Racism

[Chris]

Race, racism and racialism have all been in the news lately and it got me wondering. Is racism, or in other words, discrimination by race, ever justified?

I live in a comfortably racist society, where most people casually hold racist views that would shock people from other cultures. In other words, most people here are not only racist, but comfortable with their racism and treat it as matter-of-fact that people from other races are not only discriminated against, but this is how it should be. Don’t get me wrong, there’s very little actual violence against people from other racial backgrounds (unlike in the US, Brazil or South Africa), but people accept it as fully natural and just a fact of life that some races are more equal than others.

We have a particular issue here with discrimination against the Roma, who are an untouchable (Dalit) nomadic ethnic group that migrated from South Asia many centuries ago. They were heavily discriminated against even in their original homeland and still are today, even more so than in Europe actually. Endless studies were done and many initiatives launched to try and integrate this nomadic group into mainstream society, but by-and-large, they have failed. Some cities have built walls to try and segregate Roma areas from „white” ones and no sane Hungarian parent would want their children to go to a school with a heavy Roma presence. The problems of trying to integrate US blacks into mainstream society seem to face similar hurdles. In Singapore, integrating Muslim Malays into Chinese-majority institutions has proven similarly challenging and unsuccessful.

Ethnic or racial quotas don’t seem to work and just create resentment from other racial groups. Positive discrimination towards one group necessarily entails negative discrimination towards another, by way of simple arithmetics. In the US, Asians seem to suffer from this type of discrimination quite heavily and before them it was Jews that were discriminated against in this way, by setting ethnic quotas that were designed to reduce their presence, particularly in Ivy-League universities.

So, in other words, the issue is this:

Should some ethnic groups be punished for their success (chiefly Jews, Asians and Europeans), so that other ethnic and / or racial groups can be rewarded for their failure? Is this an ethical thing to do?

I would welcome your input and thoughts on this issue.

[Catsquotl]

Here's a little something I wrote this morning.

________
Ok so human beings can be differentiated in terms of race, gender, IQ, upper body muscle strength, length of there big toe etc etc.

I hope everybody here will come to the conclusion that although every human being is different, unique and an individual who most likely just wants to have some peace, some fun, experiences of beauty, wonder and feel loved.

How do we build a society in which every one can feel equally worthy.
An argument I am hearing lately is that the freedoms of western society today are that this society will reward anyone who is capable of contributing to society based on their skills.
I feel this is where so called inequality comes from. Not race or one of the others but the idea that I deserve more, because of my contribution to society or some foolish notion like that.

The idea of pulling oneself up by his bootstraps and build something of value for themselves( over the backs of someone else which is usually forgotten) is ludicrous to me.
The self made man/woman. ridiculous..

We all need each other (even when we think we don't)

Inequality, racism and whatever dichotomy one can think of exists, even in some institutions so The word systemic can be bastardized in such contexts.
But again...

Where to go from here and start "rewarding" people for being people instead of what they bring to the table..
At least to some level the can stop struggling and fighting to make ends meet.

And this alas will mean that we have to think long and hard as a society what luxurious goods we really need, which of them cause suffering. and be ready to give them up at some point..

WIth Love
Eelco

[Chris]

Here's a little something I wrote this morning.

________
Ok so human beings can be differentiated in terms of race, gender, IQ, upper body muscle strength, length of there big toe etc etc.

I hope everybody here will come to the conclusion that although every human being is different, unique and an individual who most likely just wants to have some peace, some fun, experiences of beauty, wonder and feel loved.

How do we build a society in which every one can feel equally worthy.
An argument I am hearing lately is that the freedoms of western society today are that this society will reward anyone who is capable of contributing to society based on their skills.
I feel this is where so called inequality comes from. Not race or one of the others but the idea that I deserve more, because of my contribution to society or some foolish notion like that.

The idea of pulling oneself up by his bootstraps and build something of value for themselves( over the backs of someone else which is usually forgotten) is ludicrous to me.
The self made man/woman. ridiculous..

We all need each other (even when we think we don't)

Inequality, racism and whatever dichotomy one can think of exists, even in some institutions so The word systemic can be bastardized in such contexts.
But again...

Where to go from here and start "rewarding" people for being people instead of what they bring to the table..
At least to some level the can stop struggling and fighting to make ends meet.

And this alas will mean that we have to think long and hard as a society what luxurious goods we really need, which of them cause suffering. and be ready to give them up at some point..

WIth Love
Eelco

It seems the dichotomy you are pointing out here is between Capitalism vs Socialism as well as Collectivism vs Individualism. I believe a balance between these opposing forces can be achieved. European social democracies, such as Denmark, are actually quite close to achieving some sort of stable equilibrium and thus social harmony, combined with prosperity. But that leaves aside the topic of race and ethnicity as Denmark is mostly homogenuous. It is much more difficult to achieve this in ethnically and racially diverse, multicultural societies. Singapore is probably closest, but it is actually Chinese-dominated and has utilised all the powers and tools of authoritarianism to achieve it.

[Emil El Zapato]

Here is what I see as the major flaw in your conjecture Chris and is a bad place to start a discussion:

"Punished for success" ... I agree with Cats thought about how we judge human value ... Some people have money, some people don't, but all people have value. Roma as you point out are of South Asian origin but aren't many South Asians 'successful' ... I'll give my straight truth here. I've worked with many East Asians and South Asians over time and I can tell you that generally the South Asians will kick the East Asians ass. Straight truth. What is the biggest difference between East Asians and South Asians? From your perspective Chris, it is skin tone.

Did you ever watch those videos I posted in the Chaos thread regarding the evolution of human categorization and how the signifying differences changed from cultural to biological. Those videos are extremely worthwhile.

The point is that culture can be changed, biology cannot.

[Catsquotl]

I am really thinking globally.
Now I am not a scholar, but it seems to me that the so called wealth over here in the west(which includes Denmark) has been slowly amassed over the backs of so called 3d world countries.

Racism has been a great part of how this was achieved. Religion another.

For myself I am by no means holier than the pope and do enjoy many a luxury denied to many.

Still equality based for every human being on earth to me seems the only cause worth fighting. However when zooming out to encompass such a task one would quickly realize we need the plant and animal kingdoms to thrive as well...

[Lord Sidious]

It seems the dichotomy you are pointing out here is between Capitalism vs Socialism as well as Collectivism vs Individualism. I believe a balance between these opposing forces can be achieved. European social democracies, such as Denmark, are actually quite close to achieving some sort of stable equilibrium and thus social harmony, combined with prosperity. But that leaves aside the topic of race and ethnicity as Denmark is mostly homogenuous. It is much more difficult to achieve this in ethnically and racially diverse, multicultural societies. Singapore is probably closest, but it is actually Chinese-dominated and has utilised all the powers and tools of authoritarianism to achieve it.

Danmark isn't as homogenous as you might think, but hey, it all still works.
Is Danmark
Is good..............

Oh as for the premise, the answer isn't equality, but equity

[Catsquotl]

Equality, equity.

Same same

It's one of those nuance things which I regularly forget.
But equity is the way we perceive and value others correct?
Equality more the ability to have access to the same stuff?

[Aragorn]

Equality, equity.

Same same

It's one of those nuance things which I regularly forget.
But equity is the way we perceive and value others correct?
Equality more the ability to have access to the same stuff?

Source: The Free Dictionary (https://www.thefreedictionary.com/equity)



eq·ui·ty
n. pl. eq·ui·ties


1. The state or quality of being just and fair.
2. Something that is just and fair.
3. Law

a. Justice achieved not simply according to the strict letter of the law but in accordance with principles of substantial justice and the unique facts of the case.
b. See court of equity (https://www.thefreedictionary.com/court+of+equity).
c. An equitable right or claim: an analysis of the equities and inequities brought about by the current trade bill.
4.

a. Ownership interest in a corporation, property, or other holding, usually calculated as the value of the holding after subtracting any debt or liabilities.
b. equities Shares of common stock or preferred stock.
5. The value of a brand's reputation.


adj.


1. Representing an ownership interest: an equity stake.
2. Of or relating to stocks: an equity mutual fund.
3. Subordinated to all other claims on income, earnings, or assets: the equity tranche.


Source: The Free Dictionary (https://www.thefreedictionary.com/equity)

[Emil El Zapato]

Hey that's pretty good, and perhaps a way to re-frame the old argument.

[Chris]

I am really thinking globally.
Now I am not a scholar, but it seems to me that the so called wealth over here in the west(which includes Denmark) has been slowly amassed over the backs of so called 3d world countries.

Racism has been a great part of how this was achieved. Religion another.

For myself I am by no means holier than the pope and do enjoy many a luxury denied to many.

Still equality based for every human being on earth to me seems the only cause worth fighting. However when zooming out to encompass such a task one would quickly realize we need the plant and animal kingdoms to thrive as well...

I'm not so sure about that.

It is a common trope of the Left, but the evidence for it is thin on the ground. Other factors seem far more important in creating wealth and the richest countries in the world didn't have much of a colonial empire. You could say that the one European country that still has extensive colonial possessions is Russia and yet it is relatively poor.

[Chris]

Here is what I see as the major flaw in your conjecture Chris and is a bad place to start a discussion:

"Punished for success" ... I agree with Cats thought about how we judge human value ... Some people have money, some people don't, but all people have value. Roma as you point out are of South Asian origin but aren't many South Asians 'successful' ... I'll give my straight truth here. I've worked with many East Asians and South Asians over time and I can tell you that generally the South Asians will kick the East Asians ass. Straight truth. What is the biggest difference between East Asians and South Asians? From your perspective Chris, it is skin tone.

I beg to differ.

I've lived in both India (South Asia) and Singapore (Southeast Asia, but with a majority East Asian population).

Skin tone is a signifier of the climactic conditions under which a population has originally evolved and that certainly has a lasting effect overall.

The point about the Roma I was trying to make is that they don't exactly fit in in South Asia either. They are Dalits or Untouchables and they can't even drink from the same well as those of a higher caste. In India, caste and race often run parallel to each other and it is probably the most racist society on earth. They are actually the ones obsessed with skin tone and this is a general problem in Asia, where a lighter skin tone is supposed to signify beauty, wealth, status and even godliness.

[Lord Sidious]

Equality, equity.

Same same

It's one of those nuance things which I regularly forget.
But equity is the way we perceive and value others correct?
Equality more the ability to have access to the same stuff?

Vastly different.
See attached pic for details.
https://images2.minutemediacdn.com/image/upload/c_crop,h_1616,w_2400,x_0,y_132/v1591824036/shape/mentalfloss/625404-iisc_equalityequity_300ppi.jpg?itok=mdurY8vk

[Emil El Zapato]

I beg to differ.

I've lived in both India (South Asia) and Singapore (Southeast Asia, but with a majority East Asian population).

Skin tone is a signifier of the climactic conditions under which a population has originally evolved and that certainly has a lasting effect overall.

The point about the Roma I was trying to make is that they don't exactly fit in in South Asia either. They are Dalits or Untouchables and they can't even drink from the same well as those of a higher caste. In India, caste and race often run parallel to each other and it is probably the most racist society on earth. They are actually the ones obsessed with skin tone and this is a general problem in Asia, where a lighter skin tone is supposed to signify beauty, wealth, status and even godliness.

Russia is a relative latecomer to the game of owning the world. They missed their window of opportunity as those days are long gone. It doesn't seem to stop them from trying though, but there was until Trump too much opposition to them doing so.

Some of my Chinese female friends were frightening in their pallor. They almost looked like they needed a blood transfusion. They didn't seem to mind, though.

None of this is new to me Chris ... one is either okay with miscegenation or one is not. As you described your home environment, it has parallels to small town America, really just provincialism and a fear of difference.

[Chris]

Russia is a relative latecomer to the game of owning the world. They missed their window of opportunity as those days are long gone. It doesn't seem to stop them from trying though, but there was until Trump too much opposition to them doing so.

Some of my Chinese female friends were frightening in their pallor. They almost looked like they needed a blood transfusion. They didn't seem to mind, though.

None of this is new to me Chris ... one is either okay with miscegenation or one is not. As you described your home environment, it has parallels to small town America, really just provincialism and a fear of difference.

What I meant was that Russia still owns and controls North Asia, including the indigenous people that live there and is still a hegemon in Central Asia, where it was the colonial overlord for centuries. It has no more business being in North Asia than Britain had being in India. Like I said, Russia is the last remaining European Colonial Power, even if much weakened.

[Emil El Zapato]

ok ... :)

[Catsquotl]

Vastly different.
See attached pic for details.
https://images2.minutemediacdn.com/image/upload/c_crop,h_1616,w_2400,x_0,y_132/v1591824036/shape/mentalfloss/625404-iisc_equalityequity_300ppi.jpg?itok=mdurY8vk

Thanks, Some say a pic can speak a 1000 words..
But I understand the difference now.

I'll keep that in mind..

[Wind]

Where racism and nationalism can lead to:
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-bosnia-srebrenica-march-idUSKBN249254


http://youtu.be/lug4CxhRp_8

[Elen]

Vastly different.
See attached pic for details.
https://images2.minutemediacdn.com/image/upload/c_crop,h_1616,w_2400,x_0,y_132/v1591824036/shape/mentalfloss/625404-iisc_equalityequity_300ppi.jpg?itok=mdurY8vk

Truly wonderfully shown. Now you've become a nugget!

[Chris]

Where racism and nationalism can lead to:
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-bosnia-srebrenica-march-idUSKBN249254


http://youtu.be/lug4CxhRp_8

Well, actually, Bosnia is a perfect example of not race-based, but religion-based violence.

For all intents and purposes Bosniaks, Croats and Serbs are the same people, they only really differ from each other in their religion, which has also led to cultural differences over time.

If anything, Yugoslavia was a perfect example of a lack of genuine or failed nationalism, because the Yugoslavs are more or less the same people in terms of their genetic origin and language, it is their religious, cultural and historical differences that drove them apart and made it impossible to keep the country together.

[Lord Sidious]

Truly wonderfully shown. Now you've become a nugget!

I don't think so Tim...............



For all intents and purposes Bosniaks, Croats and Serbs are the same people, they only really differ from each other in their religion, which has also led to cultural differences over time.

I would pay big money to see you say that in Sarajevo, Belgrade and Zagreb............

[Dreamtimer]

Ok so human beings can be differentiated in terms of race, gender, IQ, upper body muscle strength, length of there big toe etc etc.

My son totally wins in the big toe category. ;)

Post number 2, beautiful. :love::cool:

Equity. Yes. :thup: I had to look at that equality/equity cartoon way longer than I should have... More coffee will equalize my brain. ;)


My brother is now telling his daughter that he doesn't think very many people are racist in America. I happen to know that he knows better than that. I'm not sure why he chooses to BS his daughter but what's worse is that he may be trying to BS his own self.

Denying reality does not change it.

I feel like Indians are trapping themselves in their karmic circle by still having castes and untouchables. I did not know that the origins of the Roma were the Dalits.

We certainly have plenty of racism here in America. And I celebrate every mixed couple I see. The more the better.

The weird thing about racism is that it can have almost nothing to do with race. Like a white person looking at someone as 'white trash'.

And political prejudices look just like racial ones. Folks who hate other folks because they're from a different part of the political spectrum is much the same dynamic. It's just a different set of name-calling.

Humans seem to like to divide themselves up into groups. Neighborhoods. Sports teams. Political groups. Tribes of all kinds.

Does that naturally lead to racism? I don't think so. I think some folks naturally want to be with "people like me", and some folks want to meet people who are new and different.

Prosperity in a culture and society necessitate, imo, lessening of racism. Folks need to work together to achieve prosperity and racism gets in the way. It's a hindrance to advancement.

In fact, I believe that less racism would help the environment. Respect for all life would bring true prosperity, imho.

:love:

[Chris]

I don't think so Tim...............


I would pay big money to see you say that in Sarajevo, Belgrade and Zagreb............

That is exactly the issue. Same as Northern Ireland actually. We are talking about essentially the same people divided by religion.

[Emil El Zapato]

I debated whether to post this here or not, in da end it was just easier...I'm sure Chris would approve of my Mexican nature's penchant for taking siestas during the middle of the day ... :)

This is a safer copy of my latest DNA test. Notice the Alien DNA portion that I requested (Peruvian) as a joke. Other tests I've taken had no inkling of such but as the lead geneticist conducting the research is Russian, I'm not terribly surprised perhaps even delighted. :)

Incidentally, I am a classic product of miscegenation, accepted by no one ... <sniff> <sniff> No not really, it's more like a big lol (So Ise don't be accused of victim mentalation)

2463

Hi DT

"Equity. Yes. I had to look at that equality/equity cartoon way longer than I should have... More coffee will equalize my brain."

I don't think it is immediately obvious, it is a loaded image with a lot to digest but in the end it says it all really.

that's a good point about Ireland, but I just wonder if one looked deeper that it would be just a matter of religion...I find that a bit difficult to believe.

[Wind]

Mucho loco, NAP? ;)

Did you know that because of those DNA tests they've been able to catch serial killers like the Golden State Killer (https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2018/10/we-will-find-you-dna-search-used-nab-golden-state-killer-can-home-about-60-white) too?

To me the idea of racism is so ludicrous that I don't even know where to begin. Bodies are our temples and vehicles, but we are not our bodies. I've come to the conclusion that too many people are either too superficial and dumb or both when they draw conclusions about superiority or inferiority based on the pigment of a skin or ethnic profile. I was once an asian, then an arab and now I am a white male.

Is that what I truly am or am I more than that? Am I what is on the inside, that which is eternal? That which is all of us.

[Emil El Zapato]

I do know about that, which is why I would never post to that open DNA resource...mucho problematico ... :)

Good point, you gave me a reason to follow up on my post: Genotype vs. Phenotype. It does point to the silliness of it all. I've been told that I look like anything but a white boy which is true. It is a weird combination of factors that produces my phenotype. My German/Irish/English mother's very curly hair and my Mestizo (Spanish/Indian) father's dark skin. It makes me look like anything the perceiver wishes to perceive. The genesis of Racism is not race, it is the subconscious rejection of 'difference'. To end it, all we have to do is make the subconscious a conscious awareness. But that takes effort and many just don't have the motivation to do it. Perhaps because of mental laziness and a lack of self-awareness (Intrapersonal intelligence).

[Wind]

I'm relatively interested in discovering my genetic ancestry, but I don't really trust those DNA companies with my data.

I think the results could be boring, I might have some German, Irish and Russian ancestors. Hard to say if there would be any suprises.

[Emil El Zapato]

:) Which is why so many people are surprised ... :) Not all of them good, trust me on that one.

I think the companies honor their pledge to not share the DNA without permission. But I really have to doubt it in all honesty.

[Lord Sidious]

That is exactly the issue. Same as Northern Ireland actually. We are talking about essentially the same people divided by religion.

The prods in the north are ethnic Scots, brought over in the 1600's
I think that's strike 2, nugg

[Chris]

The prods in the north are ethnic Scots, brought over in the 1600's
I think that's strike 2, nugg

Yes, I know, exactly my point. Celts are Celts. Scots and Irish only became different people because they settled on different islands originally and ended up following different religions. Any other differences between them are superfluous.

That is the entire problem with tribalism, people put themselves into these arbitrary categories when actually they have more in common with the supposed enemy than they realise.

It is a similar story here in central Europe, the only real difference between different nationalities is language and religion, which is important, granted, but not enough to hate people over.

Another example is Ukrainians vs Russians, there's a stupid feud if there ever was one, they don't even differ from each other in language that much.

[Elen]

Yes, I know, exactly my point. Celts are Celts. Scots and Irish only became different people because they settled on different islands originally and ended up following different religions. Any other differences between them are superfluous.

Very often I discover Norwegian words here in Scotland, especially from people who are set in their old ways. I guess the borders were different back then.

[Lord Sidious]

Very often I discover Norwegian words here in Scotland, especially from people who are set in their old ways. I guess the borders were different back then.

As you would know, Norwegians and Danes ruled the entire area, including the islands

[Dreamtimer]

That means that my Scottish and Danish blood are part of the same group ultimately. And my French blood is the outsider, most likely. I have not done any DNA testing.

I think we can blame the English for the 'troubles'. They're the force multiplier behind the conflicts in Ireland. They dominated the Scots culturally and religiously, and they tried to kill off the Irish.


I see you're working on your Aiawanese, NAP. Is that multidimensional chess on your avatar?


I agree that racism is just stupid. I would love to see how much 'minority' blood is inside of folks who cling so dearly to their racism. More than they would be comfortable with, no doubt.

[Emil El Zapato]

many of them have 'other' blood, it is just the way it is. Neanderthal is about as outre as it gets ... :)

my avatar is a snapshot of a Chess chat application that I started building... It ended the way most things do... :) A nice thought but ultimately useless. But I AM better for the 'space' it inhabits, per Eckhart Tolle. :)

[Dreamtimer]

Well, it's cool because it's totally unique.

[Wind]

I agree that racism is just stupid. I would love to see how much 'minority' blood is inside of folks who cling so dearly to their racism. More than they would be comfortable with, no doubt.


http://youtu.be/pLoel5EKT34

[Emil El Zapato]

Well, it's cool because it's totally unique.

thanks, I was pleased with the 'look' that was developing.

[Dreamtimer]

He tries to say that 14% is statistical noise. That's where I laughed out loud. Which percentage of himself did he blame that gaffe on?

[Lord Sidious]

http://youtu.be/pLoel5EKT34

Believe it or not, I know Craig.
We called him Chain.
When I saw this back when it was on, I laughed, because I know how he is under the fake smiles..........

[Emil El Zapato]

Wow, now that is a claim to fame... for real.

[Dreamtimer]

And how is he under those fake smiles? Inquiring minds want to know. :eyebrows:


We would do well to regularly remind ourselves (humans) that purebred means genetic diseases caused by too much genetic similarity.

Inbreeding.

It happens with jews, amish, mennonite, royals, and any other group who wants their blood to be 'pure'.

Lol - black correspondent for Hannity.

[Lord Sidious]

And how is he under those fake smiles? Inquiring minds want to know. :eyebrows:


We would do well to regularly remind ourselves (humans) that purebred means genetic diseases caused by too much genetic similarity.

Inbreeding.

It happens with jews, amish, mennonite, royals, and any other group who wants their blood to be 'pure'.

Lol - black correspondent for Hannity.

He's as racist as fuck and absolutely hates anyone black

[Dreamtimer]

I wonder if Darryl Davis could win Craig over? Darryl befriended a number of white supremacists and KKK who eventually left their groups and their prejudice behind.

They gave Darryl their robes.

I posted about him on the Rogan thread. Joe had him on his podcast.

[Emil El Zapato]

I saw one case on Ancestry.com where a seeming full caucasian had received his results and all of his close relatives where black. He had pleaded to support to explain what had happened. He seemed distressed to the point of desperation. It was very funny and very sad simultaneously. Really!


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f2mfRHKi4ik

[Lord Sidious]

I wonder if Darryl Davis could win Craig over? Darryl befriended a number of white supremacists and KKK who eventually left their groups and their prejudice behind.

They gave Darryl their robes.

I posted about him on the Rogan thread. Joe had him on his podcast.

Darryl is a top guy, but even he can't do it

[Dreamtimer]

Some folks are wedded to their opinions, come hell or high water.

[Emil El Zapato]

I had an acquaintance, I hestitate to call him a friend because he was flat out crazy, his father had spent a lot of time institutionalized and it was in the genes. We were working in a place that fabricated steel works for bridges that was predominately black in location and workers. He made a crazy statement at work one day, that he was a card carrying member of the KKK, it didn't go over very well.

He bought a handgun and sequestered himself in his apartment (we were living in the same building) waiting for the N's to show up. They did but apparently he scared them off with threats about his gun. Later he ended up in an argument with his ex who was at the time sharing his apartment, he shot up the apartment and threatened to kill his ex. Later yet he shot himself 'by accident', for the 2nd time in his life.

There are many stories surrounding this guy, like the time he and his dad got into a Texas Death Match in the front of the apartment building in Wichita Kansas though :) His dad showed up dressed in several layers of clothes looking like he was going on Safari armed with a butcher knife. Dave defended himself with a large wrench, with a hysterical laugh he related how he had literally knocked his dad out of his shoes.

I could go on for hours. I was never so happy to dissociate from a raving lunatic.

[Elen]

I was never so happy to dissociate from a raving lunatic.

That is a safe bet! :blink:

[Emil El Zapato]

I had met him through a friend of a friend kind of thing back in my hometown. Dave had a friend that was a bona fide psychopath...a lot of stories there also. This friend of mine was from Wichita Kansas and at one point we decided to move to Wichita and look for work and so we started up a small home remodel contracting business. Lo and behold one day Dave showed up at our doorstep. I remember thinking even then, Oh God, here we go and sure as hell we went. What a nightmare. His ex would hitchhike around Wichita and actually hitched a ride with a guy that was on his way to perpetrate mass murder, she spent a day at the local police offices 'splaining her story.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bIAghcvzJ8c

Funny, I remember it happening around noon...

My brother worked in that building in the background for 20 years, 20 years after the shooting

It occurred to me that even today, I still have nightmares about that period of my life...it was a very traumatic time, I wasn't working in my hometown because I essentially developed anxiety attacks after my brother's home had been totally destroyed in a tornado. He was missing for about 15 hours and I feared he had been killed and swept down the nearby river or buried in the rubble. His wife, whose daughter lives in the Houston area now and is currently infected with the Hoax along with her husband, was injured and was sent to the hospital along with her injured mother. It was not a pleasant time. :) Total truth be told, I couldn't talk about all that for years because if i tried I would verge on tears and oh my God, men don't cry. I faced myself that day of the tornado and what I saw I detested.

oh yeah, on topic ... :) my younger brother has always been less of a racist than i (he looks like a regular white boy) but he has had his moments as a superintendent of a beef processing plant. I just never knew better for a long while, but I was never in to blind hatred.

[Dreamtimer]

Sometimes you just need to look at things squarely. Head on.

https://images.dailykos.com/images/849584/large/PleaseStandMark824.jpg?1598658291

[Emil El Zapato]

There is no hope, DT ...

The latest I've heard is that the American people are getting bored hearing about basic human decency and equal treatment under the constitution of the United States. Many never tire of 'living' their right to tote automatic weapons and having the right to yell 'n***er, sp*c, fa**ot, Irishman :). But equal dignity to all humans, naw, that's boring sh*t. That speaks 'animal' so loudly.

Biden has lost ground because of boredom.

[Wind]

X4G7asMHqZ4

[Emil El Zapato]

I started 'thinking' fascism about 14 years ago...I started saying it about 12 years ago, In truth, it started in earnest under Reagan, as he was enabled by such as those as Patrick Buchanan

[Emil El Zapato]

Scary stuff and I ain't lying.

[Octopus Garden]

I wish all of those who get all hyped up over anti-fa would get half as hyped up over fa! The same people who are pretty much crowing for a complete domestic fascist overthrow (already their foreign policy) are going to suffer the most under a 'fa' regime. On the other forum, the ones who are all pro-fa are also anti-Christian and live near poverty level, by some of the remarks if I remember correctly.

It's the poor who are going to suffer the most--and if you're not Christian, well they have plans for you, with regards singing for your supper, essentially...with a lot of hallelujah's thrown in. And if you are morbidly obese? ummm...also ungood in a fascist regime that has contempt for 'weakness.'

Not going to play out well for the expendable pro Trump base, once he is in for a second term.