Neo-Pagan Utopian Community

[Octopus Garden]

"In 1620 the Mayflower shepherded in the founders of Plymouth Plantation, and in 1630 the Arbela brought John Winthrop with his sermons about the “city on a hill”, but during the decade that separates these canonical arrivals a very different sort of English colonist would establish a very different sort of colony on the South Shore of Massachusetts.

Merrymount — founded as Mount Wollaston in 1624 near present-day Quincy, Massachusetts — was the brainchild of the Devonshire-born lawyer, raconteur, libertine, rake, and crypto-pagan Thomas Morton (1579–1647). His ideas for colonizing the New World were distinct from either the Plymouth or the Massachusetts Bay Colony.

While generations of historians have claimed that Americans are intellectually the descendants of stern Calvinist Puritans and Pilgrims, Morton (who stood in opposition to both groups) had his own ideas. The utopian Merrymount, it has long been argued, was a society built upon privileging art and poetry over industriousness and labor, and pursued a policy of intercultural harmony rather than white supremacy. The site where it stood — now an industrial area across the road from a Dunkin’ Donuts3 — once bore witness to a strange and beautiful alternative dream of what America could have been."

https://publicdomainreview.org/essay/lord-of-misrule-thomas-mortons-american-subversions

And here I thought Dunkin' Donuts was the very apex of culture if not pure sophisticated gastronomic delight!:D

I forgot to add, other than Findhorn my knowledge of European Utopian societies is limited. Were there many in Europe beginning in the 1600's?

[Dear Reader]

Protect Thyself

2522

[Emil El Zapato]

"In 1620 the Mayflower shepherded in the founders of Plymouth Plantation, and in 1630 the Arbela brought John Winthrop with his sermons about the “city on a hill”, but during the decade that separates these canonical arrivals a very different sort of English colonist would establish a very different sort of colony on the South Shore of Massachusetts.

Merrymount — founded as Mount Wollaston in 1624 near present-day Quincy, Massachusetts — was the brainchild of the Devonshire-born lawyer, raconteur, libertine, rake, and crypto-pagan Thomas Morton (1579–1647). His ideas for colonizing the New World were distinct from either the Plymouth or the Massachusetts Bay Colony.

While generations of historians have claimed that Americans are intellectually the descendants of stern Calvinist Puritans and Pilgrims, Morton (who stood in opposition to both groups) had his own ideas. The utopian Merrymount, it has long been argued, was a society built upon privileging art and poetry over industriousness and labor, and pursued a policy of intercultural harmony rather than white supremacy. The site where it stood — now an industrial area across the road from a Dunkin’ Donuts3 — once bore witness to a strange and beautiful alternative dream of what America could have been."

https://publicdomainreview.org/essay/lord-of-misrule-thomas-mortons-american-subversions

And here I thought Dunkin' Donuts was the very apex of culture if not pure sophisticated gastronomic delight!:D

I forgot to add, other than Findhorn my knowledge of European Utopian societies is limited. Were there many in Europe beginning in the 1600's?

Interesting story, for some reason I learned a history of May day that included 'communism' some how. Is that big in Russia? I remember as a kid making mayday baskets and surprise gifting neighbors with them. I'm so confuusssed. :)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qnVrjFSE1hA

[Aragorn]

Interesting story, for some reason I learned a history of May day that included 'communism' some how. Is that big in Russia? I remember as a kid making mayday baskets and surprise gifting neighbors with them. I'm so confuusssed. :)]

The 1st of May is International Workers' Day (International Workers Day), which the USA do not recognize and have supplanted with a festive day of their own, called "Law Day", so as to draw the US population's attention away from International Workers' Day ─ because it smelled like communism, you know?

[Lord Sidious]

Were there many in Europe beginning in the 1600's?

The church still had everyone by the balls in that period, although the renaissance was happening............

[Dear Reader]

First, you gotta power-up thysel

2523


And then, if you've got the minerals......... He's out there!

2524


That there Paganism is still alive and well 'round these parts.

[Emil El Zapato]

No thanks for me ...

[Octopus Garden]

I have mixed feelings about paganism. It is awe inspiring and intriguing on the one hand, but scary on the other.

As far as nature spirits and elves and fairies go, we may be immersed in that world, still, without being aware. Or it may be an omnijective phenomenon that requires input from humanity's mental realm so that it can differentiate from the larger universal mind. Or maybe...I could go on and on.

Some things can best be understood when stoned out of one's mind.


No thanks for me ...

What, no dancing around in forest glades like an actor in A Midsummer Night's Dream?

[Octopus Garden]

This is kind of funny

Typically a Utopian community will take at least a couple years to collapse, but Fruitlands got it all done in one. Founded in Harvard, Massachusetts in 1843, the philosophy of the commune started with Transcendentalist ideas and took them way farther than they should have. All residents were strict vegans who were allowed to drink only water, and no animal labor could be used in farming.

In addition, the residents were not allowed to plant root vegetables on the grounds that might disturb the worms. Needless to say, this didn't ensure for a healthy harvest, and by the winter of 1843 Fruitlands was without food entirely. The main farmhouse is now a museum.

https://www.pcmag.com/news/11-failed-utopias-you-can-visit

Surprised they didn't think carrot juice was murder.;)


Protect Thyself

2522

thanks Dear Reader. What does this say? And what area do you live in, as you mentioned it is still Pagan?

[Lord Sidious]

This is kind of funny

Typically a Utopian community will take at least a couple years to collapse, but Fruitlands got it all done in one. Founded in Harvard, Massachusetts in 1843, the philosophy of the commune started with Transcendentalist ideas and took them way farther than they should have. All residents were strict vegans who were allowed to drink only water, and no animal labor could be used in farming.

In addition, the residents were not allowed to plant root vegetables on the grounds that might disturb the worms. Needless to say, this didn't ensure for a healthy harvest, and by the winter of 1843 Fruitlands was without food entirely. The main farmhouse is now a museum.

https://www.pcmag.com/news/11-failed-utopias-you-can-visit

Surprised they didn't think carrot juice was murder.;)



thanks Dear Reader. What does this say? And what area do you live in, as you mentioned it is still Pagan?

It says in the post ''protect thyself''

[modwiz]

First, you gotta power-up thysel

2523


And then, if you've got the minerals......... He's out there!

2524


That there Paganism is still alive and well 'round these parts.

Sorry, Hebraic letters have no place in proper pagan traditions. They pre-dated the Hebrews and were a predominately oral transmission people.

However, since the topic is Neo-Pagainsm, then all bets are off.

I read runes of the Elder Futhark and was thrown by both the Kano/kenuz rune and the use of the Ing rune for a "Y" which would belong to the Yr rune.

Neo-Paganism is lost. There are hundreds of thousand of years behind the original 'pagan' tradition.

Pagan, from the Roman, 'pagani' denoted a 'rustic' or uncivilized Nature 'worshipper'. Untied to the statues of temples but profoundly united with well, springs, rivers and other sources of their well-being. People of the Land that sustained them. Before people of the sword broke that bond with the Earth.

Want to speak with Lord Sidious about this topic and with 21rst with century tech. Always fun when pagans discuss how others portray us. Unless they are, Neo-Pagan.:ttr:

[Emil El Zapato]

I have mixed feelings about paganism. It is awe inspiring and intriguing on the one hand, but scary on the other.

As far as nature spirits and elves and fairies go, we may be immersed in that world, still, without being aware. Or it may be an omnijective phenomenon that requires input from humanity's mental realm so that it can differentiate from the larger universal mind. Or maybe...I could go on and on.

Some things can best be understood when stoned out of one's mind.



What, no dancing around in forest glades like an actor in A Midsummer Night's Dream?

:)

One of my more lucid moments (as far as i'm concerned) :): There was a really nasty guy from Ireland working for a very nasty company in which I was doing a tech project. This was during Trump's reign of terror, anyway I'll have to leave out the context because I fo got what it was but:

It just popped into my head then and I wasn't really even trying to be ugly, it was kind of like when two people indulge in adultery and use the excuse, "it just happened":

"No matter how much one dances around with the fairies in the forests, it won't change reality"

[Dear Reader]

This is kind of funny

Typically a Utopian community will take at least a couple years to collapse, but Fruitlands got it all done in one. Founded in Harvard, Massachusetts in 1843, the philosophy of the commune started with Transcendentalist ideas and took them way farther than they should have. All residents were strict vegans who were allowed to drink only water, and no animal labor could be used in farming.

In addition, the residents were not allowed to plant root vegetables on the grounds that might disturb the worms. Needless to say, this didn't ensure for a healthy harvest, and by the winter of 1843 Fruitlands was without food entirely. The main farmhouse is now a museum.

https://www.pcmag.com/news/11-failed-utopias-you-can-visit

Surprised they didn't think carrot juice was murder.;)



thanks Dear Reader. What does this say? And what area do you live in, as you mentioned it is still Pagan?

Thanks OG.

On more than one occasion I've found evidence of 'rituals' that have taken place in the countryside after specific dates. Egg shells, a stuffed toad, which I foolishly took, sigils formed from stripped-bark saplings tied with animal intestine, etc, etc. The statue of the 'Big Fella' is from a place called Devil's Hole in Jersey, Channel Isles.

In fact, as is oft the case, here is a story of said 'Big Fella' from today's local newspaper:


FOR ten years or more it has lurked in the dark recesses of a warehouse…

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Randalls Brewery area manager Dave Cohen with the 'real' statue in the pond at the Priory Pub at Devil’s Hole


But now the devil is coming out of the shadows and taking up residence in a garden in Jersey, after hundreds of people offered him a home.

The giant statue of the Prince of Darkness – affectionately named Derek – is a replica of the statue near the Priory Inn at Devil’s Hole.

Derek has been in storage in a warehouse owned by pub chain Randalls since the company bought the Priory.

Now that Randalls is relocating from its premises in Clare Street it can no longer accommodate the 20ft fibreglass figure, so offered it free of charge to anyone who wanted it.

Immediately they received far more offers than they had expected.

A huge replica of Satan might not be everyone’s first choice of garden ornament. Yet it was put on Randalls’ Facebook page only yesterday and managing director Gavin Reid said: ‘It was phenomenal. We put it out there and I expected maybe ten or 12 people would be interested.

‘About 170 replied. Most of them wanted it or recommended people who might.’

He added: ‘We are relocating our warehouses and we haven’t got the space for it any more. Now someone else can enjoy it, rather than it just sitting indoors.’

They decided against placing the satanic statue in the grounds of another pub, like its brother at the Priory.

‘It doesn’t fit with our family-friendly image,’ Mr Reid said. ‘It might provoke some uncomfortable questions for parents to answer.’

The statue has been given away for free but Randalls suggested that its new owners could make a donation to Jersey Cheshire Home, the charity the firm is supporting this year.

It has been delivered to an Islander who intends to give it to a relative as a surprise gift – and so is remaining anonymous. The new owner has made a donation to the charity.

https://jerseyeveningpost.com/news/2020/11/27/devil-due-to-find-a-new-home-in-jersey/

To be fair, I always thought it was a statue of Pan.......... Am pretty sure it is. These Islands are full to the rim with Covens, both light and dark. A friend and I once found a hidden room with an alter behind a false wall in a big, sprawling farm house out in the countryside.

Then there is the (in) famous case of The Beast of Jersey. Edward Paisnel, a local, with very warped tendencies. He was allowed to roam the Island and invade childrens' bedrooms late at night for 11 years, allegedly protected by his 'brotheren' in high-up places. He was only caught by accident.

From Wiki: Edward John Louis Paisnel (1925 – 1994), dubbed the Beast of Jersey, was a notorious sex offender who terrorised the Channel Island of Jersey between 1960 and 1971. He entered homes at night dressed in a rubber mask and nail-studded wristlets, attacking women and children. His wife, Joan Paisnel, was the founder of a community home in Jersey where, at her request, he once played Santa Claus.

Further info: https://thetruecrimeenthusiast.co.uk/2017/02/13/the-beast-of-jersey/

Part of his outfit:

2526

Imagine that sicko entering your bedroom through the window in the dead of night.

No thanks.

[Emil El Zapato]

wow, excellent story ... :shocked:

[Octopus Garden]

Paganism leads to some excesses, no doubt, but strip a people of all sense of nature and the sensuous, repress the mysterious, the dark, the olde and you end up wit weird rapey culture, in a Mennonite colony called 'Manitoba' in Bolivia.

But in Manitoba, many people had for months - years even - lived with the knowledge that something was deeply amiss.

"In the night we heard the dogs bark, but when I went out, I couldn't see anything," says Abraham (not his real name), who was the father of teenaged daughters back in 2009.

https://www.bbc.com/news/stories-48265703

[Lord Sidious]

Want to speak with Lord Sidious about this topic and with 21rst with century tech. Always fun when pagans discuss how others portray us. Unless they are, Neo-Pagan.:ttr:

As you know, I have the runes in my skin, to the day this body dies............

[Octopus Garden]

'Dear Reader',

Thanks for the great story and for all of your input on this thread. It's fantastic. I composed a long response yesterday and then hit some key, by mistake and the whole thing disappeared.

And thank you everybody else and particularly Modwiz and Lord Sidious for input that is close to their hearts! I will try to find more in the way of interest to keep this thread as alive as the pantheon of Gods and nature spirits--that still exists within all of us, waiting to be kick started by text.:):)

[Octopus Garden]

I just want to quickly add that my great grandmother on my father's side was a pipe smoking midwife with Sammi heritage. When I told a Spanish friend this he told me that midwife is sometimes code for 'shaman.' I don't put too much stock in that story, but do feel very strongly that 2 of my siblings and myself are highly 'receptive.'

That is why the whole phenomenon of the occult and shamanism scares me so much. I am too open to it and though I have to credit what I call my guardian angels for working on my behalf -- the flipside of that coin is I can easily summon dark forces to work my will through as well. I never want to do this. I have only been temped twice in my life and never want to be tempted again.

[Emil El Zapato]

never never invoke the dark spirits ... no, no, no. It can be done and there is a huge amount of anecdotal evidence supporting that. I'm afraid to let the 'words' enter my thoughts even without active motivation. no, no, no ... that is asking for way more trouble than we alone can deal with. And there is a huge amount of anecdotal evidence for that as well.

if you have a gift then reassure yourself that is a gift from the light side.

[Octopus Garden]

NAP,

I agree completely. It is a terrible abuse. Had I acted on my impulses, it would have been with the spirit of just retaliation. But...it's never wise, because even if you have been targeted by a psychopath, for example, you end up acting like one yourself through negative occult action. I imagine you can also lose control of any negative agenda you implement and then the chain reaction could be truly dire.

[Emil El Zapato]

yes, I had a girlfriend that claimed she had a witch put a spell on me. After dragging me through the infernal mud, her hair fell out... I never once let myself think that she deserved it, i was just sorta happy that it happened. And so, I just continued to entertain my fantasies of killing her ... :)

[Octopus Garden]

The psychopath who burnt me, has moved to the most dangerous fire zone in the U.S. Ironic, isn't it? No need to get a voodoo doll and set it on fire! And I have to admit that when I read about major fires in his region and see that his specific area hasn't been mentioned in evacuations, I feel just a tad let down. I think this is acceptable. Don't want to see him hurt, just inconvenienced.;)

[Emil El Zapato]

ahhh, lol... yeah that seems fair...

[Octopus Garden]

yes, I had a girlfriend that claimed she had a witch put a spell on me. After dragging me through the infernal mud, her hair fell out... I never once let myself think that she deserved it, i was just sorta happy that it happened. And so, I just continued to entertain my fantasies of killing her ... :)

Oh, that is so damned funny.

[Elen]

This movie is based on one of the Fairy-Tales that I was brought up with (bottle-fed on).

"The Ash Lad"

Norwegian Fairy-Tales are full of symbolism and teaches that the smallest thing can have the greatest value and consequence in life. They could be really scary for the mind of a child .

Trolls!


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l68a7v4u8MM

[Emil El Zapato]

I love Troll movies ... Tramp, tramp, tramp went billy goat gruff (or something like that) :)

[Emil El Zapato]

the movie looks very stylish ... I'm surprised I've never even heard of it.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xnxWzB-ba7c

[Elen]

Very good...another Fairy Tale. It's a good thing that Trolls are very stupid. :grin:

[Emil El Zapato]

The movie was surprisingly good ... the cinematography was very good...beautiful even. The colors were so rich, I wonder if that was an effect or the true colors.

[Octopus Garden]

Thanks Elen,

I can't wait to watch that movie!

[Octopus Garden]

Natural History of Trolls

The older the stories, the more information you can find regarding their daily life, and, dare I say, the biology and natural history of the trolls. Some researchers have even suggested, that Scandinavian stories about trolls are equivalent to the tales of Bigfoot, Sasquatch, Almas, and Orang Pendeks from other parts of the world.

https://samizdatpress.typepad.com/spring_summer_hamilton_ar/the-natural-history-of-trolls-by-lars-thomas-2.html

[Dreamtimer]

I started the movie. It's very good so far, but I'm still at the beginning.

I loved the Billy Goats Gruff story when I was a child.

[Emil El Zapato]

I still like it, but the book was better. :)

[Dear Reader]

'Dear Reader',

Thanks for the great story and for all of your input on this thread. It's fantastic. I composed a long response yesterday and then hit some key, by mistake and the whole thing disappeared.

And thank you everybody else and particularly Modwiz and Lord Sidious for input that is close to their hearts! I will try to find more in the way of interest to keep this thread as alive as the pantheon of Gods and nature spirits--that still exists within all of us, waiting to be kick started by text.:):)

Thank you OG.

Likewise.

[Lord Sidious]

And thank you everybody else and particularly Modwiz and Lord Sidious for input that is close to their hearts!
Load of rubbish............

[Octopus Garden]

Care to explain that remark?

[Emil El Zapato]

Hi OG,

That's Australian for thank you. :)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lw8J0rkAVs4

[Lord Sidious]

Hi OG,

That's Australian for thank you. :)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lw8J0rkAVs4

Second hand horse piss.................

[Emil El Zapato]

lol ... :)

[Dear Reader]

What's a hospice?

[Emil El Zapato]

a place for those that overindulge in Foster's Lager... How come your American dialect is so good DR?

[Dear Reader]

a place for those that overindulge in Foster's Lager... How come your American dialect is so good DR?

Not even near....... It's about 3 gallons!


Accent? Moi??

No, no Señorita.... I is a chameleon.

A Karma Chameleon:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JmcA9LIIXWw


All joking apart, how do you get a sense of an accent from internet writings? I'm British, but within that is the usual mix of direct Celt and English (whatever the heck that is).

I think, strongly, that I haven't been "here" before....... It's all new. I'm not a wise, old soul, if ya catch ma drift.

[Emil El Zapato]

ya, I catch your drift ... actually, I pick up from your writing ways of 'saying' things that I would use. I have an excuse, though ... :) I grew up in different environments ranging from southern to New Yorker and with a lot of reading, I picked up a box of ways of expressing things depending on my mood ... :)

[Octopus Garden]

Hi OG,

That's Australian for thank you. :)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lw8J0rkAVs4

Oh, I get it. Well f**k you, Sidious. My way of saying, "you're welcome." :scrhd::D:D

[Octopus Garden]

What's a hospice?

It's where people go to die. Based around keeping terminal patients comfortable and pain free until death, but not extending life, just for the sake of extending life.

Your question brought to mind this scene from the movie Airplane.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VOmD-xqK2Es

[Emil El Zapato]

that's a classic movie ... I've seen it i don't know how many times ... :)

[Octopus Garden]

I've probably seen it 10 times!

[Emil El Zapato]

funniest movie ever ... :)

[Lord Sidious]

What's a hospice?

It's where people with a sad sense of humour go for ''rehumouring''


I'm British,

I won't hold that against you for too long.
Long enough for an airstrike maybe............


Oh, I get it. Well f**k you, Sidious.

Sorry, I was never in the navy and the navy was never in me.
So, yeah.............nah

[Dreamtimer]

I'm watching Ashlad. The witch with the big nose is pretty funny.

"Methinks it's a toof" Lol

"No big hug. Go for a run!" Lol

Good movie and good fun. Thanks, Elen!