decisions of the Medieval Church still impact on the West

[Border Dog]

According to a study published in the Science Magazine (https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2019/11/how-early-christian-church-gave-birth-today-s-weird-europeans), the actions and conduct of the Catholic Church during the Middle Ages (476-1492) have influenced the behavior of Western Europeans to this day, especially with regard to marriage and family structures.

During the medieval period, the Church was the largest landholder in the West, setting itself as one of the great authorities of its time.

According to the study, these Church Decrees made much of the WEIRD population replace their close relationships with their relatives, with smaller and more independent families.

This kind of behavior would later have been transmitted to the descendants of these peoples, who consequently became more individualistic and more likely to relate to complete strangers.

Remember that the descendants of these societies were responsible for invading and colonizing North and South America between the fourteenth and eighteenth centuries (from XIV to XVIII).

[Aianawa]

Imo the middle ages are very veiled, did it even happen in the timeline above ?, everdance suggest a differing data the more we dig = Femenko https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Chronology_%28Fomenko%29

[Border Dog]

According each historical context focus, we can set arbitrary date points.

Although past facts do not change, the way of telling them may change, as appropriate to the context

[Aianawa]

Nope, when you say we, you mean what you have data consumed, correct ?.

[Malisa]

According each historical context focus, we can set arbitrary date points.

Although past facts do not change,

Not really, history can be rewritten because we find that it was told wrong in the first place, most of modern history is not really what happened but what whoever wrote it wanted it to be, even if that meant lying their asses off to the entire world

Eventually it can be found that they lied when writing their history books, then history was not "a fact" at all, these days we should know better about "historical facts"

[Border Dog]

Not really, history can be rewritten because we find that it was told wrong in the first place, most of modern history is not really what happened but what whoever wrote it wanted it to be, even if that meant lying their asses off to the entire world


I see we are talking the same thing:

The past fact not change, althought the way of describing It may change (according the context of who describes it).

When I refered to Facts, I do not refered to opinions, impressions or further interpretations.

For example -- I ate a piece of cake ( a simple past fact )

If I ate it because the cake was tasty, this is related to the fact, but it is not the fact itself.
Someone else who doesn't like cake, ate It because feel hungry, not because the cake is tasty.

So, please, look to my words you quoted again:
According each historical context, we can set Arbitrary Points, although the (past) facts not change.

Another example -- bad-speech the Church has been a Fact on the mainstream media Agenda.
The influence of Church since medieval times on Western habits and customs is also a Fact.
Break Up with our ancestral cultural ties, is a Fact desired by current political revolutions.
It is also a Fact, if people have nothing to protest they will not cause any revolution.

The thread article, althought have good informations, (In Fact) It's (sub liminal) intentions are in line with some Agenda goals. They called the West people like WEIRD people, and this its not a Fact -- that's just a biased opinion. To reinforce their (weird) opinion, they created a liar assumption that West people " consequently became more individualistic and more likely to relate to complete strangers."

(pure brainwasher, induced manipulation of behavior, quite sophisticated)

So, when we talk about be Aware and be Awake, one wise and very important thing it's to know what's a Fact and what's related to a Fact, because when you base your thoughts, feelings, and emotions on facts alone, everything becomes easier and more understandable.

History with subjectivity is a story, a tale, an epic. It's nice, but they are facts mixed with other things.

[sourcetruth]

Not really, history can be rewritten because we find that it was told wrong in the first place, most of modern history is not really what happened but what whoever wrote it wanted it to be, even if that meant lying their asses off to the entire world

Eventually it can be found that they lied when writing their history books, then history was not "a fact" at all, these days we should know better about "historical facts"

Are you suggesting that you do not agree with the current view of history as accepted by mainstream historians?


Imo the middle ages are very veiled, did it even happen in the timeline above ?, everdance suggest a differing data the more we dig = Femenko https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Chronology_%28Fomenko%29

This work is rejected and considered to be pseudohistorical by mainstream historians, according to the wikipedia article.

[Malisa]

So, when we talk about be Aware and be Awake, one wise and very important thing it's to know what's a Fact and what's related to a Fact, because when you base your thoughts, feelings, and emotions on facts alone, everything becomes easier and more understandable.


You can say you ate that cake, and it is written as a historical fact and subsequent decisions happen due to that event that is considered a "fact". Then, years later, it is discovered that there was no cake at all and it was all a lie, what happens to the "fact" that you ate the cake and all that came after that event?

If the cake event was documented as an historical fact and people considered it as such, and then we find it didn't happen and rewrite the book to exclude that event, then the fact is gone, no one who reads the new book will know about it anymore, is not a subjective view of history, it is a corrected view to exclude something that was considered true but was false.

The fact that there was no cake is the actual historical truth, but the accepted fact(historical truth) was that there was cake and it was eaten. There is no alternative interpretation of the cake event or biased point of view of how/why it happened. The entire event did not happen at all and had to be removed, history was rewritten to describe the actual reality of what happened, so the fact got scrubbed from history

Our understanding and what we know of that past is different now after we have removed false facts, but if someone else is not aware of the false fact then they have a different view of the past and for them, that falsehood is still "a fact"

I think we should be able to throw away historical facts if we find them false, and in that way the past we know actually was changed.


P.S. Also i'm drinking a bit of whiskey right now so i may be crazy talking here :P Sorry



I see we are talking the same thing:

The past fact not change, althought the way of describing It may change (according the context of who describes it).

When I refered to Facts, I do not refered to opinions, impressions or further interpretations.

For example -- I ate a piece of cake ( a simple past fact )

If I ate it because the cake was tasty, this is related to the fact, but it is not the fact itself.
Someone else who doesn't like cake, ate It because feel hungry, not because the cake is tasty.

So, please, look to my words you quoted again:
According each historical context, we can set Arbitrary Points, although the (past) facts not change.

Another example -- bad-speech the Church has been a Fact on the mainstream media Agenda.
The influence of Church since medieval times on Western habits and customs is also a Fact.
Break Up with our ancestral cultural ties, is a Fact desired by current political revolutions.
It is also a Fact, if people have nothing to protest they will not cause any revolution.

The thread article, althought have good informations, (In Fact) It's (sub liminal) intentions are in line with some Agenda goals. They called the West people like WEIRD people, and this its not a Fact -- that's just a biased opinion. To reinforce their (weird) opinion, they created a liar assumption that West people " consequently became more individualistic and more likely to relate to complete strangers."

(pure brainwasher, induced manipulation of behavior, quite sophisticated)

So, when we talk about be Aware and be Awake, one wise and very important thing it's to know what's a Fact and what's related to a Fact, because when you base your thoughts, feelings, and emotions on facts alone, everything becomes easier and more understandable.

History with subjectivity is a story, a tale, an epic. It's nice, but they are facts mixed with other things.

[Malisa]

Are you suggesting that you do not agree with the current view of history as accepted by mainstream historians?

No source kun, just saying that i don't believe just because that's what it is the accepted truth, i question everything before i accept it as truth

I will not be afraid of throwing away some idea or thing i thought i knew, if i find it to be false. Some people are unable to let go and resist, they find ways to keep believing in the lie even after they know it is a lie

[Border Dog]

You can say you ate that cake, and it is written as a historical fact and subsequent decisions happen due to that event that is considered a "fact". Then, years later, it is discovered that there was no cake at all and it was all a lie, what happens to the "fact" that you ate the cake and all that came after that event?
...
P.S. Also i'm drinking a bit of whiskey right now so i may be crazy talking here :P Sorry

I understand your point, but if there was no cake, I never could be ate It, So, I Lied!

A lie is never a Fact .. here in this discussion is not considered the intention to lie, anyway !

We were probing to distinguish facts from opinions or speculations, which although are not facts, are not lies, anyway.

Similarly, if the cake existed and someone said it did not exist, who is lying is the one who denied it, not the one who ate it.

PS - don't worry about seems crazy. [lol] to me its time to fun.

---edit---

today, I found a wise phrase to point here:

True is still a true even if no one believe in it.
A lie is still a lie even if everyone believe in it.

----------
obs - Since I start to study consciousness, I learned to put aside the word "Believe", like an protocol to avoid doubts, suspicious preconceptions and supertitions.

I can believe in God, but I'm aware that I can not say that God Exists, not even to myself and especially to others, because if I induce someone to believe that God exists, I would be harassing myself and the other ones.

this ethical pourpose its based on Free Will and the non-interference law, and since than I learned that lesson I'm sharing here, all evolved beings I have met use the following protocol - when in doubt, do nothing.

On the other side, even if a unethical being try to harass me, I just don't allow, and this way, he gives up and goes away looking for another one to parasitize, because they respect no one, except when being forced to do that.

[Kathy]

There are facts listed in history that really need to be thought about, for instance David Icke pointed out that all or most religions have the same origin, the birth, life and death of a saviour. Was he speaking truth? I trust that he was. Do you? If not, why not?

The Roman Catholic church we were told was based on the life of Christ written about in the New Testament, yet its actions bear no resemblance to the teachings they claim came from him. Why?

[Border Dog]

Nope, when you say we, you mean what you have data consumed, correct ?.

Sorry Aianawa, I have not see your question before, so let me explain now.
When I say "we" I'm refering to Humanity, Civilization, Culture, Scholars Narrative, Anyone.

in more simple words - I think don't matter the set of data used, and so, i have not consumed any data,

You pointed a Link that show "New Chronology", based on a reconstruction, an alternative chronology, radically shorter than the standard historical timeline .. So, I answer you -- According each historical context focus, we can set arbitrary date points.

The topic is "Influence Since Middle Ages", so you can choose the data whatever you want (arbitrary) and the influence of church certainly will remain the same.

---


The Roman Catholic church we were told was based on the life of Christ written about in the New Testament, yet its actions bear no resemblance to the teachings they claim came from him. Why?

Hey Kathy, good question. David Icke only reflected what is already known.

Religion is a big business used by the rulers (Shepherd) to lead the ruled (Sheep). The same (source) religion rules this world about six milenia, with different cultural traits, according to the times and the geolocation.

Nowadays this power relationship has become more sophisticated and more disputed, which is why the teachings of the masters are not faithfully followed by governments, because they know perfectly well how these things are.

[Kathy]

The rulers can only rule when the sheep are asleep, but not when the sheep wake up.

Governments are never faithful, never have been, because they think they have got everything about us covered, especially control.

[Malisa]

I understand your point, but if there was no cake, I never could be ate It, So, I Lied!

A lie is never a Fact .. here in this discussion is not considered the intention to lie, anyway !

We were probing to distinguish facts from opinions or speculations, which although are not facts, are not lies, anyway.

Similarly, if the cake existed and someone said it did not exist, who is lying is the one who denied it, not the one who ate it.

PS - don't worry about seems crazy. [lol] to me its time to fun.

---edit---

today, I found a wise phrase to point here:

True is still a true even if no one believe in it.
A lie is still a lie even if everyone believe in it.

----------
obs - Since I start to study consciousness, I learned to put aside the word "Believe", like an protocol to avoid doubts, suspicious preconceptions and supertitions.

I can believe in God, but I'm aware that I can not say that God Exists, not even to myself and especially to others, because if I induce someone to believe that God exists, I would be harassing myself and the other ones.

this ethical pourpose its based on Free Will and the non-interference law, and since than I learned that lesson I'm sharing here, all evolved beings I have met use the following protocol - when in doubt, do nothing.

On the other side, even if a unethical being try to harass me, I just don't allow, and this way, he gives up and goes away looking for another one to parasitize, because they respect no one, except when being forced to do that.

It doesn't matter if it was true or a lie, what matters is how people will think of it, and if it will pass in the official history as truth even if it was a lie

People will say it was true, and that belief can and will form history in several ways, and people will stand by that truth (which was a lie but they don't know it yet). So, was history a fact or a lie in this case?

It's very simple, it becomes a fact is people think it's the truth, even if it's not, then once it is discovered it was a lie, then what would happen, what would you do if you find that all what you thought was a fact turns out a lie?

So to avoid the classic "i said what i said and i get what you're saying but i said what i said" approach, let's say this instead

It was a lie, there was no cake, but everyone believed when you said you eat it and that's the historical fact, because no one was the wiser about your lie. That's history, then it turns out you left a recording saying you lied about the cake and the entire world listens to it. Is your historical fact, as it was considered until the recording came up, still a "past fact' that can't be changed?

[Malisa]

Sorry Aianawa, I have not see your question before, so let me explain now.
When I say "we" I'm refering to Humanity, Civilization, Culture, Scholars Narrative, Anyone.

in more simple words - I think don't matter the set of data used, and so, i have not consumed any data,


You did :)

Just by reading about it, you have processed data, and consumed it by association.

He said that you are talking about how things look from your point of view, due to the result of how you have processed the data you have been able to receive so far, about this topic

LMFAO, i was going to say it other way but i think you should get this



Nope, when you say we, you mean what you have data consumed, correct ?.

He means: When you said "we", you meant "Me" or "I"



i have not consumed any data,

Impossible, if you read something, and if you are reading my words, then you are consuming data, from a channel open from my brain to yours

And if you reply, then you have created a duplex data channel, and i will receive back your data, and so on xixi!

:)

[Aianawa]

Indeed.

Future wise we understand, now, we understand, the past I understand n you n we and not all.

[Border Dog]

It doesn't matter if it was true or a lie


doesn't matter for you and for who are under the Veil of ..
I'm not under It, anymore, anyway.



You did :)


I already said no.

you can repeat this a million times, which won't do you any good,
not for me, not for you, not for anyone, do you want to know why?
-- because it's not truth, It's not real, have no substance.

I offer any arbitrary point to you wish, so, I want you be Free.
If you think I'm not Free, maybe you don't know "what does it means".

So, please, try again using a true entry data point. It works !

[Dreamtimer]

When I say "we" I'm refering to Humanity, Civilization, Culture, Scholars Narrative, Anyone.

Me too.

We're all living on this earth (real or simulation ;)).

[Malisa]

doesn't matter for you and for who are under the Veil of ..
I'm not under It, anymore, anyway.



I already said no.

you can repeat this a million times, which won't do you any good,
not for me, not for you, not for anyone, do you want to know why?
-- because it's not truth, It's not real, have no substance.

I offer any arbitrary point to you wish, so, I want you be Free.
If you think I'm not Free, maybe you don't know "what does it means".

[QUOTE]
So, please, try again using a true entry data point. It works !
Please don't misuse concepts like that, it doesn't really help when you already avoided the direct point of my reply. It only shows you don't understand the concept and are misusing it

If you don't mind, could you give me an example of a "false entry data point" and explain how it is different from a "true" entry data point?

Being vague, ambiguous or using lots of words where a simple 5 o 6 words sentence would be enough only adds to the wrong impression you are leaving. Obfuscating your statements doesn't show any depth or knowledge or anything but an attempt to leave enough room to run away from the actual points of the conversation

Anyway if this is going to be an ego thing where you have to know better no matter what, and even go far away so as to change the meaning of concepts to support your escape then let's not even try, too tiring and boring to be honest. And i don't care that much anyway

Good trips! :love:

P.S.

I don't remember saying or insinuating you weren't "Free" (whatever that means to you). You brought that up on your own, which usually means you are not so sure and look for confirmation. Somehow something i said triggered this but i don't even want to know. As far as i can tell you just went rambling about something no one asked or even considered before you brought it up

[Border Dog]

Please don't misuse concepts like that, it doesn't really help when you already avoided the direct point of my reply. It only shows you don't understand the concept and are misusing it

If you don't mind, could you give me an example of a "false entry data point" and explain how it is different from a "true" entry data point?


sorry, but you are trying to blame me about your own misuse of my thoughts.

I said no, and you intend to polarize my point, because you don't want to accept it as a fact, so, you articulate a polarized thought, that Don't Works with me, as I advice.

a true entry data point need to be "real", because what it's no real, cannot be "truly verified" by anyone, so, cannot be "Really Useful" by anyone, except for those who don't care about the truth and accept the illusions as being true

want an example ? -- hit Escape everytime your computer require an Enter, and try to make your computer truly useful as the manufacturer said when sold it for you. Make most of the money you spent this way

sorry, your ilusion about what its truth are under the the Veil of Ilusions, and by this, you think the ilusions its also a truth

the truth can be sweet or bitter, but never be bad
who tells the truth always end being discovered.

its simple as that, but you cannot understand yet.

please, back to topic -- The influence of Church on the West

PS

I don't remember saying or insinuating you weren't "Free" (whatever that means to you)

When you don't respect my No Choice, you try to interfere on my Free Will. You really didn't say it but really tried to make it, but it doesn't work with me, anyway. Try Again .. pehaps, I make a mistake just to please you, who knows ?

[Malisa]

sorry, but you are trying to blame me about your own misuse of my thoughts.


Of course LMFAO, i guess it was meant to be, i'll disregard all you say from now on after this reply, what would be the point to answer to someone who is trapped in his own belief that his truth is final? No need to answer, it's obvious what the answer will be :P



I said no, and you intend to polarize my point, because you don't want to accept it as a fact, so, you articulate a polarized thought, that Don't Works with me, as I advice.

You didn't not even speak about something that made it beyond the glibberish level. So what's a fact for you could mean anything, like saying entry point actually means "puppy ass" and then you go write full sentences where you talk about entry point while to you it means 'puppy ass'. So glibberish in the end except for you because you will tell other people "you don't understand the facts" when your facts are ill conceived



a true entry data point need to be "real", because what it's no real, cannot be "truly verified" by anyone, so, cannot be "Really Useful" by anyone, except for those who don't care about the truth and accept the illusions as being true

A data entry point is not binary, it is not an object that can be set to true or false. Now, the data that goes through a data entry point can be binary or something else, like an image

You don't have a single, minimal, particular, atomic understanding about what a data entry point is :)

And i'm laughing about this sentence you wrote now, i'm sorry but it's impossible not to :P

Like i said, don't change the meaning of words to fit whatever concept you have in your mind. If you have fabricated some concept or have some other knowledge you want to share, invent a new word that identifies it. Don't change the meaning or misuse existing concepts that mean a completely different thing!



want an example ? -- hit Escape everytime your computer require an Enter, and try to make your computer truly useful as the manufacturer said when sold it for you. Make most of the money you spent this way

Didn't i said you should not be obfuscated and vague? And here you are, glibberish again, please have some respect for people who are not playing dumb like you

Like i said "A data entry point is not a binary thing". It can't be, it is not the data itself that goes through. Please don't act ignorant like this, it talks bad about you, and no one else


After your reply above, you just came out as a bitter angry person who can't handle being told they are wrong and don't have any answers.

To me, you are not well prepared and just go on the web "learning" things and repeating them somewhere else, without actual understanding of how things work

Discredited is the word




sorry, your ilusion about what its truth are under the the Veil of Ilusions, and by this, you think the ilusions its also a truth

the truth can be sweet or bitter, but never be bad
who tells the truth always end being discovered.




please, back to topic -- The influence of Church on the West

We were on that topic and i corrected your misunderstanding about something Aianawa said, then you went into the word salad episode and all that nonsense because you could not understand you misinterpreted Aianawa's words :)

How casual of you to now suddenly require me to go back on topic, when you were the one that lead the thread offtopic with your word salad and your "my truth is final" mistaken ideology

Fairwell guy, you are not wise at all so i shall stop trying to understand your random ramblings

<3

But check this out, the way you acted all across these past comments, is exactly how the Church would act!

You will not accept anything i say or even consider there may be some truth on it, and all my words are being thrown away without consideration. Should i burn because i have some knowledge you can't understand and goes against what you believe so firmly, even when you show no understanding of it at all?

[Malisa]

Im going to add a couple more things, just to ensure it is perfectly clear

If you want respect, earn it, don’t expect it because you believe you must have it by default. Your word salad is intellectually disrespectful to begin with

Just because you ‘know’ things, don’t assume you understand them, or that you are the only one that does.

You can know a lot of stuff, but you still can fail to really understand it. And I don’t need to write a word salad to give a false impression of wisdom no one can get because I’m on another wisdom level. That’s just pure cringe

[Border Dog]

You will not accept anything i say or even consider there may be some truth on it, and all my words are being thrown away without consideration. Should i burn because i have some knowledge you can't understand and goes against what you believe so firmly, even when you show no understanding of it at all?

you did want to force my acceptance, trying to infringe my Free Will choice.
I argue as an example of fact that "I Ate a piece of Cake", and nothing more.
I was not accept the distortion of my thought you want I do .. it's not personal!

YES, I'm firmly convinced (and you can not accept this, saying I don't understand)

I Advice .. I Warn .. You insist .. still Don't Work (and probably never will)

Try Again ! you're welcome ! pehaps I make a mistake to please you once

[sourcetruth]

You will not accept anything i say or even consider there may be some truth on it, and all my words are being thrown away without consideration. Should i burn because i have some knowledge you can't understand and goes against what you believe so firmly, even when you show no understanding of it at all?

If you insist on this, then why don't you make a thread about it?

[Malisa]

Don't get burn, it makes it easier... to make you see..

MpN1j8R5lZ8

I like when i find beautiful kids