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Thread: Savior paradigm

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    Senior Member donk's Avatar
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    Savior paradigm

    Why do people get so bent out of shape about the “savior paradigm”? It’s like the latest new age joke…on no dood—he’s bringing the “savior paradigm”….breaking the prime directive even.

    Look, please don’t start telling me you (and I) can only save yourself…I get it.

    But IF we believe in a cabal (which is either the creation of an anti-human force or that self-destructive “human nature” so many believe in)…why do so many get so emotionally attached to the fear of the “savior paradigm” (a non-human force aiding humanity)?

    I personally think that if it is that a non-human force brought about the misery of the reality we find ourselves, it would be great to receive help from a different outside force…even at the risk of potential enslavement by said force—I mean, we can cross that bridge when it happens…but it seems we need some help EMANCIPATING OURSELVES FROM MENTAL SLAVERY.

    This goes DOUBLE if the mental slavery is self-imposed human nature…if we have managed to create this trap for ourselves, why not let outside nudge us in the right direction?

    I understand PINING for ET to save us self-destructive behavior, I’m not advocating that. What I am wondering about is why there seems to be such strong emotional reactions to the very idea something other than us might help us?
    What is the purpose of your presence?

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    Administrator Aragorn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by donk View Post
    Why do people get so bent out of shape about the “savior paradigm”? It’s like the latest new age joke…on no dood—he’s bringing the “savior paradigm”….breaking the prime directive even.

    Look, please don’t start telling me you (and I) can only save yourself…I get it.

    But IF we believe in a cabal (which is either the creation of an anti-human force or that self-destructive “human nature” so many believe in)…why do so many get so emotionally attached to the fear of the “savior paradigm” (a non-human force aiding humanity)?

    I personally think that if it is that a non-human force brought about the misery of the reality we find ourselves, it would be great to receive help from a different outside force…even at the risk of potential enslavement by said force—I mean, we can cross that bridge when it happens…but it seems we need some help EMANCIPATING OURSELVES FROM MENTAL SLAVERY.

    This goes DOUBLE if the mental slavery is self-imposed human nature…if we have managed to create this trap for ourselves, why not let outside nudge us in the right direction?

    I understand PINING for ET to save us self-destructive behavior, I’m not advocating that. What I am wondering about is why there seems to be such strong emotional reactions to the very idea something other than us might help us?
    The matter is rather complicated. On the one hand, there is Free Will. The Good Guys™ know that we have Free Will, and they respect it -- but the Bad Guys don't. The Good Guys™ also know the dangers involved if they were to openly come down here and remove all the Bad Guys ™ from their positions of power. They would be instant Saviors™, with as a result that, once again, Mankind would sacrifice its sovereignty in a heartbeat. Because that's what Mankind has been indoctrinated with, by religions, by governments, etc. The idea of something "superior" to ourselves which must by definition be perfect and thus must be obeyed, is embedded into our collective psyche. And at the same time, you would have the paranoid Right-Wingers who would be picking up a gun and shooting at The Good Guys™ for no reason, other than fear -- if not xenophobia, then at the very least the fear of change. Because they believe in capitalism, corporatism, the United States government, and that the Russians are communists, and all Muslims are terrorists, etc.

    Now, I think that it's understandable that the people who are awake and aware will be emphasizing that we Earthlings are the cavalry. Humanity has been living under these oppressive and abusive power structures for too long, and the awake and aware people do now want to reclaim their sovereignty. But yes, a little help is needed, because, as Albert Einstein said, "you cannot solve a problem with the same level of thinking as what created it in the first place".

    The problem is that the vast majority of humanity is still vast asleep and won't accept any changes unless they come slowly and gradually, or unless they are forced upon us by an inescapable calamity, such as -- for instance -- a total breakdown of civilization as we know it in the aftermath of a potential World War III scenario. And then there are also lots of people still who think that they're awake and aware, but who in reality only have one eye open, and are still subjected to the indoctrination and conditioning. Those are the people who know that something has to give, but they're still naive and they believe that voting for a different guy the next time is going to bring about this change.

    There is a lot of inertia to overcome. Raising people's awareness and broadening their consciousness is a very slow and tedious task, and it won't work on everyone. So a little outside help is needed, but we must always be careful not to invite in more problems than we've already got.

    That's just my two Eurocents worth, Bro. :-)
    = DEATH BEFORE DISHONOR =

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    Senior Member donk's Avatar
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    The idea of something "superior" to ourselves which must by definition be perfect and thus must be obeyed, is embedded into our collective psyche. And at the same time, you would have the paranoid Right-Wingers who would be picking up a gun and shooting at The Good Guys™ for no reason, other than fear -- if not xenophobia, then at the very least the fear of change.
    I mean, I feel we like we seem to need help as a species to get rid of all that (especially the good guy vs bad guy paradigm)...as well as the savior yearning and messiah complexes, authoritarian/abusive relationships...all the bad idea we're addicted to, the cognitive dissonance we shouldn't be capable of--its so much it seems like a little help is almost necessary.

    And why not? isn't NOT expecting something to be more aware/higher up the "evolutionary" ladder? I mean, doesn't thinking that way kinda necessitate that we are sorta assuming this existence is the penultimate one of all possibilities?
    What is the purpose of your presence?

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    Senior Member johnjen325's Avatar
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    For those who have studied the Wingmakers material, it provides another 'perspective' upon this topic.

    One that I find illumuninating.

    JJ
    • The hidden harmony is found with joy, while the obvious brings indifference.
    • The farther you enter into the Truth the deeper your conviction for truth must be.
    • There is understanding of the world precisely to the degree that there is understanding of the Self.
    WingMakers.com — Collected Works of the WingMakers Volume 1 pg. 590

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    Administrator Aragorn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by donk View Post
    I mean, I feel we like we seem to need help as a species to get rid of all that (especially the good guy vs bad guy paradigm)...as well as the savior yearning and messiah complexes, authoritarian/abusive relationships...all the bad idea we're addicted to, the cognitive dissonance we shouldn't be capable of--its so much it seems like a little help is almost necessary.
    I hear you on that, but spiritual evolution is a very complex process. It also requires a psychological evolution -- in fact, I would say that it's part of the package. Yet, direct outside intervention is not allowed because of the principle of Free Will. That is why beings such as myself have incarnated here for a single lifetime -- we normally never incarnate as we are not part of the wheel of karma and never wanted to take part in learning by making mistakes -- to live among humans and help them awaken, both to the Truth and to a more positive spiritual experience with all that lives, whether on this planet or beyond. We do this through the principle of sympathetic vibration. Yet, again, it's a slow process, due to the inertia of the masses. They are very vastly asleep.

    Quote Originally Posted by donk View Post
    And why not? isn't NOT expecting something to be more aware/higher up the "evolutionary" ladder? I mean, doesn't thinking that way kinda necessitate that we are sorta assuming this existence is the penultimate one of all possibilities?
    There is still a lot of work to be done, that is for sure. And it would appear as if Corey's Sphere Alliance is here to provide for the military angle by way of a peaceful disarmament of the enemy. At least, I'm assuming they are, as is Corey. I am hopeful, but I do not wish to see these beings as saviors. Allies, yes, but saviors, no.

    Corey is an intuitive and an empath, and if he says he trusts these beings, then that should count for something. Personally, I am maintaining caution, but that doesn't mean that this caution would be justified. It's more a kind of wisdom gathered from my experiences during my human existence on this planet, rather than that it would be an intuition that there's something wrong. ;-)
    Last edited by Aragorn; 17th April 2015 at 23:49.
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    EMANCIPATING OURSELVES FROM MENTAL SLAVERY.
    Learn to think!
    www.triviumeducation.com

    NO ONE BUT OURSELVES CAN FREE OUR MINDS.


    Source: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6xcNOZLFt4o


    Lets not be sold off to the merchants.
    Last edited by That Guy; 18th April 2015 at 00:12.

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    Senior Member hughe's Avatar
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    Savior paradigm has been worked out so well.

    The way I understand how they - non-human entities - enslave entire human race is to let humans as stupid animals and keep worshiping other beings.
    Denial of cause and effect is a good sign of stupidity. Higher intelligence like humans possess is irrelevant as long as the main paradigm ignore causality in Nature.
    Why humans are so destructive and love death and destruction? One of reasons is that modern science and technology inherited broken causality. They separated us from Nature. Modern humans blindly believe in human own Earth, at the center of Universe, don't give shit about whatever action we do. This is stupidity, dangerous path of intelligent species.

    Adding memory reset manipulation in each cycle of life - birth and death - make them keep entire species under full control. Like human masters train dogs for their own agenda, they have used, manipulated, and been controlling billions of earthlings over eons of time.

    I don't believe advanced of science and technology, i.e. the artificiality never overcomes the organic process of Nature. I learned some of ET races have influenced, human history to fix their past mistakes not for human's sake. Suppose humans keep tempering DNA, trying to merge life form into machine for creating the perfect world, immortality, it will be the dead end.

    The laws of physics change all the time. It's remarkable insight by few brilliant scientists. Virtually all established scientists ignore it though. If they accept it new paradigm, they'll have to loose everything and must face their stupidity against humanity over two hundred years. For instance subtle change of electric field strength in region of space affects gravity, chemical composition of molecules. Scientists rely on linearity, symmetry which assume everything is fixed, predictable by few mathematical formulas.

    I see everyday human behavior of direct abomination against Nature. This is so disgusting to myself but what should I do about it.
    The city manages so called "Ecology park". However, ecosystem of the park area is destroyed by on-going development - golf course, bicycle roads, river reservoir, cutting down old trees and removing green mass each year. And these stupid people call it "Beautiful, environmental friendly park!"

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    Senior Member hughe's Avatar
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    My one of goals is to end physical slavery.
    First step I set was to reduce cost of living by one tenth.

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    Quote Originally Posted by donk View Post
    I personally think that if it is that a non-human force brought about the misery of the reality we find ourselves, it would be great to receive help from a different outside force…
    Yes, I think/feel the same. I have seen it like ETS are like our cousins, part of a bigger family...(not all to be trusted and not all as closely connected to us)

    What person has never had help from blood family or from anyone else?

    they are already helping us...in not so direct and obvious ways...

    I would be happy for there to be more help from ETS down here...I welcome it, some others don't welcome it...

    Yes us humans (or in human form) do need to take responsibility for ourselves, and our planet...but we are not totally independent and we are not totally separate from ETs...


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    I could not agree more with you Donk even though Aragorn indeed raises key points about the risk of placing ET as saviour.

    However, look around at some of the more gentle creatures on earth who go out side their species to protect/raise that of another sometimes less evolved species, silverbacks caring for dogs/small animals etc etc .. Do the protected animals feel like their benefactor is an almighty saviour or a loving parent?

    The nature of what passes for planetary protection itself is a large part of our story here, on the outer rim... The Star Wars buffs among ye may remember the scoffs given to Amidala whilst she was on Tattooine, regarding the reach of the republic and the likelihood of it helping their backwater planet.

    We, as a 3D race have been exploited by not just one higher dimensional ET, far from it, we've had everyone dip their wick and so much more setting up shop for millennia.

    What are we going to do when we are in ships flying past worlds like ours, children being tortured endless war etc etc? Would we act or refuse to because we were scared they might try to worship us? Does that mean we have to let them worship us if we do help, can we not just say we were in the same boat as you please don't worship us?

    When we see animals stranded on beaches, we do our best straight away to get them home while they still live, we don't stand their hesitant, protesting that our involvement would cause the dolphins to become slavish minded spiritual subordinates?

    Everyone can save themselves from anything, depending on the strength of their belief. But if a 4D negative group has subjugated the will effectively of an entire planet of 3D beings one has to ask, is that fair? Even if we humans did invite them here saying its your problem is kind of like saying to an abducted 2 year old you shouldn't have got in his car for the sweets, silly child the police don't look for silly children goodbye.

    Really good thread Donk, my favorite this year by far.
    Last edited by monk; 18th April 2015 at 09:14.

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    Senior Member Nepal InCiDeR's Avatar
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    Yeah, it's pretty interesting isn't it.

    If I'm about to drown, and someone comes rescuing me... I wouldn't stop them and say "Hold on, wait a minute here. Why are you doing this?".

    Likewise if someone would save me from being run over by a car that I didn't see coming... I wouldn't say "Why did you do that?" or start worshipping the rescuer in question.

    Gratefulness should not be mixed up with worship, not in my book at least.

    We often talk about service to others as the more righteous path, why should that only be a human concern? If we are true to its meaning, we should allow others to work according to this principle as well.

    If the helping hand later try to slap you, well that is a situation we have to consider when it comes, if it comes. Not meaning that you should not be aware of the possibility and be cautious, but not stupidly so.
    Last edited by InCiDeR; 19th April 2015 at 00:36.
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    Totally agree, donk. But who says help has to come only in the form of ET physical presence? Who says help has to "come" at all? Maybe it has been here all along...

    Sometimes I have a problem with the generalization of "humanity." Sure there are some times when that is appropriate, but maybe not as often as it is assigned.

    The individual nature of this experience would tend to indicate that the help would be individual, according to the evolutionary process in which we find ourselves. Wouldn't it?

    That is not to discount any planetary or humanity-wide shift in consciousness, of course, which (hopefully) is a game changer.

    Just some thoughts.

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    We are constantly hearing about the cabal and this strikes my mind with thoughts of Baron Harkonin from the Dune books.
    As of late I've become so disenfranchised with politics and how hopelessly complicated and corrupt it is, I find myself daydreaming about a true King.
    So how's that for having a savior fantasy.
    I find myself wishing a certain house from the cabal families would distinguish itself like the Attredies in Frank Herbert's Dune books.
    I find myself daydreaming that duke Attredies pushes his way to the top of the pyramid to the adulation and love of all.
    I'm at that point.
    Last edited by DNA; 18th April 2015 at 21:33.

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    Senior Member Nepal InCiDeR's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aragorn View Post
    (...) On the one hand, there is Free Will. The Good Guys™ know that we have Free Will, and they respect it -- but the Bad Guys don't.(...)
    I tend to agree with the major points in your post - but - what do you mean with "Free Will" in this context? Sorry Aragorn, I couldn't resist.

    ...however, it is a serious question, I really would like to know!...
    Last edited by InCiDeR; 18th April 2015 at 18:03. Reason: clarifying intent
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    Remember the FLDS compounds and the stories of girls as young as nine being married off as the umpteenth wife of an uncle decades older? Should we let it happen because it's their religious belief? Should we intervene because they're breaking the larger societies laws? Should we intervene for moral and ethical reasons? As I recall there were many differing opinions and it was difficult to determine the truth.

    There are still a lot of ifs.

    It is a clear contradiction, however, to be so on board with the idea of negative ETs hurting us while being unwilling to consider positive ETs helping us.

    Why do good people help others? It's not for a reward or payback. They just do it.

    I imagine there comes a point, maybe it takes millenia, where the good neighbors decide to help the screaming, abused child.

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