles/Simonton/Pancake.jpg

jimmer
18th October 2014, 15:47
what is the keel 'ultraterrestrial theory' you ask?

from a conclusive post from a fellow truth seeker: (http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread653665/pg1)

"John Keel was the author & researcher to originally coin the term "Ultraterrestrial"
What Keel had to say about Ultraterrestrials and exactly what his theory speculates is as follows :

• They may be composed of energy, inhabiting the spectrum (wavelength,visible light spectrum) of energy in which we cannot see.

• They may have evolved on this planet, though they are far older than the human race.
(The jinn fit this criteria perfectly, the hidden ones)*

• They feed off of humans, though the implication is energy/life force based and not physical.
Keel uses the phrase "cattle of the gods" when referencing humans as a food source for these otherworldly entities.

• They are telepathic. They have the ability to manifest psychic phenomena
(Some abductions I believe are not physical at all but could actually could be psychic in nature.
Psychic/Spiritual abductions,attacks,contacts./Etheric body being violated during abduction?)

• They can temporarily take form or substance which they use to interact with humans.
('Cosmic' trickster?skinwalker /shadow people/obvious shape-shifting ability?)

• Their origins may not be extraterrestrial in nature at all, instead, Extraterrestrials are merely a 'mask' they wear.

• They are not Demons, as most religious people would interpret them as.
The reason why is because 'Demon' is just another form they masquerade as, angels fall into this category as well.

• They are responsible or could be the cause for all paranormal phenomena.
(ie: Bigfoot, shades, shadow people, aliens, poltergeists, fairies, angels & demons, lake monsters & sightings of other mysterious creatures.)
[See 'Our Haunted Planet' & 'UFOs: Operation Trojan Horse' by John Keel]

and there you have it. a summary of the keel high strangeness unification theory.
challenge yourself and compare all the extreme ET cases we've followed at TOT to this theory and see what you find.
it's not so much ET, as it is UT (http://www.unexplained-mysteries.com/column.php?id=65181). :eyebrows:

*
the Djinn or jinn was not part of keel's original thinking.
he described the 'source entity' as being ancient, pure energy and omnipotent.

jimmer
18th October 2014, 18:50
from 1957 – was this the first 'Indrid Cold'?
the case of Valiant Thor.
(this case is well know to many TOTers, yet in this new keelian context, worth a re-examination)

as you'll see the contactee (you guessed it, dr. stranges) had extensive decades long contact with this entity,
much like keel's point pleasant witness, woodward derenberger, from the mothman prophecies case.

coincidence? fables? high strangeness? masquerades?
absolutely, food for thought. yum.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tytnOJSNrqE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PJBplLLT4zA
bonus round: whistleblower, Phil Schneider, tells what he knows.
Val's brother, Don Thor, predating Val's arrival.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=33w5pWAzMY0

http://elnuevodespertar.files.wordpress.com/2011/07/val-thor.jpg

jimmer
20th October 2014, 15:50
since the 70s, Jacque Vallee, french computer scientist, has been linked to john keel's ultra-high strangeness theory.
back in 1978, Jerome Clark, assoc. editor at Fate Magazine, interviewed Vallee.

listen to this exchange as Vallee lays out his belief that ETH (extra terrestrial hypothesis) is something bigger, stranger. (http://www.fatemag.com/from-the-archives-vallee-discusses-ufo-control-system/)
(this is the link to the interview)

Clark: ...When I asked you if there was such a thing as a solid, three-dimensional flying saucer,
I was thinking in these terms: Let’s suppose that somebody says he has seen a UFO, the bottom part of which was flat and circular.
He says he saw the object come down, settle on the soil and then fly off again, leaving a flat circular impression.
Doesn’t that clearly suggest the presence – at least for the duration of the sighting –
of a solid object whose physical structure was more or less as the witness perceived it?

Vallee: Not necessarily.
We have evidence that the phenomenon has the ability to create a distortion of the sense of reality or to substitute artificial sensations for the real ones.
Look at some of the more bizarre close encounter cases –
for example the incident from South America in which one man believed he had been abducted by a UFO
while his companion thought he had boarded a bus which had suddenly appeared on the road behind then.

jimmer
21st October 2014, 18:00
this is an interview with john keel protege, andy colvin.
andy has compiled several collections of keel's writings
and along the way has become a contemporary keelian expert.

I didn't hold much hope for this conversation, but I was nicely surprised
by the depth and background into keel's many beliefs.
during the interview, andy relates that it was keel who first
broke the cattle mutilation strangeness back in the early 60s,
how keel was 'followed by a phenomena' ever since his mothman investigations
and that he feels that this entity rubbed off on him and others.

this conversation is dense, highly informative and a real treat. (worth a second listen)
https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTl--ZyhxC2Hs8d84AGr6bwvZdT0JAxnNc3Buz0Xdo6kIBhqHD4lg
http://hiddenexperience.podbean.com/?s=john+keel

jimmer
22nd October 2014, 14:43
here's another incident from keel's research: the grinning man. (from the book, strange creatures from time and space.)

is this entity one in the same -- the creepy Indrid Cold? (http://skeptoid.com/episodes/4367)

as you'll read or hear, this skeptical author investigates keel's grinning man accounting and isn't impressed.
and it goes to show, often keel had to rely on witness accounts alone, with no physical evidence.
(keel developed a keen sense, deciphering authenticity from claptrap)
keel looked for historical trends.
I bet this grinning man incident would nicely reside in his 'elemental' hypothesis.*
https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTl--ZyhxC2Hs8d84AGr6bwvZdT0JAxnNc3Buz0Xdo6kIBhqHD4lg
http://ec.libsyn.com/p/4/f/9/4f95f4f9cdcd178e/skeptoid-4367.mp3?d13a76d516d9dec20c3d276ce028ed5089ab1ce3d ae902ea1d06c9843ed9c15d5af7&c_id=5775316

* from the book, operation trojan horse.

mojo
22nd October 2014, 14:58
Jacque Vallee, french computer scientist, has been linked to john keel's ultra-high strangeness theory
... intriguing especially since Dr. Nolan told me of Vallees link to Bigelow Space program. He's definitely on the cutting edge of some science happening. So many secrets...but why?

jimmer
22nd October 2014, 15:15
... intriguing especially since Dr. Nolan told me of Vallees link to Bigelow Space program. He's definitely on the cutting edge of some science happening. So many secrets...but why?

vallee believes (as did keel) that the real ET link is the ID, within our consciousness.

wouldn't it be interesting if vallee and bigelow were investigating contact through the subconscious?
this is still the final frontier.

wonder if vallee has discussed any of his bigelow work?
(bet it's all Top Secret)

and btw: while I welcome others to visit and converse here, I consider this to be my own private thread,
until the time it's ripped from my greasy keelian mitts!!! :eyebrows:
(of course, I jest)

mojo
22nd October 2014, 15:19
we can be almost certain that it is top secret...and I did notice you were passionate about this thread....;)

jimmer
22nd October 2014, 15:31
we can be almost certain that it is top secret...and I did notice you were passionate about this thread....;)

I'm thinking about formally seceding this thread from TOT, until everyone else becomes sane like me:victorious:
(I jest again, of course)

jimmer
22nd October 2014, 19:23
so, what is jacque vallee doing with bigelow aerospace?

from 2005, this vallee white paper may provide the answer.

swipe and read* how vallee and associate take it to the SETI radio wave 'orthodoxy'
and prescribe a '6 layer' approach to new ET exploration.
and yes, he goes there -- embrace the paranormal.

while not a tiptoeing through the tulips,
this breakthrough scientific model outlines and prescribes how ET contact gets to the next level.

would the US government be interested in this? probably not.
would bigelow? I bet so.

all of this embraces keel's belief system and plays to his wheelhouse.
for years, he called for fresh thinking scientific analysis of this high-strangeness field of research.
at the time, few listened.

"Science fiction has familiarized us with the concept of machines (or beings)
projecting an image of themselves that systematically confuses observers.
One could imagine that [they] represent physical craft equipped with
the means to interact both with the surrounding atmosphere
and with the senses of observers in such a way
as to convey a false image of their real nature."


http://www.jacquesvallee.net/bookdocs/Vallee-Davis-model.pdf

* to use text to speech, you may need to click on the link below the posted pdf and read it in a separate browser window
or download it to your computer. worth the trouble. it is quite good.

samos
23rd October 2014, 01:02
Further down, you will find some interesting observations John Keel had made about events/dates, throughout his research.
An introduction to 'Wednesdays Phenomena'...From the webpage, Technoprophecy Special Project.

Love this thread, jimmer :thup:


Keel along with J. Allen Hynek and Jacques Vallee became an influential albeit controversial force within the UFO community in the late-sixties and seventies arguing for the paraphysical hypothesis to the UFO puzzle.


Wikipedia quotes Keel who wrote, "I abandoned the extraterrestrial hypothesis in 1967 when my own field investigations disclosed an astonishing overlap between psychic phenomena and UFOs... The objects and apparitions do not necessarily originate on another planet and may not even exist as permanent constructions of matter. It is more likely that we see what we want to see and interpret such visions according to our contemporary beliefs."


Continuing to quote Wikipedia, "In UFOs: Operation Trojan Horse Keel argues that a non-human or spiritual intelligence source has staged whole events over a long period of time in order to propagate and reinforce certain erroneous belief systems. For example, the fairy faith in Middle Europe, vampire legends, mystery airships in 1897, mystery aeroplanes of the 1930s, mystery helicopters, anomalous creature sightings, poltergeist phenomena, balls of light and UFOs. Keel conjectures that ultimately all of these anomalies are a cover for the real phenomenon."


The Mothman Prophecies chronicle the 1966-67 encounters with an anomalous winged entity in Point Pleasant, West Virginia. In his investigations, Keel discovered what he labeled the "vital clue" - that a link exists between Mothman and the UFOs he and others witnessed appearing concurrently in and around Point Pleasant.


Keel argues strongly for the paraphysicality of UFOs, that is, that the objects are not composed of solid matter. Quoting from Mothman, "They are transmogrifications of energy under the control of some unknown extradimensional intelligence."


Keel theorizes the UFO/paraphysical phenomenon manipulates the electromagnetic spectrum and something he describes as the "superspectrum".


In both Trojan Horse and Mothman, Keel uncovers a fascinating curiosity he called "the Wednesday phenomenon".


It is to the Wednesday phenomena that we now turn your attention.


I began seriously thinking whether Keel's discovery of the Wednesday phenomenon represented true reality, or whether it too was a camouflage fostered by the UFO phenomenon.


What exactly is the Wednesday phenomenon?


The Wednesday phenomenon simply stated is that the greatest number of UFO sightings take place on Wednesday - about 20%. That percentage, says Keel, is "well beyond the laws of chance and averages."


Keel goes further - "the best time to see a UFO [is] 10PM on a Wednesday."


Keel is even more specific...


"So if you are eager to see a genuine example of our phenomenon, pick a good Wednesday or Saturday evening, visit the highest ground in the area closest to you which has a magnetic fault, and watch the sky around 10PM. The best times are the last two weeks in March and the first two weeks in April, all of July-August, the last two weeks in October, and the first weeks in November and December."


The following are a few more relevant quotes by Keel.


"UFO events seem to occur century after century in the same geographical locations. A majority of these events took place on Wednesdays and Saturdays and were concentrated around the hours of 6 P.M., 8 P.M., and 10 P.M. These facts in themselves are proof that the phenomenon is guided by an intelligence and that the individual events form part of a larger plan."


"The Wednesday phenomenon is quite evident in the historical events as well as in the contemporary sightings. A disproportionate number of UFO events seem to be concentrated on Wednesdays and Saturdays, particularly the landing and contact cases. The frequency of the Wednesday-Saturday events immediately removes the phenomenon from a framework of chance or coincidence. After I discovered this basic pattern in 1966-67, other researchers checked it with their own data and verified it. Historian Lucius Farish uncovered a number of early statements and cases which further indicated that this Wednesday phenomenon had been observed and reported upon long ago. In Myth and Legend of Ancient Israel, by Angelo S. Rappaport, the following statement appears:

Concerning "demons": They lodge in trees, caper bushes, in gardens, vineyards, in ruined and desolate houses, and dirty places. To go alone into such places is dangerous, and the eves of Wednesday and Saturday were considered dangerous times. Agrath [daughter of the she-demon Makhlath] commands hosts of evil spirits and demons and rides in a big chariot. Her power is paramount on Wednesdays and Saturdays, for on these days Agrath, the daughter of Makhlath, roves about in the air accompanied by eighteen myriads of evil spirits."


"If the UFO phenomenon had a purely psychological basis, then there should be more sightings on Saturday night when more people are out of doors, traveling to and from entertainments, etc. Instead we find that the greatest number of sightings are reported on Wednesday, and then they slowly taper off through the rest of week."


"Psychic and occult events seem to follow the same cycles as the UFO phenomenon. The Wednesday-Saturday phenomenon exists in all the frames of reference. For some reason, the twenty fourth days of April, June, September, November, and December seem to produce exceptional activity year after year. It is probable that manifestations are dependent upon unknown conditions which have an electromagnetic basis."


There it is in the last quote! Lets read it again. Keel said, "Psychic and occult events seem to follow the same cycles as the UFO phenomenon."


If that last statement is taken as the hypothesis, and part of the cycle that is common between UFO and paraphysical events is the Wednesday phenomenon. Then the hypothesis can be tested statistically and brought up to date.


If the Wednesday phenomenon holds, then perhaps the paraphysical hypothesis to the UFO puzzle can be substantiated with a very strong statistical inference.


For why would UFO events appear side-by-side in the same time sequence pattern as paraphysical events unless a relationship exists between the two frames of reference?


That is the million dollar question...

jimmer
23rd October 2014, 13:29
excellent and most welcomed research into the keel principles, samos.
the more we look into his thinking, the more the 'unknown' makes sense.
light bulb on, stuff.

keel was not a scientist, allowing many ufologist to knock him.
he was an observer, cataloger, analyzer and keen objective thinker,
challenging the norms when required and not caring if feathers were ruffled.

he had the gumption to take on the entire established ufo-field thinking, because he proved them wrong.
and many thought he was a genius for it, while an equal part did all they could to discredit him for rocking their very core.
before OTH came out, the ETH (extra-terrestrial hypothesis) was all the rage.
it had become dictum.
the release of OTH launched a war of words that really hasn't ended to this day.

below is a link to two book reviews of Operation Trojan Horse (1970).

as you will read, keel was either a genius or a misguided dufus.
the battle lines were drawn.

today, we see that same thing going on in the sasquatch research field --
the clash between establishment 'bigfoot hunters' and the sentient-being believing, 'habituants.'
and so it goes.

at the page top, a positive, glowing review.
at the page bottom, a very negative review.
(I challenge anyone to read the latter and not laugh. you'll see what I mean.)

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51X0R1JX24L._SL160_.jpg

http://magonia.haaan.com/2009/oth/

mojo
23rd October 2014, 17:01
Bravo Jimmer on the posts...

jimmer
23rd October 2014, 17:14
Bravo Jimmer on the posts...

what's your opinion on all of this, mojo?

crackpot or crack-on?

jimmer
23rd October 2014, 17:30
if you read the previous posted book reviews of keel's Operation Trojan Horse
and thought that Alan Sharp's thoughts were at least nasty
or more like simply scientifically crazy with hate,
would you be interested to read john keel's response?

if so, below is a link to archived back and forth correspondence,
first directed to the editor of the leading british ufology magazine of the time
and later directed at his brit nemesis, alan sharp.

as you'll read, after OTH was released,
ufologist throughout america attempted and succeeded to ban keel
from many of their publications, organizations and events.

sounds much like what sasquatch ontario's mike paterson is currently confronted with.

http://magonia.haaan.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/johnkeel.jpg

http://magonia.haaan.com/2009/keel1/

mojo
23rd October 2014, 20:54
Jimmer crack-on!....;)

An interesting article written by Eric & Jaques.

Here's 3 of the more interesting points wanted to touch on.

1.
No experiment can distinguish between phenomena manifested
by visiting interstellar (arbitrarily advanced) ETI and intelligent entities that may exist near
Earth within a parallel universe or in different dimensions, or who are (terrestrial) time
travelers.

Wonder if the research at the Skinwalker ranch brought this new change in studies?

2.
Kuiper (1977) and Freitas (1980) suggest that ETs/UAP visiting Earth would find it necessary
to hide themselves from our detection mechanisms until they have assessed our technological
layer or potential threat and hazards. They would employ an adaptive multi-layer risk program
to avoid danger. Low observable stealth such as simple camouflage through mimicry, which
works well in nature, may be the technique of choice for visiting UAP/ETI experienced in
surveillance (Stride, 1998).

This hypothesis is totally inline with my observations. They definitely use mimicry andhave total situational awareness of the location they are performing current studies/contact at.

3. their conclusion:

The question then becomes: to what
extent are these effects evidence of a purposeful action of the operators? To answer this
question, and to test more fully the hypothesis that UAP phenomena are both physical and
psychic in nature, we need much better investigations, a great upgrading of data quality, and a
more informed analysis not only of the object being described, but of the impact of the
observation on the witnesses and their social environment.

Would love to see success in the mission but unfortunately feel the infighting in the field of paranormal research will hinder working together. And his last sentence if we use Youtube as a guide, there is no real effort to contact & gather witness obsevations from contactees/abductees so not sure how Jacques would reply about his own conclusion?

Frances
23rd October 2014, 22:23
If the Wednesday phenomenon holds, then perhaps the paraphysical hypothesis to the UFO puzzle can be substantiated with a very strong statistical inference.

The above text is taken from Samos post No 55.

Just seen The Bob Lazar video.
He said the test flights for the flying saucers at Area 51 were on Wednesday nights 8pm.
Frances.

jimmer
24th October 2014, 14:00
I've done extensive searches on anything related to
vallee's involvement with bigelow aerospace. zero results.
we can only speculate as to what he has or is doing there.

sticking with the vallee/keel connection, here are two audio files
on a vallee interview with george knapp on the subject of
pre-industrial aerial phenomenon. (before modern aviation)

this subject is pure keelian – a major aspect of his breakthrough research.

https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTl--ZyhxC2Hs8d84AGr6bwvZdT0JAxnNc3Buz0Xdo6kIBhqHD4lg
part one (https://ia600601.us.archive.org/9/items/CoastToCoastOct242010Hour1/Coast%20to%20Coast%20-%20Oct%2024%202010%20-%20Hour%201.mp3)

part two (https://ia600601.us.archive.org/9/items/CoastToCoastOct242010Hour1/Coast%20to%20Coast%20-%20Oct%2024%202010%20-%20Hour%202.mp3)

jimmer
24th October 2014, 14:21
If the Wednesday phenomenon holds, then perhaps the paraphysical hypothesis to the UFO puzzle can be substantiated with a very strong statistical inference.

The above text is taken from Samos post No 55.

Just seen The Bob Lazar video.
He said the test flights for the flying saucers at Area 51 were on Wednesday nights 8pm.
Frances.

there does seem to be some sort of historical pattern or predicability to sightings and encounters.
before keel there were other historical researches, writers that found the same redundancy.
(from the 1800s and back to biblical times. it's in OTH, not sure where to find that at this point. : )

jimmer
24th October 2014, 14:34
here's some insight into keel's intensive research
and its personal backwash.
this may be why he 'stopped the clock'. (from OTH)

"While traveling through some twenty states to check firsthand the innumerable UFO reports, I was astonished to find many silent contactees, and while the physical descriptions they offered were varied, it quickly became obvious that they were all suffering the same physiological and psychological symptoms. Through these silent contactees (people whose stories have never been published) I actually entered into communication with the entities themselves. When a UFO would land on an isolated farm and the ufonaut would visit a contactee, he or she would call me immediately and I would actually converse with the entity by telephone, sometimes for hours. It all sounds ridiculous now, but it happened. My notes, tapes, and other materials testify to the fact...

I developed an elaborate system of checks and balances to preclude hoaxes. Unrelated people in several states became a part of my secret network to that mysterious "other world. " I wasted months playing the mischievous games of the elementals, searching for nonexistent UFO bases, trying to find ways to protect witnesses from the "men in black. " Poltergeist manifestations seemed to break out wherever I went. It was difficult to judge whether I was unwittingly creating these situations in some manner, or whether they were entirely independent of my mind.

Now, in retrospect, I can see what was actually taking place. The phenomenon was slowly introducing me to aspects I had never even considered before. I was being led step by step from skepticism to belief to-incredibly-disbelief. When my thinking went awry and my concepts were wrong, the phenomenon actually led me back onto the right path. It was all an educational process, and my teachers were very, very patient. Other people who have become involved in this situation have not been so lucky. They settled upon and accepted a single frame of reference and were quickly engulfed in disaster..."

Frances
24th October 2014, 14:51
Operation Trojan Horse. John Keel.
I don't have that book yet, it's the next book I intend to buy though.
Frances.

jimmer
24th October 2014, 15:34
it's his breakthrough introduction to the keelian high-strangeness theory.

quite an exhaustive inquiry.
lots of historical accounting.
it blew the doors off conventional ufology when first published.
you'll dig it, frances.
and in someways, this should be everyone's first introduction to keel.
looking back, starting with 'the eighth tower' is like a child diving into the deep-end of the pool. :eyebrows:

jimmer
24th October 2014, 20:49
ok, let's get scientific with it.

as keel believed, this 'it' omnipresence resides in a portion
of our electromagnetic spectrum, far above our own frequency.
he called it, the superspectrum,.

what is our relaxed brain's natural frequency, you might ask?

7.83 Hz, the same resonant frequency as our planet earth. (http://www.schumannresonator.com)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B7DiOB8E5Zc
this is not a test to see how long you can listen to this. :eyebrows:
it is fascinating to think that we are naturally connected to this planet's
'living frequency'. (another keel belief -- our planet is an living entity.)

turn the volume down a bit, relax, breathe deeply and and let it wash over you.
how do you feel after a minute or so?
me, I think I lost a couple of pounds, which is nice.

jimmer
25th October 2014, 16:11
this is one of the best expressions of john keel's life story.
extracts from several of his books help to create this portrait
of a man in his prime, toiling the details, finding those truths,
while being true to himself.

"In the white condition the object can traverse distances visibly,
but radical maneuvers of ascent or descent require it to alter its frequencies again, and this produces new color changes.
In the majority of all landing reports, the objects were said to have turned orange (red and yellow) or red before descending.
When they settle on the ground they 'solidify,' and glow red again.
Sometimes reportedly they turn a brilliant red and vanish.
Other times they shift through all the colors of the spectrum, turn white,
and fly off into the night sky until they look like just another star."

https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQGeBO0q5NXj-r2TrLov53iUkJwTCeXaAXCbJMQyidBsDCxI-Ni

http://thecid.com/ufo/articles/articles/keel.htm

samos
26th October 2014, 03:29
this is one of the best expressions of john keel's life story.
extracts from several of his books help to create this portrait
of a man in his prime, toiling the details, finding those truths,
while being true to himself

Thanks Jimmer,

Here's John Keel in 1991, participating in a Fortean Panel Q&A, sharing some of those 'unpopular' truths.
To his credit, JK always kept a sense of humor, despite it all....


http://youtu.be/XUUbkSekrJk

jimmer
26th October 2014, 15:17
too bad there were 'other' panelist involved :eyebrows:

you those who want more keel, here's a compilation of various
keel events and presentations.

being john keel...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hPY0CcAmHNY

just finished OTH.
on to the mothamn prophecies.
relish.

jimmer
26th October 2014, 16:43
in one of the above compiled clips (41:00), keel said that one of the all time, greatest ufo hoaxes were the MJ 12 papers.
many at the time called keel a crank.

this excellent openminds.tv documentary uncovers the document's purported origins, naming names. (lots of names : )
it's a tangle, convoluted tale. stick with it...

so, was keel (who came to his conclusion decades before this new information surfaced) correct or a crank? (or simply a freaking genius?)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3mhRLKuJWyg

jimmer
27th October 2014, 17:59
halloween special:

are extraterrestrial entities actually 'demons'?

"Attending my first UFO lecture with Fortean Researcher John A. Keel on UFOs
who wrote the book “Operation Trojan Horse” I had a chance to talk with him privately.
I asked John, “Who are the aliens flying UFOs?” He simply explained that,
“After years of research he had come to the conclusion, they were Demons.”
anonymous

I'm a bit skittish with the demon term.
let's called this concept, the tricksters.
(now, that's better ; )

as we don our halloween costumes and adjust our alien antennae,
should they actually be horns?

nonetheless, this mini-documentary, base on jacque vallee's book, messengers of deception, is very interesting.

happy halloween. (boo)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=glvgAvlwA9c

Spiral
27th October 2014, 19:18
are extraterrestrial entities actually 'demons'?

"Attending my first UFO lecture with Fortean Researcher John A. Keel on UFOs
who wrote the book “Operation Trojan Horse” I had a chance to talk with him privately.
I asked John, “Who are the aliens flying UFOs?” He simply explained that,
“After years of research he had come to the conclusion, they were Demons.”
anonymous

I'm a bit skittish with the demon term.
let's called this concept, the tricksters.
(now, that's better ; )



I find his conclusion somewhat of a let down, still not finished The Eight Tower yet though.

jimmer
27th October 2014, 19:31
I find his conclusion somewhat of a let down, still not finished The Eight Tower yet though.

this entire thread should have a spoiler alert plastered all over it.
sorry, if this was a buzz kill, spiral.
of course, there's a bigger picture coming in the book's grand, final finalé :eyebrows:

mojo
28th October 2014, 00:34
Very thankful to have met some benevolent beings. And, can personally attest to this helping in my spiritual walk. And will be forever grateful to themfor that.

jimmer
28th October 2014, 13:08
Very thankful to have met some benevolent beings. And, can personally attest to this helping in my spiritual walk. And will be forever grateful to themfor that.

yes, from what I've read, there are good and bad, these tricksters.

keep on the good foot, mojo.

I believe it has to do with intent.
keep it clean, be honest and request protection, as you express your non-aggressive good will.
in the grand scheme of things, that's all we can do.

as always, this life continues to fascinate; its mysterious.

jimmer
28th October 2014, 16:59
this post complements a recent entry on, Bigfoot Vocalizations 2.

for your perusal, the work of cryptozoologist, JC Johnson.

early on JC was introduced to high-strangeness through his
multi-year, exhaustive investigation of a ufo crash in arizona's high desert.

since then, JC has broaden his investigations to all things unexplainable.

some say he's the 'indiana jones of cryptids'.
other's might call him 'keelian' for his broad gathering of tales of the unexplained (without the theory, at least for now) :eyebrows:

from a question on his YT page:

jimmer hardy
JC, are you aware of or have read, john a. keel?
your use of the 'ultraterrestrial' term tells me you have. yes?

JC Johnson
John had things pretty well figured out before his passing.

here's his personal tale of high-strangenes – a 'black eye child' type individual encountered along a dry, dusty road.
note his use of the term, ultraterrestrial.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K70xe0NTT_s&list=UUZv-VflCB-aCEvzHoarhjZg

now, check this out...this encounter shook this guy to the core.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lHyBQOfGEWE&list=UUZv-VflCB-aCEvzHoarhjZg&index=4

we will follow the exploits of his keel aficionado, JC Johnson.

mojo
29th October 2014, 01:59
Jacques states a good fact early on when mentions nobody goes out and talks/interviews witnesses anymore....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ib2h0sElUro

jimmer
29th October 2014, 13:13
from JC Johnson:

Published on Sep 25, 2012
A family is terrorized by a creature that resembles a character from the movie "Jeepers Creepers"
- and several other potential phenomena.

listen to the description of this entity, this skinwalker.
sounds akin to keel's 'bird,' the mothman.
wait for the clawed footprint images.
they believe this a physical entity.
JC isn't so sure.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c1l6Dj0UE2M&list=UUZv-VflCB-aCEvzHoarhjZg

I've invited JC to review our forum.
we'll see if he has the time or inclination.

jimmer
29th October 2014, 16:36
Jacques states a good fact early on when mentions nobody goes out and talks/interviews witnesses anymore....

vallee seems to be the most 'authoritative' voice on ufos and ultras, today.
good to see him getting involved again.
he laid off for years. at least, publicly.

jimmer
29th October 2014, 18:49
http://theouteredgeradio.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/07/JC_banner1.jpg

if you'd like to listen to this recent interview with JC Johnson, click here. (http://theouteredgeradio.com/an-old-friend-joins-us-on-the-outer-edge/)
the podcast listening interface is found below the introduction text.
the interview begins at the 33:13 min. mark.
along the way, listen to JC's description of a 'man in black'.

mojo
30th October 2014, 14:56
More on Jacques Vallee...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pVdpSi7OFoc

jimmer
30th October 2014, 20:58
going through the trove of JC Johnson video documents,
check out what was captured one night.

a bright light...

that's one mysterious area, somewhere in arizonia's high-desert.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XZ60vOGLjWM&index=38&list=UUZv-VflCB-aCEvzHoarhjZg

jimmer
31st October 2014, 18:15
here's a C2C interview that centers on john keel's mothman investigation.
a long delayed documentary, Dark Wings, looks like it's ready to come out
with the help of nephilim researcher, LA Marzulli.

these conversations get into the nitty-gritty of what keel was really into around that
once sleepy town, point pleasant, w. virginia.

good stuff as we re-discover a time when the tricksters came to play.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BEsbexezqpQ

a note: this recently uploaded interview must have taken place by in 2009.
the documentary production company went bust, after pre-selling plenty of dvds.
lots of customers were bilked.)

jimmer
31st October 2014, 19:58
here's a thought:

documentaries, a creatively constructed OK film, books have all
been produced to tell this true story when all hell descended on a small town --
and didn't go away.

here's the big idea, why not make an accurate dramatic film, true to keel's tale?

john keel's mothman.
(or how about: john keel: the bird)

if so, who would play the main characters?

john keel -- michael fassbender

reporter, mrs. mary hyre -- cathy bates

woodrow derenberger -- woody harrleson

(that's a good start. who else in case they aren't available : )

composer -- hans zimmer (that's in stone)

this will be a spine-chiller.

the final scene (as an epilogue):

keel sits slumped in his crumpled soft chair staring through his new york apartment shadows.
it was quiet.
it was dark.
his stare is cast blankly.
he needs to quiet his mind.

it creeps up on you, he thought.

his hands rise to prop up his sagging head.
it was dead quiet.

all those people, he thought.

a siren erupts, the phone's clatter shatters the silence.

keel does not flinch.
he remains motionless.
he is determined not to listen.

and with a shutter, the long since disconnected phone speaks in a low and metallic-like rasp,

'john --- is that you?'

cut to black.

(a bit of creative license to project what john keel had gotten himself into. it never left him.)

jimmer
1st November 2014, 16:48
from this link, swipe and read the extended story of indrid cold and woodrow derenberger,
told in woody's own words. (http://ufoexperiences.blogspot.com/2005/06/i-met-man-from-another-world.html)

"Mr. Derenberger, look at me.
I am the same as you are.
I sleep, and breathe and bleed even as you do."

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_LvJt_6rMM70/TLNrE4WiVtI/AAAAAAAAADA/8w7THzrXe_Y/s1600/imagesCA62NL6P.jpg

jimmer
3rd November 2014, 15:14
keel has referred to the ultraterrestrials as the 'tricksters'.
residing in the superspectrum, these entities work within a difference sense of time,
seeing where we've been as they see what is to come in our reality.
they've always been there, as they rule our roost, either in benevolent healing or leading ways or
the converse, keeping us off balanced and on guard.

here's a blog interview with author / professional researcher george hansen,
discussing his book, 'the trickster and the paranormal' and more.
interesting stuff.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yk_3qlEryrE&list=UUlyXbwSLGyETt9WhUizK7qA

Frances
3rd November 2014, 20:03
Links to cases mentioned in video.
Lawrence Coyne Military Comander.
Involved in a near miss in his helicopter with a "big grey metallic looking object".


http://www.ufocasebook.com/coyne.html

Eddie Doyle Webb Truck Driver.
Blinded for several hours after an encounter with a bright light or aluminium object in the air.


http://members.tripod.com/~task_2/Wave-Oct03a.htm
Frances.

Frances
3rd November 2014, 20:09
http://youtu.be/xILjwQaixjk

Cash Landrum incident.
Video 6:30
3 witnesses left with symptoms of radiation poisoning following a late night encounter with a UFO.
Frances.

jimmer
3rd November 2014, 20:33
Cash Landrum incident.
3 witnesses left with symptoms of radiation poisoning following a late night encounter with a UFO.
Frances.

the cash landrum incident was something physical and something that didn't make any sense.
just a bizarre incident. those poor people.
blasted, radiated by microwaves, I suspect.

and the airforce picked up on it as well, attempting to contain or shoo it away.
I recall in the richard hall, 'alien-human mutilation' documentary,
a covert nato unit being the used to contain and/or clean-up after incidents.

nice digging, frances. *

* I need to review the interview again for this and your other finds. fascinating.

jimmer
4th November 2014, 11:04
http://youtu.be/xILjwQaixjk

Cash Landrum incident.
Video 6:30
3 witnesses left with symptoms of radiation poisoning following a late night encounter with a UFO.
Frances.

turns out, through boyd bushman, that the cash landrum incident was one of 'ours.'

listen to david sereda's statement at the 45:25 min. mark.

http://jandeane81.com/threads/4494-Boyd-Bushman-His-Last-Interview?p=36767&viewfull=1#post36767

jimmer
5th November 2014, 14:00
4 in a never-ending series: applying the keel theory

you may have previously heard this, but in this keelian context, it's worth another listen.
does keel's theory apply here?

linda moulton howe interviews an anonymous witness
who, for decades, has been in contact with a mysterious 'alien entity'.

listen to his testimony:
interdimensional, witness physical paralysis, harsh warnings of a bleak future, his subtly impression that they are from another dimension.

sounds like this person is describing contact with the ultraterrestrial presence. no? :eyebrows:

SORRY. LMH HAS HAD THIS VIDEO OVER COPYRIGHT CLAIMS


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T1XfgurEtCw&list=WL&index=122

jimmer
6th November 2014, 14:52
5 in a never-ending series: applying the keel theory

another interesting contactee interview from LMH.

in the first segment, listen to this long held, secreted away interview,
as this ex-CIA fellow describes his encounter with an alien.
question is – an off-world, extra terrestrial or an ethereal, interdimensional entity?
listen what happens when the entity is asked, 'are you possessed by a demon?'
(the rest of the show is interesting, including experiences with infrasound.)

SORRY. LMH HAS HAD THIS VIDEO OVER COPYRIGHT CLAIMS


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9mu-10lOIUs&index=123&list=WL
listen hard to 'cooper'. I bet LMH's late 90s contactee was this guy :eyebrows:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DN5QX-BljUY

jimmer
6th November 2014, 20:15
relating to john keel's opinion that the MJ12 documents were phony* (http://jandeane81.com/threads/4277-John-Keel-Adventurer?p=36051&viewfull=1#post36051),
listen to this paracast from 2009 with two ex-military guys who
know the inside story on the purported disinfo agents, richard doty and robert collins.
this is a twisted tale that gets pretty harsh.

doty is also believed to be involved in, if not the originator of,
the project serpo story (man / alien exchange, 1965-1979).
https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTl--ZyhxC2Hs8d84AGr6bwvZdT0JAxnNc3Buz0Xdo6kIBhqHD4lg
http://www.theparacast.com/podcasts/paracast_090524.mp3

* keel came to this conclusion after reading them.
he never had any insider information.

http://www.philipcoppens.com/mj12_03.jpg

jimmer
7th November 2014, 16:02
if you listen to the previous post, the interview on the MJ12 disinfo,
you heard lots of linda moulton howe discrediting.

fact is, she has become the go-to person for disclosure.
has she been compromised by those who want to create confusion?
yes. but she's still the best, even if contaminated by unsavory sources from time to time.

here is a whopping 4 hour presentation.
(eventually, LMH gets into the serpo incident)

knowing that she's such a high-strangeness lightning rod,
watch all the enlightening, bizarre and baffling stories she has to tell (many of them very keelian, I might add) :eyebrows:

SORRY. LMH HAS HAD THIS VIDEO OVER COPYRIGHT CLAIMS


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dGwZil_NKb0&list=WL&index=126

jimmer
11th November 2014, 15:37
6 in a never-ending series: applying the keel theory

here is the incredible case of george van tassel.

george, an accomplished aircraft mechanic and flight inspector for douglas aircraft,
was contacted by 'space people' and provided advanced technical information.
he soon left his profession and devoted the rest of his life to these other-worldly pursuits.

the question is, were his contacters off-planet or something else?
was he in touch with an ultraterrestrial existence?

as you listen to van tassel, you'll see a thoughtful, intelligent man
whose life path veered into the twilight zone, never to return.

his largest achievement, the 'integratron', never worked. *

was van tassel a vessel of advanced off-planet intelligence or a tool of the tricksters?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qq_viSR2Yhs

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vHX5tapTUrQ

here is a life magazine pictorial of van tassels 'giant rock' home and ufo convention center. (http://www.messynessychic.com/2014/06/12/the-1950s-flying-saucer-conventions-at-an-underground-rock-house/)


http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/d2/Integratron_with_trees.jpg/220px-Integratron_with_trees.jpg

*
The Integratron is a structure designed by George Van Tassel
claimed to be capable of rejuvenation, anti-gravity and time travel.

Spiral
11th November 2014, 17:26
Wowzers jimmer, I hope I can catch up on all that information !

Very nearly finished the 8th Tower, may do so tonight, this was posted today by Dutchsinse.....high strangeness to those who know their Keel...

11/10/2014 -- Russian capital Moscow shrouded in toxic gas mixed with fog -- 1st hand video


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6vb6VrlU_0k

jimmer
11th November 2014, 17:43
Wowzers jimmer, I hope I can catch up on all that information !

Very nearly finished the 8th Tower, may do so tonight, this was posted today by Dutchsinse.....high strangeness to those who know their Keel...

11/10/2014 -- Russian capital Moscow shrouded in toxic gas mixed with fog -- 1st hand video

what, no frogs falling from sky?
very keelian of you spiral. :eyebrows: (I know this icon's code by heart)

jimmer
14th November 2014, 13:34
7 in a never-ending series: applying the keel theory

here is the story of howard menger.
a soft spoken pillar of his community.
trusted. honest. intelligent. a rock solid friend to those who knew him.
and a contactee who, for the rest of his life, would work to get his story out.

click through to watch this YT autoplay of 5 parts.
while briefly touching on other contactees george van tassel and daniel fry,
this documentary concentrates on menger's story.
what pulls these contactees together is the messages they recieved and shared.
at first they were provided information that seemed bonafide.
as they gathered more messages, the more convoluted, misleading and meaningless it got.
this contactee 'scenario' has been repeated throughout recorded history.

in reality, something did touch these individuals.
they touched it. they photographed it. they were changed for life.
but what was it? from another planetary system or something even stranger?
that is the big question we should be asking.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7myEjjbuPYU&list=PLCA80FCDF68E361CA

http://s.hswstatic.com/gif/ufo-hoax-090.jpg

(you might note, that mid-third segment,
howard 'perceives' his moon travel timeline as 8 days.
upon return, he didn't need to shave.
then notice his ambivalence as to how he traveled.
he questions whether he actually left earth at all.
in his eyes, you can see the confusion.
and if he never actually left earth,
how did those moon photos get on his camera?)

mojo
17th November 2014, 03:13
Hi jimmer, thought you might like to know that Jacques wants to come here for a visit..Its been so quiet for weeks and I mentioned that, so maybe it will happen if the activity picks up, otherwise it would not be so much fun for him... Myself, hoping to visit the Patterson Ranch which I know he might be able to hook that up for me...when more develops will share it...;)

jimmer
17th November 2014, 13:24
Hi jimmer, thought you might like to know that Jacques wants to come here for a visit..Its been so quiet for weeks and I mentioned that, so maybe it will happen if the activity picks up, otherwise it would not be so much fun for him... Myself, hoping to visit the Patterson Ranch which I know he might be able to hook that up for me...when more develops will share it...;)

well, that's interesting, mojo.
bet you can't talk too much about any of this, at this stage.

what is the patterson ranch known for?
I can't place it.

and yes, please keep us as up-to-date, as you can.

from what I've read, keel believed that 'it' was more malevolent (the tricksters),
while vallee believes it's more benevolent, more angelic.

perhaps the truth is somewhere in between.
seems that everything projects a balance.
the yin and yang of things.

if this is true, then how can we really 'trust' any contact to be meaningful?

the 'trust bar' must be necessarily set very high. :eyebrows:

mojo
17th November 2014, 14:51
Ye, a good thing to consider...it's also known as Skinwalker...

jimmer
17th November 2014, 15:15
Ye, a good thing to consider...it's also known as Skinwalker...

oh, the skinwalker ranch, aka, the sherman ranch, aka gorman ranch
(right down the road from JC Johnson's turf).

in this keelian context, check out geoge knapp's presentation
of this experiences, in 2 parts.
it ends abruptly, but riveting stuff, nonetheless. (click through to view them)

so were these mind crunching events ET or UT?

knapp: "this a ufo story, but not really."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=myUI5JNPubo#t=36

mojo
17th November 2014, 15:51
lol my bad patterson ranch was Charles Mansons...;)

jimmer
17th November 2014, 16:04
lol my bad patterson ranch was Charles Mansons...;)

oh, cross cataloging on us : )

for those who want more, here's a podcast interview with knapp on area 51. (http://www.skinwalkerranch.org/images/paracast_090315.mp3)
along the way, the vallee 'them' theory is discussed.

here's an interview with the scientist, colm kelleher, who conducted the NIDS research of the skinwalker ranch. (http://www.skinwalkerranch.org/videos/BOAA118.mp3)

jimmer
17th November 2014, 16:41
8 in a never-ending series: applying the keel theory

from a time when howard menger was busy with his contacts,
comes the lost in time, dr. daniel fry story.

it's a story of an intelligent, trusted military man who comes in contact with humanoids, 'beings who originated on earth.'
they came with the usual message -- how to survive our impeding doom.

sit back, light up and enjoy ; )


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J9BEHzXctQ4&index=127&list=WL

here is a student of daniel fry's experiences offers a further analysis of 'the white sands incident.'


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ubbulIENZFw&list=WL&index=128

jimmer
20th November 2014, 12:35
long before art bell dominated the high strangeness airwaves,
there was new york radio personality, long john nebel.
his show, party line, was the late night place to be back then,
with guess like john keel and an assortment of latter day ufo
witnesses and researches, including the likes of
george adamski, daniel fry, george van tassle, on and on.

sit back and let's join that new era ufo hysteria, already in progress...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=in7TLqC-sbw&index=129&list=WL

jimmer
20th November 2014, 15:37
here's an interview with the 'keeper of keelian,' andrew colvin.
he has been busy compiling john keel's hard to find, diverse writings in books, like –
Searching for the String (a fun and instructive read)
let's see what he has to say...
https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTl--ZyhxC2Hs8d84AGr6bwvZdT0JAxnNc3Buz0Xdo6kIBhqHD4lg
http://wdtrg.blogspot.com/2014/01/andrew-colvin-on-mothman-john-keel-and.html
(click on the audio player beneath the post's title)

jimmer
22nd November 2014, 16:07
I found this 90s transcribed interview with Jacque Valle.
Like John Keel, Vallee, after years of research,
came to the conclusion that what was believed to be visitations
from other worlds, was more like a clash of our reality with another, unknown consciousness.

"The UFO phenomenon exists.
It has been with us throughout history.
It is physical in nature and it remains unexplained in terms of contemporary science.
It represents a level of consciousness that we have not yet recognized,
and which is able to manipulate dimensions beyond time and space as we understand them.
It affects our own consciousness in ways that we do not grasp fully,
and it generally behaves as a control system." (http://www.ufoevidence.org/documents/doc839.htm)
(this quote is the link to the interview)

Vallee really gets into the 'nitty gritty' in Part Two of this interview.

grab your cup of coco, breakout your 'text to speech' machine and dig in.

jimmer
22nd November 2014, 17:30
9 in a never-ending series: applying the keel theory

I bet you've heard of the 'brazil roswell case.'
another credible witness is forever bedeviled by contact.
it didn't end well for him.

now, in this keelian context, review this portion of the story,
particularly beginning at 31:30 mark. (clipped link below)

"Take it easy. We are not going to do you any harm."

sound familiar?
(variations of this statement have been repeated throughout the ages)

http://youtu.be/pn8VtAth1co?t=27m56s

http://img.youtube.com/vi/jevTMNn3Zgk/0.jpg

if you aren't familiar with this 'brazil roswell case', watch it all.
quite an excellent documentary.

Spiral
22nd November 2014, 18:32
I found this 90s transcribed interview with Jacque Valle.
Like John Keel, Vallee, after years of research,
came to the conclusion that what was believed to be visitations
from other worlds, was more like a clash of our reality with another, unknown consciousness.

"The UFO phenomenon exists.
It has been with us throughout history.
It is physical in nature and it remains unexplained in terms of contemporary science.
It represents a level of consciousness that we have not yet recognized,
and which is able to manipulate dimensions beyond time and space as we understand them.
It affects our own consciousness in ways that we do not grasp fully,
and it generally behaves as a control system." (http://www.ufoevidence.org/documents/doc839.htm)
(this quote is the link to the interview)

Vallee really gets into the 'nitty gritty' in Part Two of this interview.

grab your cup of coco, breakout your 'text to speech' machine and dig in.

Great find Jimmer, if it is 90's its very late 90's because he talks about the Heavens Gate cult :chrs:

jimmer
22nd November 2014, 19:00
Great find Jimmer, if it is 90's its very late 90's because he talks about the Heavens Gate cult :chrs:

hello, spiral.
the wikipedia reference link shows 1993.
"Interview: Heretic Among Heretics: – Jacques Vallée (1993)"
there's no date on the article itself, so not sure.

I think there's a lot to this quote:

"In some cases," he says, "the community of ufologists may simply be used in a sociological experiment
because they are a convenient group of people to test, to see how they react to different rumors."

question is, who are the sociologists?
us, them or both?

Spiral
25th November 2014, 16:27
*facepalm*

I just re read that interview & it was the Order of the Solar Temple, not Heaven's Gate so that makes the date 1995 if it's a year later as stated because the suicide mentioned was in '94


According to Vallee, the French press has recently reported that the notorious Order of the Solar Temple--in the news last year after 53 members committed suicide in Switzerland and Canada--

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_the_Solar_Temple#Mass_murders_and_suicide s

The ideas expressed by Vallee & Keel are making more & more sense to me, not just of what I have read but of what I have experienced & it also goes a long way to explain certain people in the UFO "community" & the stories & ideas they are SO keen to implant in our minds.

I wish that Church was still around, I would love to know what he makes of it all after his experiences.

One has to wonder if any extra terrestrials have ever visited Earth at all :frantic:

jimmer
25th November 2014, 17:32
The ideas expressed by Vallee & Keel are making more & more sense to me, not just of what I have read but of what I have experienced & it also goes a long way to explain certain people in the UFO "community" & the stories & ideas they are SO keen to implant in our minds.

I wish that Church was still around, I would love to know what he makes of it all after his experiences.

One has to wonder if any extra terrestrials have ever visited Earth at all :frantic:

spiral, you are having the same epiphany as me.

I've racked my knowledge of ufology, applying the theory and it always rings true.

how many years have we dutifully watched video, read accounts, waiting for something meaningful to occur.
all these really interesting, enticing stories, photos, sightings and nothing comes of it.
every witness / contactee I've read or learned about ends up the same way:

some extraordinary contact event
message reveals some plausible or accurate information
witnesses life changes
more messages that turn out to be bogus
witness devotes life to message
witness ends up confused, angry and lost.

look at the contactee cases posted on this thread.
they all end up the same.

we are not experiencing intelligent off-world contact.
we are being contacted by a trickster element of unknown origins.
keel was on it.

Frances
25th November 2014, 17:37
My thoughts have also been plodding down that road. Tricksters of unknown origins.
Frances.

Frances
25th November 2014, 17:55
I am sure we have noticed the parralel between Sinzzer's and 717seethelight's posts.
Would I be correct in thinking it was John Keel who said a lot of these sightings of orbs and lights happen near water.
Frances.

jimmer
25th November 2014, 18:05
My thoughts have also been plodding down that road. Tricksters of unknown origins.
Frances.

yes, frances, the mystery has only just begun.

but who is the next keelian?

keel broke the code. what next?

reading one of the articles in 'searching for the string'
keel examines the accepted theory that electromagnetic fields
are the reasoning behind UFO related mechanical disruptions.
stopping engines and like.
he lays out the case that it must be something else.
he believed it is something that interferes the flow of electrons.
he called it the 'molecular paralysis effect.'
something far more crazy than the widely accepted magnetic influences.

jimmer
25th November 2014, 18:07
I am sure we have noticed the parralel between Sinzzer's and 717seethelight's posts.
Would I be correct in thinking it was John Keel who said a lot of these sightings of orbs and lights happen near water.
Frances.

yes, either ley lines or water or mineral rich areas (or combinations).
he called these areas, windows.

samos
27th November 2014, 02:58
Here is a link to a site called 'Some Gems from Operation Trojan Horse'..

A collection of highlights, experiences and philosophy of Mr. John Keel.
If you don't have time for the book, this synopsis is an excellent read.


http://www.chodesh.info/ufos-operation-trojan-horse-gems.htm

jimmer
27th November 2014, 12:47
Here is a link to a site called 'Some Gems from Operation Trojan Horse'..

A collection of highlights, experiences and philosophy of Mr. John Keel.
If you don't have time for the book, this synopsis is an excellent read.

this excerpt illustrates keel's disdain for the accepted 'alien' über intelligence.
keel believed the UTs were not that smart, faking it by being able to see our future –
through predictions or prophecies, acting god-like to us. playing us for all we're worth.

"If they are the product of a superior intelligence with an advanced technology,
they seem to be suffering from faulty workmanship.
Since 1896 there have been hundreds of reports in which lone witnesses
have stumbled onto grounded hard objects being repaired by their pilots.
In flight, they have an astounding habit of losing pieces of metal.
They seem to be ill-made, always falling apart, frequently exploding in midair.
There are so many of these incidents that we must wonder if they aren't really deliberate."

jimmer
27th November 2014, 13:20
from 'keeper of keelian,' andy colvin, comes this little ditty.

here's a brief encounter of the keelian-kind.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SZ_gb1XNMSE

jimmer
27th November 2014, 13:39
here's an article about the release of the rather new compilation
of john keel magazine articles, letters and newly uncovered bits,
'searching for the string.'

I'd love to excerpt some of the most revelatory bits,
but there are no references online, yet
and I just can't bring my self to transcribe from the book.

the forward is an obscure gray barker article that
showcases a conversation he had with keel,
when john privately revealed his theory,
well before it was formalized anywhere.

these are the writings, research revelations and correspondence that led to his meme shaking books.

http://www.examiner.com/review/searching-for-the-string-with-john-a-keel

http://cdn2-b.examiner.com/sites/default/files/styles/image_content_width/hash/13/61/136173ad2cc959a0a6717f010f9b9611.jpg?itok=mHplPwB7

jimmer
27th November 2014, 15:20
before I run to family and general glutteny,
here is a back and forward with doug skinner,
keel's friend and owner of the john keel website (http://www.johnkeel.com):

read the real reason why keel's contracted article for playboy was rejected:

doug,
by any chance is john’s first foray into ufology, that playboy article, available?
I’d love to read it.

thanks very much for this site and your dedication.

jimmer


John did keep a draft of the article, although I don’t know if it was the final draft.
It’s too long to post here; in fact, it was too long for “Playboy.”
It’s just a summary of all the familiar UFO cases up to that time, with little of John’s personality or interpretation.
It was before he started doing primary research.

I had posted some of the correspondence between John and “Playboy,” showing how the article grew to unmanageable size,
and the editors’ final rejection of it.
A lot of that got wiped when this site was hacked a while ago.
I may have to repost it.

John’s first foray into ufology was actually a radio script he wrote for the American Forces Network in 1952;
fortunately, both a script and recording have survived.


yes, doug, please repost whatever you can leading to and any excerpt of that now famous,
never published article that led JAK to the field and eventually his ‘theory.’

I understand this would be a lot of work, but could you
find a way or someone to digitize that AFR recording,
post it to youtube and post that link here?
that would be a big hit.
thanks again for your response and keeping this all alive
and accessible to we new comers to keelian.

I'll keep you up-to-date if and when that interview comes available.

jimmer
28th November 2014, 15:28
recently there has been some interest in the keel theory,
so I thought I'd link a post from the thread, We are the Experiencers.

it lays out the basis for the theory and welcomes all to read, The Eighth Tower.
in hindsight, I'd recommend first reading his first book-form presentation
of his ultraterrestrial theory in, Operation Trojan Horse.

http://i953.photobucket.com/albums/ae18/jimmerer/ScreenShot2014-11-28atNovember-28-2014917AM_zps8388d647.jpg (http://jandeane81.com/threads/4046-We-Are-The-Experiencers?p=32138&viewfull=1#post32138)

(click on this image to read the post)

lookbeyond
29th November 2014, 05:36
Sorry to b a pain in the you know, but does anyone hav a link to obtain "The Eight Tower" for free? I found a link on Hurrits book thread at PA however when i joined it said i need a license and at the next page my computer put up a warning re danger ahead, thanks lb

ronin
29th November 2014, 05:38
this one lookbeyond?

http://galaksija.com/literatura/eigth_tower.pdf

lookbeyond
29th November 2014, 05:41
You are a sweetie Ronin, the pdf is The Cosmic Question- would that b the same as Eight Tower?

ronin
29th November 2014, 06:11
You are a sweetie Ronin, the pdf is The Cosmic Question- would that b the same as Eight Tower?

no idea,full title and author and google search should come up with a few clues.

lookbeyond
29th November 2014, 06:15
no probs, i thought u might know, thanks, lb

jimmer
29th November 2014, 13:41
reading the first couple of sentences of the pdf -- yes, the same book.
somewhere along the line the title must have been changed.
funny, but they're both the same.

to help avoid eyestrain, perhaps your local library can come up with a hardcopy for you, lookbeyond.

while 'the eighth tower' takes his theory to new levels (the final chapter, part III is mind blowing),
you could begin with operation trojan horse, in which, after 4 years of research, keel first revealed 'the theory.'
it's a hellva read.

jimmer
29th November 2014, 14:54
if you missed this examination of the keel theory, I've extracted yet another post from the 'We Are The Experiencers' thread.

through a more historic look at what drives and defines everything, 'frequency,' can the mystery of crop circles be finally understood?

the final YT autoplay presents research that may very well have cracked that code. (http://jandeane81.com/threads/4046-We-Are-The-Experiencers?p=33124&viewfull=1#post33124) (this text is the link to that post)

http://www.navigantresearch.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/Frequency-Regulation-for-the-Grid.jpg

Spiral
29th November 2014, 16:09
while 'the eighth tower' takes his theory to new levels (the final chapter, part III is mind blowing),
you could begin with ]operation trojan horse, in which, after 4 years of research, keel first revealed 'the theory.'
it's a hellva read.

Heres a pdf of operation trojan horse https://keychests.com/item.php?v=higdohacyql

:tiphat:

jimmer
29th November 2014, 17:04
here's an interesting keelian music piece, based on the mothman saga.

http://i953.photobucket.com/albums/ae18/jimmerer/ScreenShot2014-04-07atApril-7-20141059AM_zpse17d9bbf.jpg
https://soundcloud.com/will_smith616/flight-of-the-moth

Tribe
29th November 2014, 17:31
Oh jimmer that's hypnotising ;) I love it ! X

jimmer
29th November 2014, 17:58
Oh jimmer that's hypnotising ;) I love it ! X

much like anything, immortality is how we are remembered.
in keel's case, his time has come again.

when I first plopped down at TOT, the ufo field was fascinating, but not much more.
there wasn't anything to hold on to.
every sighting, every craft, every high-strangeness case was interesting, but nothing would come of this show.
none of it would come together or offer any bigger picture.

there must be a reason for this all, but what is it really?
that should be the question, not when ET will finally save us.
they never will.
we should work on saving ourselves or at least coming to grips with it,
so we can make peace and move on to bigger things (like saving ourselves).

of course, I could be off a bit. still working on it. :eyebrows:

lookbeyond
29th November 2014, 19:57
Dear Ronin.Jimmer and Spiral thank you so much, lov lb

sandy
29th November 2014, 23:44
Like the story of the Moth Man..........pretty haunting music thru out Jimmer and nice twist at the end.............won't spoil it for others,listening pleasure :) Thks .....


here's an interesting keelian music piece, based on the mothman saga.

http://i953.photobucket.com/albums/ae18/jimmerer/ScreenShot2014-04-07atApril-7-20141059AM_zpse17d9bbf.jpg
https://soundcloud.com/will_smith616/flight-of-the-moth

jimmer
30th November 2014, 13:52
10 in a never-ending series: applying the keel theory

this 1979 documentary, presented by rod serling with an
assist from jacques valle, delves into ufo 'flaps' or 'waves.'

with our newly fashioned keelian caps on, let's see if after over 30 years,
these strange sightings, contacts and flybys exhibit the brilliance of off-world
alien contact or contact from something much closer and potentially less brilliant.

interestingly, once again, vallee is included to lend authority to this material.
much like his consulting on the film, 'close encounters of the third kind,'
vallee never was allowed to discuss or represent his true concept of what this contact is all about...

"...it was Dr. Jacques Vallee after who Stephen Spielberg modeled his rational scientist character in Close Encounters.
Vallée who was friends with Spielberg attempted to persuade the filmaker to use an alternative explanation
for the UFO phenomenon in his movie more inline whith his own “interdemensional” theories.
In an interview on Conspire.com, Vallée tells us, “I argued with him that the subject was even more interesting if it wasn’t extraterrestrials.
If it was real, physical, but not ET.
So he said, ‘You’re probably right, but that’s not what the public is expecting —
this is Hollywood and I want to give people something that’s close to what they expect.’”



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0oLwAlfrmbw

Spiral
30th November 2014, 17:46
There have been some strange things happening in Blighty, if this isn't an orchestrated prank using fireworks or a strange meteor shower what could it be ?

An omen of doom ?

The start of a Keelian "flap" ?

:frantic:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2854551/What-loud-bangs-heard-Britain-Twitter-bombarded-reports-mysterious-noises-military-denies-RAF-jets-cause.html

jimmer
30th November 2014, 18:07
those 'pops' definitely sound to be aerial fireworks, at a distance.
or the broadcasted, amplified recording of fireworks.

this mystery could be cleared up in coming days.

keep your eye on it, spiral ; )

jimmer
2nd December 2014, 14:07
There have been some strange things happening in Blighty, if this isn't an orchestrated prank using fireworks or a strange meteor shower what could it be ?

four words:
Pulse detonation engine technology. (http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2014/12/01/what-exactly-triggered-loud-bangs-heard-across-thousands-of-miles/)

jimmer
9th December 2014, 18:08
here is an openminds.tv interview with special effects icon, douglas trumbull.

listen to it all. the interview begin at 33:17.

it's a fascinating conversation, especially at the 75:45 mark,
when trumbull is asked what he thinks the ET/UFO thing is all about.
his response is quite keelian.
https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTl--ZyhxC2Hs8d84AGr6bwvZdT0JAxnNc3Buz0Xdo6kIBhqHD4lg
http://www.openminds.tv/doug-trumbull-special-effects-guru-ufo-hunter-december-8-2014/31251

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/27/Douglas_Trumbull_FMX_2012.jpg/220px-Douglas_Trumbull_FMX_2012.jpg

Frances
9th December 2014, 21:36
Sad news about Dolores Cannon who passed on in October.

The subject of inter-dimensional beings crops up more and more now.
It's quite a common part of conversations when referring to the UFO phenomenon.
Frances.

jimmer
9th December 2014, 21:43
The subject of inter-dimensional beings crops up more and more now.
It's quite a common part of conversations when referring to the UFO phenomenon.
Frances.

Sasquatch, as well. :eyebrows:

jimmer
9th December 2014, 21:47
Sad news about Dolores Canning, who passed on in October.

oh, dolores cannon. I missed that.
yes, she will be missed.
time can be a nasty thing.

with respect:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OPlp-Zl3DA8

Frances
9th December 2014, 21:49
I was also thinking the same Jimmer but I did not want to put the Sas word on your John Keel thread.
Your right, the whole phenomenon is awsome, I have learnt so much and still enjoying the journey.
Frances.

jimmer
9th December 2014, 22:01
we don't know how all of this works, but the evidence, the stories,
the accounts, the witnesses, the cross-correlations are leading to a broader picture.

who knows how it will all shake out.
we'll keep our collective eyes on it.

ufos are interdimensional.
sasquatch is interdimensional.
spirits are interdimensional.

is there a connection?
who wouldn't ask?

mojo
10th December 2014, 02:34
is there a connection?

The hope here is communication with what is visiting. And questions that you pose might be found out. It's one of the deepest desires even beyond filming. But evidence can be a double-edged sword. What if the desire is granted? Not sure if people would accept but know those here would. The question is what would you do with the information? How would you handle contact with new knowledge? What if you couldnt share your discovery with the world? Its not so easy an answer, yet would wish to share. The Carlos Diaz case in south America provides a clue. I hope others have heard about him? He has been silent for some time since his photos and original testimony came out for the most part, yet based on contact they would not leave him hanging imho. And whom could turn away from such an awesome discovery? So his silence is deafening...

jimmer
10th December 2014, 11:54
The hope here is communication with what is visiting. And answers that you pose might be found out. It's one of the deepest desires even beyond filming. But evidence can be a double-edged sword. What if the desire is granted? Not sure if people would accept but know those here would. The question is what would you do with the information? How would you handle contact with new knowledge? What if you couldnt share your discovery with the world? Its not so easy an answer, yet would wish to share. The Carlos Diaz case in south America provides a clue. I hope others have heard about him? He has been silent for some time since his photos and original testimony came out for the most part, yet based on contact they would not leave him hanging imho.
And whom could turn away from such an awesome discovery? So his silence is deafening...

here's a music video of sorts, entitled, 'Whatever Happened to Carlos Diaz.'

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sIBqu-nEoB0
as of 2012, carlos diaz seems to have become a celebrity of sorts. (in spanish)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1HziUdPYZwA
here's a full documentary of his story.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UUKq7uTovr0

mojo
10th December 2014, 15:09
thank you jimmer before leaving the other forum I asked on the forum if someone could translate the second video you posted above as I dont know Spanish well just a few words. Glad you posted the full documentary and the "What ever happened to Carlos Diaz" song was neat with the film What do you think of his case? The light shooting down from the craft is strange. The song title alone makes me think that other people are wondering about his case too! In the frist video at 1:38 you can see multiple orbs inside the craft.

Another ppoint of interest in the documentary, the man that meets him on the road in the volkswagen knew alot about the ETs. But we dont know anymore about him. That would be a great question to ask Carlos.

jimmer
10th December 2014, 15:27
thank you jimmer before leaving the other forum I asked on the forum if someone could translate the second video you posted above as I dont know Spanish well just a few words. Glad you posted the full documentary and the "What ever happened to Carlos Diaz" song was neat with the film What do you think of his case? The light shooting down from the craft is strange. The song title alone makes me think that other people are wondering about his case too! In the frist video at 1:38 you can see multiple orbs inside the craft.

Another ppoint of interest in the documentary, the man that meets him on the road in the volkswagen knew alot about the ETs. But we dont know anymore about him. That would be a great question to ask Carlos.

the diaz case remains one of the best contactee experiences ever documented.
the imagery could be the best ever.

it would be interesting to understand what is said in the 2012 video.
wonder if contact continues and how its changed his long-term lifestyle.
since those encounters, wonder what he's done with his life?

mojo
10th December 2014, 18:38
wonder if contact continues and how its changed his long-term lifestyle.
since those encounters, wonder what he's done with his life?

Yes those are important questions as well as learning more about the knowledgeable individual that met him on the raod after his experience with the beings. Those answers must be out there and really disappointed someone like Jamie Maussan hasnt dont a follow-up with this special case.

jimmer
10th December 2014, 21:53
want more carlos diaz and his entities of light?

this is the follow-up to the original documentary
that provides expert imagery analysis.
equally as impressive as the first.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ny9PGHSYT6k

jimmer
11th December 2014, 21:29
10 in a never-ending series: applying the keel theory

I've seen this video around for months and never took the time to view it.

today, I got to it.

this compilation brings together some of the best minds that dared to question the ETH:

Jacques Vallee, Terrence McKenna, John Mack.
All are keelian through and through.

three quarters along, the cherry on top is a discussion, sometimes a debate,
between John Mack (interdimensionalist) and Budd Hopkins (off-world, alien interference).
this conversation is riveting, thoughtful and points out our great loss by the passing of these two.

my collective thoughts so far:

• off-world beings / interfrence / contact: probably (bob lazar)
• ultraterrestrial entity interference: probably (keel)
• our-world terrestrial programs / crafts / interference: probably (death bed confessions...)

if it is true that the compendium of sightings and experiences throughout recorded history
are a convoluted result of all these three influences, then we'll never figure this thing out in totality.
these visions just beyond our reach will remain a fascination, never to be resolved.

it appears that keel had it right, 'we are not meant to know.'

when you have some time to devote, see what you find and let's hear what you think.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vB6uPBCVNPc&list=WL&index=143

jimmer
13th December 2014, 16:43
this documentary explores john mack's concept of contact 'experiences.'
in production at the time of his death, it became a memorial of sorts.

through a series of case studies we learn that these contact events,
while details vary, share a common arc.

the word, 'alien,' is mentioned only once.

the best, most disturbing story is saved for the last.

it closes with john mack attempting to summarize his understanding of these events.
after all his research, the interviews, lectures, all his writings – he looked confused and rather lost.

he did develop the belief that these events were beyond our current understanding and imagination. (very keelian)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a3eeG75rsbk

Elbie
13th December 2014, 20:26
hats off to john mack for taking the issue with full professional integrity..unlike his (pseudo) colleague, a would be colleague that is, since she never qualified in depth or formally - thinking of late dolores canon of course who claims to have established an ongoing communication with these beings who, according to them/her, were/are our custodians since the beginning of time and are our creators in fact.
it beats me how she alwys forgot to ask whether they knew who had made them ..and why...a blighting bunch of unlawfull abductors that they are.

jimmer
13th December 2014, 21:28
mack was a true pioneer, for sure.

I found an excellent video of his presentation to an small institute, including jacques vallee.
along the way, the term, 'soul technology' is coined.

I'll post tomorrow.

lookbeyond
13th December 2014, 21:39
When i go out to my clothes line each day i try to step over the ants but sometimes if im rushing or distracted i forget and sadly a few are stepped on and die, am i a potential "niribu" to them, one who comes around (rather frequently:p)to destroy their everyday routines?

My young daughter tells me about "some kids at school" who deliberately step on ants/treat insects badly and she tells them "dont, theyve got a family too you know!"--(she gets some strange looks)
My point is, are we to aliens what "lesser" developed life are to many of mankind?

I guess it is another case of as below so above,lb

jimmer
13th December 2014, 22:15
keel didn't believe that 'they' are that bright.

from his years of research, all the interviews and analysis --
he didn't see these other realm dwellers as necessarily smarter than us.
they simply had a better vantage point -- being able to review our 'future.'
in that regard, we would see them as gods.
keel felt otherwise.

they just know things we don't, yet.
having those insights, 'they' are able to play unfairly with 'us.'

the ETH believers went mad over such keelian conclusions.

lookbeyond
13th December 2014, 22:18
Sure Jimmer, hence my comparison of the children being curious/nasty to "lesser" insects- agreed, reguards lookbeyond

jimmer
14th December 2014, 16:14
this is a 1995 video document of a presentation john mack made to an intimate group of california institute members.
jacques vallee was in attendance.

the latter discussions are well out there and riveting.

searching for a way to explain and understand 'high-strangenss,'
watch for the moment when an attendee coins the phrase, soul technology.

enjoy being a fly-on-the-wall : )


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=11Y07Ij06qM&index=6&list=UUcZGmbPjJHd_v9iwZgGQj5A

jimmer
15th December 2014, 21:30
O-P-R-A-H-!

that word usually recoils me, but in john mack's case, this was quite a show.

here's mack with some of his brave contactees presenting to the world their stories of high-strangeness.
one of his 'clients' was a clinical psychiatrist himself!
very compelling.

as balance, a naysayer doctor is brought on denying these 'alien' contacts.
mack handles him well.

interestingly, the word 'alien' is used a lot here.
the term must have been used as a path of least resistance to this broader audience.

this is the first of three parts.
click on the youtube logo to watch the other two parts.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9-ufuNtpQd0&index=34&list=UUiyDZcv5kkMnspgYaCKo-Qg

jimmer
16th December 2014, 16:33
11 in a never-ending series: applying the keel theory

from a 2010 C2C interview with George Knapp, Philip Imbrogno discusses
his take on the ultraterrestrials and how they fit into the many experiences of high-strangeness.

this interview took place before Imbrogno was outed for padding his resume.
before he went into seclusion.

this is the same philip imbrogno who was a key investigator into the hudson valley flap, ranging from the 1980s-90s. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o5kIbcT4E1g)

at the 32:00 mark, imbrogno begins exploring the idea that sightings/experiences could be either extraterrestrial or ultraterrestrial.

that gets me to revisiting this idea that these various phenomenon could be, let's called it, Troika: extra, ultra or us.
if this is true, then which bucket do these individual sightings, video captures and bodily experiences fall into?
can we start making some sense of this? :eyebrows:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nKn2GaO00NM

Spiral
1st January 2015, 19:37
Just seen this & had to come on & post it on this thread !


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UgY0GlV4d1k

http://www.allnewspipeline.com/Strange_Creature_Sighted_In_Ohio.php

jimmer
1st January 2015, 20:39
Just seen this & had to come on & post it on this thread !

that's a nice find.
as keel might have said, 'very elemental, spiral.'

from the same source, here's a very similar sighting from november 2014, southern wisconsin.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bUyF8DYzvwY

jimmer
3rd January 2015, 15:54
here's a 1975 white paper that jacques vallee contributed his analysis and conclusions to thousands of ufo sightings.
this was the time when vallee was putting the pieces together and well after the time when john keel accused vallee of ripping off his concepts without a simple, 'thank you.' :eyebrows:

and to all the new or returning TOTers, here's an invitation to start from the first post to delve into one of the most original
and well thought out solutions to what the 'alien phenomenon' really is.
throughout recorded history – they aren't from there. they are from here and can not be trusted.

to use text to speech, click on the link below the embedded pdf.

http://www.jacquesvallee.net/bookdocs/AIAA.pdf

Frances
3rd January 2015, 19:46
Thanks Jimmer, I have added it to my home screen for further reading.
Got my John Keel books for Christmas so I have loads of reading to see me over the winter months.
Frances.

jimmer
3rd January 2015, 20:00
Thanks Jimmer, I have added it to my home screen for further reading.
Got my John Keel books for Christmaas so I have loads of reading to to see me over the winter months.
Frances.

which books?
I just finished the compilation, 'searching for the string'.
after completing 'the martian,' I think I'll revisit 'the eighth tower'.
some much to take in. such breakthrough thinking.

Frances
3rd January 2015, 20:17
I got "Operation Trojan Horse" and "Disney Land Of The Gods".
I am reading operation Trojan Horse now.
And like you, when I am done I will need a re-fresh, so I will go back to The Eighth Tower.
I am enjoying them very much.
Frances.

jimmer
3rd January 2015, 20:34
mind-opening for the new year!
let me know how you like 'disney land'.
I don't have that one.

Frances
22nd January 2015, 16:50
I have just finished John Keel's, Operation Trojan Horse.
What a read, so many things pulled into perspective.

I have got a better grasp of what I read about, allthough I have only a small portion of it, things are making more and more sense.

I won't talk about the book so as not to spoil things, as I know other members have the book.
Talking from my point of view it is an enlighting read.
Frances.

jimmer
22nd January 2015, 17:22
isn't it interesting, with all the experts painting pictures of
covert government operations, extraterrestrial threats
and all the other external off-planet intrusion stories,
it took one smart, non-expert, starting with historical research
to actually pull the rabbit out-of-the-hat.

too many become dead-set vested in other's memes
to allow themselves to see the picture that keel uncovered.

it answers everything, yet can proves nothing.

something fantastic co-mingles with this world, from this world
and we'll never really understand it.
for me, that's good enough.

keel came to accept it, as should we. and let it be.

and then we move on to things we can actually understand and affect.
lots of work to get to.

frances, let's us know what you find in "Disneyland of the Gods."
I may need to get a copy.

jimmer
22nd January 2015, 18:46
here are some people who have been touched by tnings unseen.
most of these stories have to do with frequency.

while this documentary's production values can be irritating,
the cases and testimonials are solid.

how do you investigate the unknown?
you observe, you note and move on :eyebrows:

if personally confronted with any of this,
be informed and don't get fooled, again.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eBNIA0kOUHc&list=WL&index=60

jimmer
30th January 2015, 13:28
oh, the skinwalker ranch, aka, the sherman ranch, aka gorman ranch
(right down the road from JC Johnson's turf).

in this keelian context, check out geoge knapp's presentation
of this experiences, in 2 parts.
it ends abruptly, but riveting stuff, nonetheless. (click through to view them)

so were these mind crunching events ET or UT?

knapp: "this a ufo story, but not really."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=myUI5JNPubo#t=36

more on the skinwalker ranch phenomenon.

you may have seen this, but if it's new to you, check out this interview.
while previously confidential, with time a key player in the investigation comes forward.
he uses the term, the trickster, to describe the source of the anamolies.

(and if the brilliant mind of john a. keel is new to you, you're invited to review this thread
for an educated, fully researched and non-ufo explanation of what goes bump in the night skies.)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?x-yt-ts=1422579428&x-yt-cl=85114404&v=yYMj1LHtOmw#t=40

jimmer
3rd February 2015, 16:54
if you ever wondered about strange sightings in the sky
and what the forces are behind them,
here's a lengthy article, delving into history,
that tells the story of a group of individuals
who struggled to unearth that source:

the nine.

"they want us to think UFOs are extraterrestrial nuts-and-bolts machines
and the aliens are flesh-and-blood in order to divert attention from the reality
that the real ‘aliens’ co-exist invisibly with us on the Earth –
and are the source of all cases of high strangeness." (http://www.newdawnmagazine.com/articles/behind-the-mask-aliens-or-cosmic-jokers)

this quote is the link to the article. get your text to speech machine fired up! this story will blow your mind.

http://www.newdawnmagazine.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/Grey-350.jpg

lookbeyond
3rd February 2015, 22:20
Hi Jimmer, ive yet to read this article and ive many more books to read on above hypothesis but are you able to tell me if these tricksters are able to physically touch people. My Mother experienced prolonged nightime "hauntings" when i was a child and of a morning i saw blood on the sheets and scratches on her arms, thanks in advance, lb

samos
3rd February 2015, 23:33
Hello Lookbeyond,

Jimmer will be much more in-depth..he is the man.

But to answer your question, I'd say..yes, absolutely!
I'm learning they are the source of many, if not all 'haunts'.




Sorry to just jump in, jimmer..but I love this informative thread! :thup:

lookbeyond
4th February 2015, 04:28
Hello Lookbeyond,

Jimmer will be much more in-depth..he is the man.

But to answer your question, I'd say..yes, absolutely!
I'm learning they are the source of many, if not all 'haunts'.




Sorry to just jump in, jimmer..but I love this informative thread! :thup:

You are more than welcome to jump in Samos:)

I read the most recent article posted above by Jimmer, and am wondering if this means the lights we see in the sky which we label UFO, are in fact military fulfilling their agenda of convincing us ETs are real and physical beings.

I hav had several occasions of watching a single " star " fly across above me and when directly overhead, highbeams itself and either keeps moving or fades to black- i doubt ill ever know and i guess it doesnt matter as it is not personal interference, lb--However,

If these beings/spirits/flyers etc hav always been here/there then maybe they are just part of our lives whilst on Earth, then the concerning aspect of this is the confusion around their existence and from that fact it seems to me that their agenda may be suspect especially if the military feel the need to disguise their (ET/UT)true identity.

jimmer
4th February 2015, 13:35
If these beings/spirits/flyers etc hav always been here/there then maybe they are just part of our lives whilst on Earth, then the concerning aspect of this is the confusion around their existence and from that fact it seems to me that their agenda may be suspect especially if the military feel the need to disguise their (ET/UT)true identity.

hi, samos. good to hear from you.

this is pretty heady stuff, upon rising : )

lookbeyond,
it seems that these elemental lights in the sky are real.
they are visible to us.
they take up space, possessing a presence and a hard location,
as they shimmer about or bump around.

and I think you are correct, they have always been here.

john keel, through his research, cracked the code.
after figuring that these visions were historical and repetitive,
he became less interested proving their existence,
focusing on the what and the why.
he also realized, that without new hard scientific research,
all of this would remain a mystery.

while some of these sightings may be military ops,
the vast majority of these incidence appear to be manifestations
from a reality that we can not interact with.
it's a oneway street.

while keel believed most of these tricksters were demonic,
there were those, like jacques valle, who thought the presence to
be a mixed, trick bag. you never know what the intent is,
often until it's too late.

are they real? are they physical? can they touch us?
to us, yes.
to them, it's a board game.

keel and vallee came to the conclusion that they had figured out the
broad strokes of where these 'visitors' emanated from.
they also concluded that true contact and information sharing
would never likely happen.

they believed that these incidence of 'contact' were more like a
not so subtle nudge to remind us that 'we are here,' whoever and whatever they are.

as for their intent, let the buyer beware.
historically, those who have pursued contact, ended up either broke,
indigent, chasing butterflies or worse.

if you'd like to get an educated view of these anomalies,
john keel's theories, to this day, remain powerful stuff.

throughout this thread, those theories are presented.
if you are interested, give it a review.

(as for the above article. could the 'IT' be the council of nine?)

jimmer
4th February 2015, 15:41
I consider the title of this forum to be the reason why many of us are here.

I'd really welcome those who seek the deep, hard-to-find truth
to investigate the theories presented by this thread to either
debunk, support or most importantly, contribute.

there's always room for tea and crumpets.

the TOT main course should remain substantive, as it is, quenching.

Tribe
4th February 2015, 16:15
http://youtu.be/hPY0CcAmHNY
Various clips from different John A. Keel lectures from over the years.

quality is not brilliant but content good :) x

jimmer
4th February 2015, 16:27
thanks for the try, tribe. (http://jandeane81.com/threads/4277-John-Keel-Adventurer?p=36049&viewfull=1#post36049)

what else you got? :eyebrows:

Tribe
4th February 2015, 16:31
ohhh:blsh: opsies sorry jimmer ! x

jimmer
4th February 2015, 16:50
ohhh:blsh: opsies sorry jimmer ! x

I do appreciate the try, tribe.

this subject, due to its non-conforming ET posture,
has lots of detractors, so finding bona fide content can be difficult.

the real problem is, the ETH hasn't panned out.
it's a dead end.

keel and others knew, after studying this subject,
that something has been takin, throughout time and recorded history.

that's why we're here.
to figure this thing out, to our own satisfaction.
(while enjoying those tea and crumpets, here and there : )

Tribe
4th February 2015, 17:05
ETH ? :confused:

jimmer
4th February 2015, 17:11
where I'm at now with all the things that go bump in the night and skies:

TROIKA

• genuine off-world contact (based on the belief of bob lazar's story (http://jandeane81.com/threads/4495-New-Bob-Lazar-Documentary?p=35840&viewfull=1#post35840))

• ultraterrestrials (http://jandeane81.com/threads/4046-We-Are-The-Experiencers?p=32138&viewfull=1#post32138) (historical pulsing repetitive sky lights, contact tomfoolery, stories like the rise and fall of howard menger (http://jandeane81.com/threads/4277-John-Keel-Adventurer?p=37505&viewfull=1#post37505), et al)

• gov't black ops (death bed confessions, disinfo like MJ-12 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3mhRLKuJWyg))

how are these three weighted?

heavy on the ultra, pls. :eyebrows:

jimmer
4th February 2015, 17:16
ETH ? :confused:

a 70s abbrev. term: extraterrestrial hypothesis

this is when the focus turned to the 'alien' meme
as the answer.

this is when sides were taking formed, lines were drawn.

since then, nothing substantive has come of it.

thus, there must be something else to consider.
and keel knew it, way back when.

lift the veil
4th February 2015, 17:45
we don't know how all of this works, but the evidence, the stories,
the accounts, the witnesses, the cross-correlations are leading to a broader picture.

who knows how it will all shake out.
we'll keep our collective eyes on it.

ufos are interdimensional.
sasquatch is interdimensional.
spirits are interdimensional.

is there a connection?
who wouldn't ask?


Jimmer - Hello. Sorry to interrupt the conversation. Great thread. Just got through reading it all. I have not yet read Operation Trojan Horse or the 8th Tower. I am off to read the pdfs right now. However in answer to your question above, i think that there is a big YES to a connection.

I have read up on many alternative topics, including out of body experiences, near death experiences, ghosts, the demonic, the Djinn, sasquatch, skinwalkers, ufos and aliens and what I find is that they are ALL connected by operation in this OTHER REALM. Those other "entities" operate mainly in that other realm but do have the ability to come into our realm and interact with us.

After reading up on out of body and near death experiences I finally got an understanding of why we as humans seem to be operating in such a differenty type of setting with different abilities. It seems as though the human body acts as more of a filter to what is reality. We only experience what our 5 human senses allow us to see. Many people who leave their bodies either by a near death expereince or out of body experience find that their senses have expanded. They are able to see discarnate beings, see 360 degrees, they can fly, go to other planets/realms, manifest objects or environments around themselves just with their thoughts, and some even connect with universal knowledge. While out of body, they have super-natural abilities.

The inhibitor seems to be the physical human body.

Post Edit - We are not the human body, it is only a vehicle to contain our true essence (soul) when we chose to come to the Earthly plane to experience life in the physical. We come into this Earthly plane with amnesia of who we truly are and where we came from so that we have a real "human" experience. But, along the journey, we need to remember who we are.

jimmer
4th February 2015, 18:02
Jimmer - Hello. Sorry to interrupt the conversation. Great thread. Just got through reading it all. I have not yet read Operation Trojan Horse or the 8th Tower. I am off to read the pdfs right now. However in answer to your question above, i think that there is a big YES to a connection.

I have read up on many alternative topics, including out of body experiences, near death experiences, ghosts, the demonic, the Djinn, sasquatch, skinwalkers, ufos and aliens and what I find is that they are ALL connected by operation in this OTHER REALM. Those other "entities" operate mainly in that other realm but do have the ability to come into our realm and interact with us.

After reading up on out of body and near death experiences I finally got an understanding of why we as humans seem to be operating in such a differenty type of setting with different abilities. It seems as though the human body acts as more of a filter to what is reality. We only experience what our 5 human senses allow us to see. Many people who leave their bodies either by a near death expereince or out of body experience find that their senses have expanded. They are able to see dis-carnate beings, see 360 degrees, they can fly, go to other planets/realms, manifest objects or environments around themselves just with their thoughts, and some even connect with universal knowledge. While out of body, they have super-natural abilities.

The inhibitor seems to be the physical human body.

outstanding thought process and distillations.

our 5 senses is the impediment.
our control.
our screen.
that makes sense.

keel believed much of the anomalistic stuff around us
manifest through frequency control.
they are the masters of frequency.
he goes big with that in the eighth tower.
happy reading.
let us know what you find.
the last chapter is a doozy.

lift the veil
4th February 2015, 18:04
I was in the process of editing my post, please see above my post edit. I know it may be woo-woo for some, but it is where all my searching has led.

lookbeyond
4th February 2015, 22:56
Jimmer - Hello. Sorry to interrupt the conversation. Great thread. Just got through reading it all. I have not yet read Operation Trojan Horse or the 8th Tower. I am off to read the pdfs right now. However in answer to your question above, i think that there is a big YES to a connection.

I have read up on many alternative topics, including out of body experiences, near death experiences, ghosts, the demonic, the Djinn, sasquatch, skinwalkers, ufos and aliens and what I find is that they are ALL connected by operation in this OTHER REALM. Those other "entities" operate mainly in that other realm but do have the ability to come into our realm and interact with us.

After reading up on out of body and near death experiences I finally got an understanding of why we as humans seem to be operating in such a differenty type of setting with different abilities. It seems as though the human body acts as more of a filter to what is reality. We only experience what our 5 human senses allow us to see. Many people who leave their bodies either by a near death expereince or out of body experience find that their senses have expanded. They are able to see discarnate beings, see 360 degrees, they can fly, go to other planets/realms, manifest objects or environments around themselves just with their thoughts, and some even connect with universal knowledge. While out of body, they have super-natural abilities.

The inhibitor seems to be the physical human body.

Post Edit - We are not the human body, it is only a vehicle to contain our true essence (soul) when we chose to come to the Earthly plane to experience life in the physical. We come into this Earthly plane with amnesia of who we truly are and where we came from so that we have a real "human" experience. But, along the journey, we need to remember who we are.

Hello, i wonder why humans hav their senses to "other" limited. For example, animals seem to sense/see those from other realms that most humans cannot perceive. My youngest daughter is 11 and out of my 3 children has had the most exposure to "high strangeness", most recently she was playing in her bedroom with her budgie and casually threw a small sand filled teddy bear on her bed, the teddy landed flat (its floppy and cant sit up by itself) when she turned back to face the bed the teddy was sitting upright and her budgie "was all skinny"-- the budgie does this when it is frightened.

I just wonder "who or what" plays with us and hope that their intent is benign at least, lb

jimmer
4th February 2015, 23:16
Hello, i wonder why humans hav their senses to "other" limited. For example, animals seem to sense/see those from other realms that most humans cannot perceive. My youngest daughter is 11 and out of my 3 children has had the most exposure to "high strangeness", most recently she was playing in her bedroom with her budgie and casually threw a small sand filled teddy bear on her bed, the teddy landed flat (its floppy and cant sit up by itself) when she turned back to face the bed the teddy was sitting upright and her budgie "was all skinny"-- the budgie does this when it is frightened.

I just wonder "who or what" plays with us and hope that their intent is benign at least, lb

I can't speak for all and I don't want to be negative,
but until we have a broader understanding of these ultras,
I wouldn't mess with them.

It can start out so fun and mysterious.

I'm not an expert, but I'd look away.
Not interested.
Period.
If it persists, let your intent be known.
You want none of it.

That's how I'd treat it.

Don't be concerned.
Don't fret.
Just have none of it.

Of course, others may disagree :eyebrows:

lookbeyond
4th February 2015, 23:41
Nothing is encouraged here, especially considering my Mothers experiences which started out as minor introductions, however having said that this has been going on for many years without harm. We witness and ignore, the children tell me when it happens and they understand the concept of being and stating the fact that they are Sovereign Beings.

Thanks for replying, lb

jimmer
4th February 2015, 23:53
great attitude and understanding, LB.

lift the veil
5th February 2015, 00:01
I can't speak for all and I don't want to be negative,
but until we have a broader understanding of these ultras,
I wouldn't mess with them.

It can start out so fun and mysterious.

I'm not an expert, but I'd look away.
Not interested.
Period.
If it persists, let your intent be known.
You want none of it.

That's how I'd treat it.

Don't be concerned.
Don't fret.
Just have none of it.

Of course, others may disagree :eyebrows:

LookBeyond,

Hello.

From what I have researched, it seems as though some children, like animals, can be aware of this other realm. The explanation that is given by "experts" is that children are relatively new to this reality and may still see "things" as they have not been fully programmed by society to think that such things don't exist (as, our beliefs and thoughts help to shape our reality/what we see.)

I am no expert either. I give no advice on how to handle such things. I personally would not mess with them, as Jimmer indicated.

lift the veil
6th February 2015, 15:41
Here is a brand new interview with William Buhlman regarding the Out of Body Experience (OBE). He talks about how we are spiritual beings having a temporary experience (of life) while in the body. He says that we are multi-dimensional beings and we exist in these other dimensions concurrently with this one, but our consciousness is so intently focused on this physical existence in the human body that it leaves us unaware of being multi-dimensional. He says we can all learn to leave our bodies and explore these other realities, where our thoughts will project (manifest) in these other realms. The OBE is a perfectly natural thing because we are truly non-physical (spiritual) beings.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=omKS82YDjIY#t=20

jimmer
6th February 2015, 17:01
could the trickster, be us?

from christopher o'brien:

thoughts on the trickster (http://www.theparacast.com/forum/threads/thoughts-on-the-trickster.7662/)

as for this historical meme shifting to meet societal acceptance:

"The trickster’s role was to bring
novelty, vitality and change as needed."

lookbeyond
6th February 2015, 20:21
could the trickster, be us?

from christopher o'brien:

thoughts on the trickster (http://www.theparacast.com/forum/threads/thoughts-on-the-trickster.7662/)

as for this historical meme shifting to meet societal acceptance:

"The trickster’s role was to bring
novelty, vitality and change as needed."

Im wondering if the trickster is us, then how do other people share such an experience for eg, those who investigated Skinwater Ranch also were affected by the tricksters there (and the local native peoples who warned others about the area)
?-lb

jimmer
6th February 2015, 21:09
Im wondering if the trickster is us, then how do other people share such an experience for eg, those who investigated Skinwater Ranch also were affected by the tricksters there (and the local native peoples who warned others about the area)
?-lb

from the piece:

Carl Jung’s assessment, “all mythical figures correspond to inner psychic experiences and originally sprang from them.”

I think the point is that we have direct influence on those things that go bump in the night skies.

if we pursue those things, they manifest.
if we don't, we get poked a bit, but that's about it.

so, the next time we see something unexplainable,
note it. don't chase it.

here's one who pursued it – an excerpt from the howard menger story.
look into his eyes at the end of his story.
he looks totally confused.
did it really happen?

http://youtu.be/ggsuHRnyn0Q?t=3m19s

lift the veil
6th February 2015, 21:42
I think that there indeed are entities/beings(tricksters) that do exist in other realities/dimensions that can interact/mess with us in our realm. There are people that have full blown paranormal experiences (not just poked a bit) that have not been exposed to the ideas or concepts of paranormal phenomena, nor did they have beliefs that those certain phenomena were real.

In some cases there does seem to be a sort of "opening of the door" if you will whereby a person's actions somehow unbeknownst to them gives a type of "consent" to ongoing and intensifying interactions (for example using a spirit board).

A family can move into a haunted house and immediately experiences strange occurrences, but they did nothing personally to open the door. In essence the "door to activity" had been opened by someone else, maybe a previous owner or an bad event happened on the property that seems to draw negative entities to the property (murder/or catastrophe that lead to traumatic deaths) as that event seems to punch open a doorway or create an anchor of sorts to that piece of land. So in effect the new home-owners made the unfortunate decision to buy a house that had already had an entity attachment to it.

Altaira
6th February 2015, 21:53
Here is a brand new interview with William Buhlman regarding the Out of Body Experience (OBE). He talks about how we are spiritual beings having a temporary experience (of life) while in the body. He says that we are multi-dimensional beings and we exist in these other dimensions concurrently with this one, but our consciousness is so intently focused on this physical existence in the human body that it leaves us unaware of being multi-dimensional. He says we can all learn to leave our bodies and explore these other realities, where our thoughts will project (manifest) in these other realms. The OBE is a perfectly natural thing because we are truly non-physical (spiritual) beings.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=omKS82YDjIY#t=20

I highly respect William Buhlman, I read his 3 books and had a chance to talk to him last year at a conference in Dublin. He is an extraordinary soul and all he says can be tested while you go OB.

lookbeyond
7th February 2015, 05:14
from the piece:

Carl Jung’s assessment, “all mythical figures correspond to inner psychic experiences and originally sprang from them.”

I think the point is that we have direct influence on those things that go bump in the night skies.

if we pursue those things, they manifest.
if we don't, we get poked a bit, but that's about it.

so, the next time we see something unexplainable,
note it. don't chase it.

here's one who pursued it – an excerpt from the howard menger story.
look into his eyes at the end of his story.
he looks totally confused.
did it really happen?

http://youtu.be/ggsuHRnyn0Q?t=3m19s




Absolutely no poke zone :tiphat:

Frances
31st March 2015, 23:04
From my travels through the Internet reading about the paranormal and also the books of John A. keel, I can now have some insight into what the phenonoma is about.

John Keel's books make me look deeper into what I read and see now.
This does not mean I have a full understanding, but insight is better than no sight at all.
I can understand how he comes to his unique conclusions.
I can also understand why he just stopped writing about the many subjects he covered.
Frances.

jimmer
31st March 2015, 23:22
I can also understand why he just stopped writing about the many subjects he covered.


he solved one of the grandest mysteries of all time.
pretty heady and heavy stuff.
and when he came to the realization that 'we are not meant to know,' he moved on.

anything from the 'disneyland of the gods' stand out for you, frances?

Frances
31st March 2015, 23:33
Yes Jimmer, I got the sense we are manipulated, played with, encouraged along with grand scenarios of fear, hope, amazement and joy.
All the things we get from going to Disney Land.

All the rides keep getting better, scarier and more awsome.
I believe that will continue to be the case.
Frances.

jimmer
31st March 2015, 23:47
Yes Jimmer, I got the sense we are manipulated, played with, encouraged along with grand scenarios of fear, hope, amazement and joy.
All the things we get from going to Disney Land.

All the rides keep getting better, scarier and more awsome.
I believe that will continue to be the case.
Frances.

it's reassuring and a relief to be at peace with those mysteries.

sit back and enjoy the show :eyebrows:

http://mentalfloss.com/sites/default/legacy/wp-content/uploads/2008/07/spider.jpg

Church
1st April 2015, 03:55
This is an awesome thread, Jimmer. I got some catching up to do!

lift the veil
2nd April 2015, 01:05
Hey all, I see on tonight's new Monsters and Mysteries in America show they are dedicating the whole hour to John Keel. It is on the Destination America channel (194 for those who have Dish Network) at 9pm central.

Here is the description:

The John Keel Files Special. In the late 1960s, the town of Point Pleasant, W. Va., is besieged by a series of monstrous creatures, UFOs and mysterious men in black.

p.s. I will post the video of it tomorrow for those that miss watching it live.

lift the veil
2nd April 2015, 12:52
Hey all, I see on tonight's new Monsters and Mysteries in America show they are dedicating the whole hour to John Keel. It is on the Destination America channel (194 for those who have Dish Network) at 9pm central.

Here is the description:

The John Keel Files Special. In the late 1960s, the town of Point Pleasant, W. Va., is besieged by a series of monstrous creatures, UFOs and mysterious men in black.

p.s. I will post the video of it tomorrow for those that miss watching it live.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d4Rr1SNvHuo

Here is the video of the John Keel special. It is quite different from the Mothman Prophecies movie. It includes sightings of the Mothman, UFOs, animal mutilations and then visits from the Men in Black. Additionally after the Silver Bridge fell, sightings of the Mothman continued to occur. One witness/experiencer asked, "Is this how people disappear?" Good question. :scrhd:

In closing, John Keel stated,
The unknown is out there. The universe does not exists as we think we exist, and we don't exist as we think we exist.

Interesting stuff.

jimmer
2nd April 2015, 13:21
you beat me to it, LTV.
thanks for posting the vid.

I watched it last night.

much better (in content) than the movie.

I'd really like to see the full production film
made of this story. the keel / hyer team is the way to tell it.
John Keel's Birdman.

revealed for the first time, via a confidant, keel's state-of-mind
during the latter part of the investigation – he was scared.

http://jandeane81.com/threads/4277-John-Keel-Adventurer?p=36489&viewfull=1#post36489

jimmer
2nd April 2015, 17:44
here's another posting of the show.
sit back and experience the episode with your popcorn.

I don't understand they the channel doesn't post a full-frame version.

if they're reasoning is promotional -- fail!


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U36GRbhy9HU

lift the veil
2nd April 2015, 18:00
Hey Jimmer - Thanks for the link to this interview here https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=660&v=BEsbexezqpQ Near the end of the show they talk about founding evidence of occult activity taking place prior to the Mothman sightings. Maybe some teenagers went to those abandoned TNT bunker-like areas to conduct some occult rituals. They probably ended up opening a doorway/portal that let the Mothman and other stuff in. The final witness in the Monsters and Mysteries show who talked about going to the TNT area and seeing the Mothman through a veil/curtain like phenomena which sounded like he came upon a portal of some sorts.

jimmer
2nd April 2015, 18:15
The final witness in the Monsters and Mysteries show who talked about going to the TNT area and seeing the Mothman through a veil/curtain like phenomena which sounded like he came upon a portal of some sorts.

that, was incredible, wasn't it.
what a capper to an interesting documentary.

that guy, andy colvin, has taken up the keel mantle.
he's been working with the keel estate
to release compilations of his writings,
like 'searching for the string' --
periodical pieces that led keel to his theory.

jimmer
3rd April 2015, 20:11
so, I was milling about the internet and out from nowhere came a strange story
that begins with a knuckle-ball to the head...

if you desire, listen to the first few sections of john a. keel's, the mothman prophecies.

(audio book sample)

https://mobile.audible.com/pd/Nonfiction/The-Mothman-Prophecies-Audiobook/B002V01IE4?s=s


https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/51PAvJaguLL._SL250_.jpg

jimmer
4th April 2015, 16:13
I wasn't sure where to post this, but when JC Johnson used the term, ultraterrestrial,
I knew then and there -- here.

here's the interview from last year, hot on the heel's on his investigation
of a native couple who were confronted with 'visitors.'

let's see what comes of this...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f33Ccevaez4

DeeZe
13th May 2015, 20:41
:abduct:

jimmer
13th May 2015, 20:56
żqué?

DeeZe
13th May 2015, 21:01
Sorry, I thought this thread was interesting so I gave it a bump for the newer peeps here like me.

Church
13th May 2015, 21:19
It was the "smiley-abduction" bump. :)

jimmer
13th May 2015, 21:21
Sorry, I thought this thread was interesting so I gave it a bump for the newer peeps here like me.

your bump is welcomed here, DeeZe. :eyebrows:

have fun discovering what keel figured out in the 60s
and quickly shunned by the vested ufoers.

his discoveries are a big wow moments.

jimmer
13th May 2015, 21:39
I haven't had a chance to read this yet,
but you post 'em as you find 'em.

jacques valle's first book in his trilogy, dedicated to dr. j. allen hynek.

"The real question is, does the "spacecraft" hypothesis
explain to our satisfaction the facts of the UFO phenomenon as we know them today?
The answer is a definite and resounding no."

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51-vJEhsoQL._SY344_BO1,204,203,200_.jpg


http://iosisrecords.com/libraryofzar/Site/DOWNLOAD_files/Dimensions.pdf

to use your text to speech machine, use the link to either read it on-line or downloaded to your desktop.

lift the veil
20th May 2015, 13:14
Here is a good podcast regarding the skin walker ranch. The interviewer has had his own experiences on the ranch and the interviewee lived nearby. He discusses the strange activity that occurs in the region as a whole and the attitude that the locals have regarding the phenomena.

I realize that this is not about Keel, however all the strange paranormal activity and the portal type phenomena which seems to allow access for these entities is similar. Very "Keelian" in nature. :eyebrows:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fotqjl8t4qY

jimmer
20th May 2015, 13:35
very keelian, indeed. :eyebrows:

looking forward to it and thanks.

jimmer
20th May 2015, 19:37
if you're interested in or would like to learn the large arc of david pauides' missing 411 story,
this compilation is a good primer.

my spidey senses tell me the answer or answers are larger than or not related to sasquatch.

could the answers be more keelian?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nCT5D6U8GYw#t=101

jimmer
21st May 2015, 00:11
with a great and knowledgable interviewer comes one of david paulides finest,
most insightful conversations on the missing 411 mysteries, concentrating on his
newest book, The Devil in the Details.

around the 49 min. mark, david lets a bit of what he thinks may be behind some of these disappearances. (not a lot, but something)

it's a 2 hour session, broken into 2 parts.
once they get going, listen closely.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_QE5U5DUPgM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NfVs3Q1faRQ

I'm posting these here, rather that SV3.
the answers to these conundrums seem to be something other than sasquatch.
something more elemental.
if still with us, I bet john keel would have a some educated opinions to share.

jimmer
21st May 2015, 21:47
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_QE5U5DUPgM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NfVs3Q1faRQ

if you missed this 2 hour extravaganza of the strange, here's something to consider:

during the second hour, 49 min.mark, paulides presumes what is not causing these disappearances.
the possibilities narrow. seems that david may be going there.

at the 54:30 min. mark, the strangest, best documented case paulides ever pursued:
a big, athletic guy goes missing.
he had a cell phone and used it.
the first call -- 2 dark men were following him along the shoreline.
another call -- he phoned to say he was removing his clothing and then the line went dead -- and more...

throughout the calls, he was freaked out.

later, they found the body...it appeared that he had been scared to death.
absolutely bizarre.

jimmer
26th May 2015, 14:08
through the resourcefulness of TOT and malc,

here's a george knapp interview of author bill grabowski on john keel's point pleasant research.

first hour only.
this interview is publicly 'private' at YT.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ul4Zgd2wTU

jimmer
12th June 2015, 17:08
years before his death, dr. john mack had been expressing
his epiphany that 'alien contact' had less to do with extraterrestrials
and more to do with john keel's 'ultraterrestrials' –
not so much from out there, more like from within.

here's a documentary about mack's journey and the abductee experience.

click on this image to watch the YT autoplay, in 5 parts.

http://i953.photobucket.com/albums/ae18/jimmerer/Screen%20Shot%202015-06-12%20at%20%20%20%20%20June-12-2015%20%20%2010.05%20AM%20_zpsaingdbhq.jpg (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gG3DTJhyCW4&list=PLF9ADE273F0DA02B0)

jimmer
12th June 2015, 18:32
more mack please, you say?

in his latter days, dr. mack was the hot ticket.
he was everywhere.
this video captured his first presentation at a 'ufo conference.'
while he starts off ploddingly, the subject takes shape, it really flows.

notice: not once does he refer to 'aliens' as from outer space.

near the 30 min mark, he first mentions the 'tricksters' and it takes off from there.

his real focus? what he refers to as, the third realm.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=311sjQTqro0

lookbeyond
13th June 2015, 00:19
Goodness Jimmer! there goes half a day!, :)lb

jimmer
13th June 2015, 16:53
a while back at SV4, one of dr. john mack's later lectures
revealed his newest thinking on the ufo and abduction phenomanon.
to better understand, he recommended a british author's book, Daimonic Reality. (http://jandeane81.com/threads/7033-Sasquatch-Vocalizations-4-0?p=841927160&viewfull=1#post841927160)

here is an interview with that book's author, patrick harpur.

patrick draws upon many influences to come to his ufo / high strangeness conclusions.

his views are totally on-track with those of john keel:
all those strange sights and sounds are not from an off-world extraterrestrial existence.
they have been and will continue to be – all around us.

caution: depending on your ufo perspective, this may blow your mind up.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5pOY2cD-urE&list=WL&index=113

jimmer
23rd June 2015, 19:42
awake, john keel, the adventurer!

this interview of JC Johnson has it all:

strange cryptid stories, his calling, the reign of heaven and hell,
sasqautch genealogy and lot's more.

later, a caller's chilling tale is riveting.

JC believes that all the strangeness, high and low, throughout the times, is interwoven.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f33Ccevaez4&list=WL&index=117
this may be a repost, but as we grow, old conundrums can seem fresh and startling.

jimmer
15th August 2015, 17:05
awake, oh grand john keel, the adventurer!

I found this incredible art bell interview with dr. karla turner.

along with her investigative pursuits, she authored of three books, inlcuding her last, masquerade of angels.

at first the good doctor believed she was involved with an off-world alien intellegence.

later, and revealed in this interview, she came to grips that the interlopers were more tricky, than alien.

"The creatures are very interested in the human soul."

she goes on to say that 'their intent is not what many would hope for.'

give a listen when you have a few. worth every second if you are looking for what could very well be the real alien truth.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ayLasHNlh4U&index=104&list=WL
dr. turner died two years after this interview of aggressive, sudden cancer.
many believe she was quieted, for she was on to it.
as you listen, ask yourself: is this the reason for a military/gov't cover-up?
was the off-world alien meme was developed and prospered (by the likes of richard doty, etc.)
to hide the real truth that citizens of the earth could not accept?
we are cows. (or as john fort first said, property)
at that point of the interview, art bell seemed shaken.
keel arrived at the same conclusion back in the 60s

Frances
15th August 2015, 19:36
This one this evening might make up for the loss of, "The Martian", last part video 6.
Looking forward to it.
Frances.

jimmer
15th August 2015, 19:48
This one this evening might make up for the loss of, "The Martian", last part video 6.
Looking forward to it.
Frances.

it's the least that could be done : )

the entire interview, through to the caller's questions, is riveting, as it is instructive.

what a shame the good doctor can no longer contribute.

while she was with us, she made her mark.

super secret bonus for JKA members:

Author, Dr. Karla Turner's first book, Into the Fringe. (audio book}


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=628wX-vRcyU&index=126&list=WL

lookbeyond
16th August 2015, 08:53
Thanks again Jimmer :),lb

jimmer
29th September 2015, 19:36
oh awake mighty, john keel, adventurer.

if you haven't had the chance to listen to this art bell interview of nick redfern on the men in black, it's choice.

the entire discussion is pure keelian.

these strange, peculiar entities, as discussed, are not governmental.
they are ultraterrestrials and right in john keel's wheelhouse.
they discuss keels analysis of these entities as the show unfolds.

http://media.soundcloud.com/stream/iuCLivcvz7R7.mp3

this is the photo of the 'man' in black described later in the interview.

https://strangeincidents.files.wordpress.com/2013/11/real-photo-of-men-in-black.jpg

lift the veil
2nd October 2015, 16:34
Awesome interview Jimmer. Bell and Redfern do well together. I think Nick hit it on the head when he compared the MIB to the hatman and shadow people. All three seem to come around when people delve into alternative topics. The MIB definitely seem supernatural and in some cases seem to be taking on a "body" of sorts to deliver their messages to people.

The "hat" connection with the hatman is interesting. I was listening to an interview on shadow people and hatman where the hatman seems to be of a higher rank than just regular shadow people. Although they do seem to come from the same "realm". First the people were menaced by shadow people and then later on the hatman shows up. The person said the hatman seemed to be however a higher authority figure. As though the regular ranked shadow people could not get the job done of scaring off the person, they had to bring in the "bigger guns," the hatman. to take care of business. The hat indicates a higher rank of the entity with more authority.

This reminds me of talks I listened to about fallen angels where there is supposedly a hierarchy among them. With the demons ranking the lowest and the fallen angles ranking above them. Its all about hierarchy and the supposed authority that comes with it.

MIB may be hatmen that manifest "bodies" or take on a robotic or clone body to deliver their threats to people that have had their minds open to the "other realm".

:Bump:

jimmer
2nd October 2015, 19:46
LTV, I remember keel discussing the time he was visited by a group of MIB at his manhattan apartment.

they arrived as a threat. keel welcomed them in.

at some point, he challenged that they were who they said they were. he said prove it.

the men walked into his kitchen.
one of them opened the cabinet beneath the sink and stood up with a container of ammonia.
the man, glancing at keel, proceeded to swallowed its contents.
the man smiled.
keel was convinced.

here's a transcribed conversation keel had with a contactee who had MIB in her house at the time of the call.

it appears that keel and this woman begin the conversation, with an MIB breaking in.

the dialog is very strange. (read keel's summary and analysis, at the end)

click on the quote to read the typed transcription.

"This concludes the transcript of John’s baffling phone conversation with “Helen,”
who claimed that there were Men In Black in the room with her.
When we last left them, one of the MIB was drinking ammonia — at least, according to Helen.

This isn’t the end, however; as John says, “Things got very complicated.” (http://www.johnkeel.com/?s=ammonia)

jimmer
7th October 2015, 14:56
12 in a never-ending series: applying the keel theory

here is an absolutely intriguing investigation by richard d. hall (richplanet)
into the 1940 'ufo' encounter: The Gateshead Grey.

it's the same MO: entities appear, interact, revisit and ultimately leave
the contactee(s) confused and living the haunted life of one who will never know.
although, as you'll see, there's a twist that occurs, leading to a mystery.

click on the image to watch the video.

http://i.ytimg.com/vi/StKqVS3n4BM/hqdefault.jpg (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MY0spYlDvdk&list=WL&index=133)

Frances
7th October 2015, 15:21
Oh great one Jimmer, I was going to post this one a long long time ago when we were discussing Linda Moulton Howe's work about the Bigfoot & UFO connection.

Funny thing is, the area is only 40 mins in the car from my area.
Looking forward to another view.
Frances.

jimmer
7th October 2015, 15:30
Oh great one Jimmer, I was going to post this one a long long time ago when we were discussing Linda Moulton Howe's work about the Bigfoot & UFO connection.

Funny thing is, the area is only 40 mins in the car from my area.
Looking forward to another view.
Frances.

gateshead: quite a moment in time, never repeated.

a gift or an act of the absurd?

richard hall really wrings this story out. (as he tends to ; )

lift the veil
19th October 2015, 15:12
Cryptofourcorners posted a link to this article on their facebook page. http://www.cvltnation.com/12-people-tell-their-terrifying-encounters-with-navajo-skinwalkers/

Thought it would fit here.

12 People Tell Their Terrifying Encounters With Navajo Skinwalkers

http://www.cvltnation.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/these-navajo-skinwalker-stories-will-have-you-jumping-out-of-your-skin-in-terror-393257-1440x564_c.png

Here is my favorite story


I was spending a month with my cousins at my grandma’s house. It was August and my cousin’s ages ranged from ten to fifteen, and I was the oldest (being fifteen). I was staying with a ten, thirteen, and fourteen year old. we stayed up telling scary stories often, but one night a few weeks in, we decided to make a campfire out back. My grandma’s house is in a rural suburb, the neighbors aren’t too far when you’re driving down the road to her house, but in the backyard, it’s thick forest with manmade paths through it. Each house is on a hill so only part of the basement was actually underground. That isn’t important until later though. So, we’re towards the east side of her yard, in a smallish patch of open land. You couldn’t see the neighboring yards from there, and there was probably three quarters a mile to each side of us that belonged to my grandma.

It was maybe eleven at night, and we were playing truth or dare after telling scary stories, and my fourteen year old cousin dared me and the thirteen year old to go walk through the paths for ten minutes or so. I said yes right away, as I wasn’t easily scared and rather level headed, but my younger cousin was a bit more hesitant. We didn’t bring a flashlight because it wasn’t pitch dark yet, and we could see enough to not die. We were walking through the paths for about five minutes and could barely see the fire through the trees when we decided to turn. In the middle of the path, was a large dog-like creature, hunched over with its front hands an inch from the ground.

What I remember most was how its eyes were so ****ing bright white, and it was humanoid-dog shaped with a human like head but a dog like body but human hands and feet. It looked right at us and I know I was paralyzed with fear as it dashed away the opposite way from us, towards a creek that ran through the yard. Eventually my cousin and I screamed bloody effin murder and the other cousins and my grandma ran to us. I don’t remember much here because I was really disoriented and i couldn’t think properly, but I did wake up in bed, so I assume that I was brought up to the house. All the kids slept in the basement, in a big room with sliding glass doors to the outside, as the room was on the side that wasn’t underground. my bed was pressed against a big glass window, and I could see my cousins playing outside down below. the house is in Michigan so it gets slightly chilly even in the end of August, and there was a slight breeze so I put on a jacket and ran to join them outside, skipping breakfast, not wanting to miss out on anything fun.

When I got down I could tell they weren’t playing but rather running to get my grandma. Her dogs–both of them–were dead, ripped up. That night we went to bed early. I woke up at maybe two in the morning because I felt something hit my head. My cousins were all sitting on the double bed opposite me on the other side of the room. There was one bunk bed and two double beds, the double beds for me and my fourteen year old cousin. They were being quiet and staring at me. The thirteen year old noddded his head toward the window. I froze. They all looked afraid. I turned my head slightly to the side and I saw a really messed up looking face pressed to the window with gaping eyes looking down at me. I screamed so ****ing loud, and it bolted. My grandma called the police after I told her what happened and they found nothing. I went home after that and I have never been there during the night again.

jimmer
21st October 2015, 00:21
one word: wow.

jimmer
6th November 2015, 19:34
time to wake up, ol' john keel, adventurer!

this clip from the john e. mack institute was released a couple of months ago.

it's a 1994 detroit USA morning television show.

two witnesses and john mack discuss the abduction phenomenon / conundrum.

it's quite interesting. mack's final summary is worth the wait.

as john keel might have asked:
are these visions and encounters simply a reminder that they are here and that we are not in charge?

click on the image to watch. (feel free to skip the commercial breaks ; )

http://awakenvideo.org/images/AlienAbductionMILABS/John-Mack.jpg (https://youtu.be/odhkvpe9FLU?t=7m1s)

jimmer
17th January 2016, 23:08
Yawwwwwn and a big stretch.

I got reacquainted with Nancy Talbot's work from her post on Mike Paterson's FB page.
It reminded me that we had discovered her research earlier on the thread, Sasquatch Vocalizations 4.0 (http://jandeane81.com/threads/7033-Sasquatch-Vocalizations-4-0?p=841940046&viewfull=1#post841940046).

Here is a presentation of her work, first on crop circles and later on the paranormal,
through the Holland psychic, Robbert van den Broeke.
They believe it's all connected: crop circles, strange lights in the sky, UFOs, ghosts -- all the high strangeness we witness.

Later in the presentation, Nancy details imposed images on secure cameras.
Most are images are of deceased people.
These images are copies or near copies of known published sources.
These imposed images have been miraculously 'repurposed.' (get your head around that one.)

What Nancy has chronicaled is other worldly.
Robbert believes it isn't necessarily extraterrestrial.
His term for it? The Other. (We Keelians might call that, Ultraterrestrial)
He believes it is totally kind and benevolent. (and quite the opposite from Keel's malevolent theory)
The big question is, could the Other represent both good and evil?

As you will discover, Nancy and Robbert believe it comes to us with Love.
The ending is quite touching.

(in 5 parts. be sure your browser is set to 'autoplay' and then hold on tight.)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rPMYEYckm78

Frances
18th January 2016, 01:02
Very interesting video Jimmer, I am eager to watch the rest of the presentation. Which I will do.
Frances.

Elen
18th January 2016, 13:26
Thanks Jimmer, I really enjoyed that and I watched the whole presentation. Great find and great share.
Elen

jimmer
18th January 2016, 15:40
Thanks Jimmer, I really enjoyed that and I watched the whole presentation. Great find and great share.
Elen

imposed images are one thing, but to find the images are 'repurposed', yet not hoaxed, is another.

that's what the strangest aspect is to me.

many detractors simply call it all rubbish, but if you trust nancy's testimony as being authentic, then it's a real brain buster and quite unique.

rubbish or real contact?

sandy
18th January 2016, 23:54
Interesting would be an understatement Jimmer.......watched them all>>> thanks for posting :)