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Thread: Savior paradigm

  1. #16
    Administrator Aragorn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by InCiDeR View Post
    I tend to agree with the major points in your post - but - what do you mean with "Free Will" in this context. Sorry Aragorn, I couldn't resist.
    In this particular context, Free Will means self-determination, i.e. the right of the population of a planet or other celestial body to choose the course of its own evolution. This is an important aspect from the point of view of interstellar (or even intergalactic) ethics.

    This is where Star Trek's Prime Directive comes into play. In Star Trek itself, the Prime Directive states (among other things) that no contact shall be made by the United Federation of Planets with any civilization that has not yet attained warp drive capability. Transposed to our own present-day Earth, this means that, even though there are and have been breakaway civilizations and there are secret space programs, the vast majority of humanity is still left in limbo over whether there would be intelligent (and even space-faring) life on other worlds, let alone over whether warp drive technology is even possible.

    Now, of course, anyone with a brain would be able to ascertain that the mainstream means which are used for searching for extraterrestrial life are suffering from tunnel vision to the degree of ludicrousness. Even "3D" beings from elsewhere in the galaxy might be a few thousands of years ahead of where mainstream science is on Earth today -- it doesn't even have to be a million years, or a hundred thousand years, no, just one thousand years. We already know that radio wave transmissions are a very poor means of conveying information over longer distances, but still, that is what SETI is looking for. And mainstream science still believes that the laws of physics of the universe are centered around gravity, while there is clearly an electromagnetic component to it all.

    As an illustration of this, in the 1990s, a Mexican scientist by the name Miguel Alcubierre theorized a warp drive which would bend spacetime around a spaceship, while the ship itself would remain stable and stationary in a bubble of flat spacetime. However, it has always been assumed that dark energy and/or dark matter were needed to accomplish this. Recently however, a retired physics professor from Omaha in the USA has begun working on a warp drive in his own garage, based upon the use of high voltages to create a warp bubble, and his experiments appear promising. He has so far already been able to compress a laser beam, showing that he has, indeed, managed to warp spacetime.

    I couldn't find the original video anymore where the retired professor himself explains how and why he came to these findings, but the ~6-minute video below does explain it all equally well...


    Source: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eFUeWNuSBLw


    To return to what I was talking about higher up however, as far as the mainstream population is concerned, we're still at the stage where we think that we might possibly be the only intelligent creatures out there, and that the fact that we have intelligence is merely a fluke of nature, caused by random genetic mutations. And on the other hand, we've got the religious people, who say that the scriptures don't mention anything about life on other planets -- you have to keep in mind that it was these very same religious institutions who insisted that Earth was flat, and some of them actually still do.

    Ergo, an open and public intervention from ETs in our way of life down here on Planet Earth would have significant consequences to our evolution as a species, and can therefore not be allowed in the ethics of benevolent and advanced ETs, wherever they come from. They can make themselves visible at times via entries into our atmosphere -- and sometimes they need to, in order to make contact with members of their own species who have incarnated on Earth and have agreed to becoming contactees in order to pass on messages -- but there is always plausible deniability, because no formal contact has been made yet.

    Now, the interesting part is that even the negative ETs have not made any formal and open contact yet -- semi-formal, yes, through secret meetings with selected government officials, but nothing that was both formal and public -- but I doubt that this would then be a matter of ethics on their part. I would much rather think that if they were to simply come down here and seize the planet, they would get their rear ends kicked right off of the planet again by The Good Guys™.

    So what we have here, is a chess game. There is interaction, and even intervention -- the latter at the spiritual and for humans mainly subconscious level -- but no physically tangible large-scale and overt contact. It's a very delicate situation, in which several ET factions -- whether good, evil or anywhere in between -- are constantly walking a tightrope on what they can get away with without completely upsetting the balance. The Good Guys™ because they respect our Free Will, and The Bad Guys because they don't want to get themselves into too much trouble with The Good Guys.
    = DEATH BEFORE DISHONOR =

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  3. #17
    Member Phoenix's Avatar
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    I don't know about anyone else, but I chose to incarnate here for the experience, learning potential, and spiritual growth opportunities.

    Good, bad, ugly, and everything in between, as far as I'm concerned it's all valuable, and it's ALL good.

    Personally, I'd prefer it if things were allowed to unfold here naturally without any (further) external interference.

    We got ourselves into the mess we now find ourselves in (consent via tacit agreement), so I think it's only fair that we take some personal responsibility for our actions (or IN-actions as the case may be).

    But therein lies the problem, too many people are waiting for someone to come alomg and save us from our (mostly self-created) problems.

    Which is a shame really, because we do actually have the ability/power to take care of these problems ourselves.

    Unfortunately, it seems the overwhelming majority of people on this planet lack the courage and/or conviction to take action and get things done/do what is necessary.
    Last edited by Phoenix; 18th April 2015 at 14:08.

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    If benevolent ET's haven't made contact how can we assume they are all "non-interventionist"? Who told us that? A human?

    Until they actually make contact we don't know anything about their societies or practices. Going by any information disseminated by the smorgasbord of terminally conflicting/embattled ET contactees is futile and will yield only confusion, obviously, given how much they disagree/conflict with each other. ALL of The contactees relationships, especially those contactees brought to us by David Wilcocks Alliance, onceinabluemoon (Sunfire) and Goodet (Corey) are evidence of conflict between "higher" ET groups.

    Those above have more to learn than us, and more to apologise for.

    Long live mankind and bless every soul on this beautiful rock as it awakens to the majesty of its being and sheds the fear and hatred. May justice be swift for those who project negative futures for them.
    Last edited by monk; 19th April 2015 at 12:39.

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  7. #19
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    Donk - great thread and great point to bring up.

    I am beginning to see that so many seem to make far too much out of a word that suddenly the word itself becomes black listed. Words are just pointers anyways, right?

    So anyways... we have this lovely phrase called "human nature." One of the attributes of human nature is that many of us attempt to make the life of other living beings "better." Of course, there are also humans who act in ways that clearly make the life of other living beings worse. I would imagine most of us would agree that making the lives better for other living beings is a good thing. I bet most of us would oppose making the lives of other living beings worse.

    Why then should we assume that these views (and choices made upon these views) would be wrong or would not occur in cases of other living beings which could impact the life experience of humans?

    So maybe this type of behavior is not just "human nature" but is "universal nature."

    And so I think Donk's point is excellent. If a helping hand were extended, why should we not consider taking it?


    Ahhhhhhh but then there's the trust factor. Could we be sucked in by a far more worse "evil" than the crap we are dealing with on planet earth today? I guess that's the risk.

    The way I see it (I emphasize this is my opinion only)... the folks in charge (and the theoretical "beings" behind them) could not be any worse. Yet just because I would be willing to take this risk... what do I tell my kids one day if I find out I made the wrong choice? Jeeeez - another dilemma (wrong thread perhaps).


    and to monk's (great) post just above this one...

    It seems to me, based on what I know... that humanity is in humanity's hands.
    Last edited by Sam Hunter; 23rd April 2015 at 03:20.

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  9. #20
    Senior Member ERK's Avatar
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    Last edited by ERK; 11th May 2015 at 04:56.

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  11. #21
    Senior Member donk's Avatar
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    I believe the “food chain” we are taught in elementary bio is an intentional oversimplification.

    It seems to me that it would be more accurately described as an “energy exchange web”, where the “higher level consumer” is able to “weave” it a bit.

    As the “highest” level we are aware of in the 3d earth life aspect of it, we can choose to eat mammals (yummy as they are, when I think about it on a deeper level I gross myself out), we can choose to eat the animals similar like my friend who chooses not to eat anything with four legs (birds and marine life are different enough it’s harder to relate to/empathize as much with), and we are able to choose NOT to eat the creatures that seem to have a similar (if less self-aware) type of “life” as we do.

    And that’s just the physical substance aspect of it. We can choose to “own” animals, to use their energy/activity to benefit our existence as far as “work” , we put them in exhibits (zoos/safaris) or labs for study/amusment, we can choose to keep them as pets. There’s a scale there, as far as how much of your will you are imposing on them, and I guess we create our own reality about it by whatever it is we tell ourselves about these relationships. In some cases, we straight call them “rescues”….we be the saviors no one asked for.

    But my point is, if there’s something “higher” on the food web than us…this should probably be one of the thoughts that we should keep in (and put into others’) front of our awareness. Our emotional attachments (and fear, and lies we tell ourselves) about the predator-prey relationship is way more of a driving force in our existence than I think most realize. I believe this is the mindset we most need to work on, as a species, if we are ever to progress evolutionarily.

    It seems to me arrogance to think we were the top of everything, that we are the most aware creators of the web, that we aren’t in some similar being treated “from above” as we do to beings “so below” us. And I’m talking layers…level….a scale with many notches. The next highest level above us may have beings that are just as capable of ignorance and selfishness and cruelity as some humans seem capable of, they are just better equipped/aware of this reality…and can hide from us, as the most advanced predators can from their prey.

    Can those lower understand all of the uses we have for them? Possibly, when armed with more awareness and better information. So my question is: is it fair to speculate that our bizarre cultural (“civilized”) belief that we are the top of the energy web of existence is projection of the arrogance of a (maybe only slightly) higher type of being (or a few bad apples from their species/type/race/whatever). Sorta like the phenomenon where a pet becomes like a reflection of their owner?
    What is the purpose of your presence?

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    It seems to me arrogance to think we were the top of everything, that we are the most aware creators of the web, that we aren’t in some similar being treated “from above” as we do to beings “so below” us. And I’m talking layers…level….a scale with many notches. The next highest level above us may have beings that are just as capable of ignorance and selfishness and cruelity as some humans seem capable of, they are just better equipped/aware of this reality…and can hide from us, as the most advanced predators can from their prey.
    I often ponder what it is that feeds on the Shmargons, after all, there's always a bigger fish, a thought that is quite satisfying to me, in other words, this sh!t never ends. (will we ever find a petrified Blue Avian turd, and does their butt make a whistling sound when they poop?) Sigh, such enlightened thoughts from this puny little human mind, imagine what greatness in discernment we are capable of and where it might get us when science and spirituality truly meet in a way that can be measured and repeated at will by anyone using two cotton balls, a paperclip and a kitchen sink, we'll get there, eventually we'll get there.

    Always a bigger pigeon too btw.

    https://youtu.be/G933z25dn30
    Last edited by That Guy; 22nd April 2015 at 16:51.

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    Last edited by ERK; 11th May 2015 at 01:49.

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  17. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dreamtimer View Post

    I imagine there comes a point, maybe it takes millenia, where the good neighbors decide to help the screaming, abused child.
    ET's may choose to see adults as that and not children to be saved. The masses of humanity could change the world in a week if the will was there. They are now telling us to grow up and become adult emotionally. If we heed that advice the world will become a better place. If we begin to address out problems, like adults, then I suspect assistance will be added because a new consent has been made visible and actionable.

    Fortunately there are pockets of new movement and direction happening. These things are not under the radar but, simply ignored or dismissed. Ignoring or dismissing movements that make a difference and improve the lot of humanity sends a message. It is not a good message.

    The time for pointing fingers at what the PTB are doing is over. Time to focus on what we intend to do about it, without external "saviors". Enlightened ET's are not amused by our acceptance and complacency in the face of growing tyranny. Some even question if we are worth saving. I know this for a fact.

    Safe zones are being built for the enlightened who are doing something while an ongoing parallel plan is being attempted to save all. My involvement with TVoP is a big part of that parallel plan and we have some bright, capable and motivated people now coming onboard to assist in building this new world. How things go will depend on how the masses respond to the crisis facing them. I do believe at some point there will be a separation of the two camps. Those taking action will have to be seen as exercising their sovereignty and be relatively unmolested. Those who still support the matrix will fall into the hands of the PTB and be "theirs". Probably with an agreement that "they" get to keep their slaves as long as the sovereigns do not rile up the slaves. That or the safe places get used.

    If humanity wakes up, (especially the USA and UK) the world changes in weeks for the better.

    The unfolding of the future is in our collective hands. The wisdom of those hands will matter greatly.
    "To learn who rules over you simply find out who you are not allowed to criticize" -- Voltaire

    "Great minds discuss ideas; average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people."-- Eleanor Roosevelt

    "Misery loves company. Wisdom has to look for it." -- Anonymous

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    Senior Member Morocco modwiz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ERK View Post
    People on this planet are hacking up animal parts to feed their bodies. I believe this *consumption* runs way deeper than people would like to think. As above, so below- we can rise above this though. It needn't be like this.

    It is certainly justification for the reptilians who like to eat some of us. We may not see it that way but, it does not change the "logic" of what the reptilians see. Probably see us a "free range" food.
    "To learn who rules over you simply find out who you are not allowed to criticize" -- Voltaire

    "Great minds discuss ideas; average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people."-- Eleanor Roosevelt

    "Misery loves company. Wisdom has to look for it." -- Anonymous

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    Last edited by ERK; 11th May 2015 at 01:48.

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  23. #27
    Senior Member donk's Avatar
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    What's wrong with the way most people look at food? That they do it mindlessly. No idea what it really is or where it came from.

    Think reptilians are like that? Why would we take it so personally then?

    Don't blame "most of the planet". I don't even believe the "most humans" like what you outline...except the porn, of course
    What is the purpose of your presence?

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  25. #28
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    Last edited by ERK; 11th May 2015 at 01:48.

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  27. #29
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    I wonder if reptilians think clowns taste 'funny'.
    "To learn who rules over you simply find out who you are not allowed to criticize" -- Voltaire

    "Great minds discuss ideas; average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people."-- Eleanor Roosevelt

    "Misery loves company. Wisdom has to look for it." -- Anonymous

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    Administrator Aragorn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by donk View Post
    What's wrong with the way most people look at food? That they do it mindlessly. No idea what it really is or where it came from.

    Think reptilians are like that? Why would we take it so personally then?
    There's a difference. Our food isn't capable of having a conversation with us.
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